Black water and peat

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67chevelle

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Jul 30, 2008
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I'm setting up a black water tank for SA dwarfs. I have a ton of oak leaves, a little bit of almond bark, and some peat for the filter. Anyone know how much peat I should add? I plan on putting it in media bags and placing it in the filter. The tank is a 20 long and the filter is a Eheim 2215.
 

Byron Amazonas

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The initial GH of your source water (presumably tap water?) will determine how much tannin is necessary. Obviously you also want the pH acidic, and the KH plus the initial pH will govern this aspect.

These substances require regular replacement as the tannins are used, so it usually helps to dilute (with "pure" water, rainwater being ideal if it is safe to use) the initial water if it is moderately hard.

Byron.
 

67chevelle

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Jul 30, 2008
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You just spent 2 paragraphs not really saying anything I don't already know. I know a few people on the forums like to use scientific formulas to keep fish. I'm not one of those people. And my fish are all just fine.

I have 6 media bags that are 6'' x 10''. Can anyone give me a general idea on how much peat I should start with? If you insist on knowing my PH, GH, and KH, don't bother. I haven't used test kits for years, and wouldn't know where there are at if I wanted to use them. I'm just looking for a starting point right now.
 
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Byron Amazonas

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You just spent 2 paragraphs not really saying anything I don't already know. I know a few people on the forums like to use scientific formulas to keep fish. I'm not one of those people. And my fish are all just fine.

I have 6 media bags that are 6'' x 10''. Can anyone give me a general idea on how much peat I should start with? If you insist on knowing my PH, GH, and KH, don't bother. I haven't used test kits for years, and wouldn't know where there are at if I wanted to use them. I'm just looking for a starting point right now.
Well, I am afraid you will not get much help from members if you are not willing to give us the data necessary in order to answer the question. And it is not very responsible to not know what is coming out of your tap. Fish live in water and its properties substantially affect their physiological processes. This is a scientific hobby, plain and simple, and it doesn't take much effort to fathom the basics. And this is the only certainty to good fish health.

You could put a bag of peat in the filter and if your GH and KH are very high, it would have next to no effect. But in a low GH/KH the effect could be considerable. Then there is the rate at which this becomes exhausted and has to be replaced, again determined by your initial GH/KH.

You don't need test kits for this. The GH and KH of tap water is unlikely to alter, and you can easily ascertain it from the water supply people, usually on their website. This is basic fiskeeping 101. Once you start fiddling with water chemistry as you intend, you can cause a lot of problems if you don't know what you're doing.
 

rufioman

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Aug 16, 2010
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I think he was just trying to relate the fact that if you do peat, almond bark, etc. then you have to replace the stuff that is leeched out into the water. That stuff gets lost during water changes, etc. and whatnot. It alters the chemistry otherwise, to the point that it can harm your fish.

ANYWAYS :rofl:

What type of dwarves?
 

67chevelle

Basset Hound
Jul 30, 2008
2,286
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Well, I am afraid you will not get much help from members if you are not willing to give us the data necessary in order to answer the question. And it is not very responsible to not know what is coming out of your tap. Fish live in water and its properties substantially affect their physiological processes. This is a scientific hobby, plain and simple, and it doesn't take much effort to fathom the basics. And this is the only certainty to good fish health.

You could put a bag of peat in the filter and if your GH and KH are very high, it would have next to no effect. But in a low GH/KH the effect could be considerable. Then there is the rate at which this becomes exhausted and has to be replaced, again determined by your initial GH/KH.

You don't need test kits for this. The GH and KH of tap water is unlikely to alter, and you can easily ascertain it from the water supply people, usually on their website. This is basic fiskeeping 101. Once you start fiddling with water chemistry as you intend, you can cause a lot of problems if you don't know what you're doing.
I have kept fish for quite a few years now. I have thousands of gallons in tanks right now. I'm not some newbie. I'm not as active here as I use to be. But the few posts I have seen from you make you come across as a know it all. Hate to tell ya kiddo, nothing you have posted or asked remotely tried to answer my question. If you can't answer a question, it is best to not respond.
I think he was just trying to relate the fact that if you do peat, almond bark, etc. then you have to replace the stuff that is leeched out into the water. That stuff gets lost during water changes, etc. and whatnot. It alters the chemistry otherwise, to the point that it can harm your fish.

ANYWAYS :rofl:

What type of dwarves?
First of all, I know what water changes do, and it actually changes the water very little. You and the other person who answered seem to get all of your info from web sites and forums. It appears neither of you can answer the question, so it would be best if you two just moved on.
 

Byron Amazonas

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Many of us kept goldfish in one of those bowls, and they lived for several years. That was luck, which is apparently your system. But most of us have learned that this is not good enough. Perhaps the reason I didn't answer your question is because you have no idea what you are asking.

Aside from that, yes, perhaps I should leave this forum. Even after more than 20 years in this hobby in a serious way, I still manage to learn more. I'm sorry there are those who do not share this approach and have no interest in learning and becoming better aquarists. I still do, but it obviously will have to be elsewhere.

Adios.
 

Rbishop

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Dec 30, 2005
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Many of us kept goldfish in one of those bowls, and they lived for several years. That was luck, which is apparently your system. But most of us have learned that this is not good enough. Perhaps the reason I didn't answer your question is because you have no idea what you are asking.

Aside from that, yes, perhaps I should leave this forum. Even after more than 20 years in this hobby in a serious way, I still manage to learn more. I'm sorry there are those who do not share this approach and have no interest in learning and becoming better aquarists. I still do, but it obviously will have to be elsewhere.

Adios.
You have to be kidding me...one person, one post in one thread, doesn't instantly agree with you and has a different approach and you throw your self out of here in some sympathy seeking ego fulfilling reason? Try Tetra Forums.. the young'ins will love you more.
 

Mgamer20o0

BobsTropicalPlants.com
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Jun 4, 2003
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You just spent 2 paragraphs not really saying anything I don't already know. I know a few people on the forums like to use scientific formulas to keep fish. I'm not one of those people. And my fish are all just fine.

I have 6 media bags that are 6'' x 10''. Can anyone give me a general idea on how much peat I should start with? If you insist on knowing my PH, GH, and KH, don't bother. I haven't used test kits for years, and wouldn't know where there are at if I wanted to use them. I'm just looking for a starting point right now.
start slowly with a half bag and work your way up a half a bag at a time. some people pre treat the water with peat so you have a little more control over it.
 

67chevelle

Basset Hound
Jul 30, 2008
2,286
2
38
start slowly with a half bag and work your way up a half a bag at a time. some people pre treat the water with peat so you have a little more control over it.
Perfect. Thank you. The manzanita and almond bark I got from you seems to be making the water nice tea color after a couple of hours. I wasn't planning on adding any peat unless it was needed. I'm going to let things sit overnight and check the PH in the morning. I'm curious to see what it is. Gonna have to find that test kit now....
 
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