450 Gallon Salt Tank Help

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vegasadam

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Hi all, my wife and I have a 142 gallon tank at home and we are only into the hobby about 6 months. My wife's school just purchased a 450 gallon tank for a LOT of money and they are getting the run around from the LFS. Well we have become their hope, god help us all. Anyway here are a few questions if I may.
1. Can / does water get stagnant? They have said that the water has gotten stagnant but has cycled and that they will need to start over. Is this true?
2. They also said that their sand is wrong (I have no idea what that means). What is bad sand, this isnt even play sand rather it is live sand that they got suckered into buying in their all inclusive price.
3. Even though they are starting over with all new water and new sand (if what I asked in question 1 and 2 is correct) why are they putting 3 full size yellow tangs in the tank, Even though this tank which is planned for a reef is large is it ok to have 3 yellow tangs in it?
4. Can you have cleaner shrimp in a reef tank?
Thanks for all your help and letting us and the elementary school lean on you all.
Adam
 
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vegasadam

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I know I havent provided any info on equipment or water parameters but I havent seen the tank yet. Unfortunately I travel a lot for work so I havent been in town. I will see it on Friday and get that info. Thanks again.
Adam
 

Juthunter28

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Well....its gonna put a burden on the rest of the fish in the tank when they are added....i would remove the 3 Yellow Tangs into a separate tank and put plenty of powerheads and a huge sump on that tank and then add a dsb of 5 inches or more and throw 5 cocktail shrimp all around in the tank and let them rot away with some base rock in the tank....then after that make sure the school has adequate lighting....which will be a lot for that tank.....and then add the live rock to the tank.....after thats been in the tank for a few weeks add the clean up crew to get rid of the algae....after thats been done for 2 weeks....add fish....a few every couple of days or a few a week until the tank is full for their Maximum size...then add the 3 tangs...they should be fine in that size tank because ive seen 20 yellow tangs in one tank before so if they are added at the same time they will be fine.....good luck!!! LUCKY SOBS!!!! lol
 

vegasadam

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Thanks for the reply and to clarify the tank is cycled so the cocktail shrimp aren't needed. The LR has been added but will be rearranged. Tank has a DSB of about 3-4 inches and a large sump in there.

Adam
 

Juthunter28

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well then haha....i would just take the tangs out.....put in the rest of the cleaning crew.....put in all REEF SAFE fish they want.....a few every other day or a few a week until tank is full...making sure there is room for the 3 tangs....and then add them back and they should be fine....good luck
 

mogurnda

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Originally posted by vegasadam
Hi all, my wife and I have a 142 gallon tank at home and we are only into the hobby about 6 months. My wife's school just purchased a 450 gallon tank for a LOT of money and they are getting the run around from the LFS. Well we have become their hope, god help us all. Anyway here are a few questions if I may.
Hey Adam, sounds both fun and very challenging!
1. Can / does water get stagnant? They have said that the water has gotten stagnant but has cycled and that they will need to start over. Is this true?
What was the history? How long was it without circulation? I don't get what they mean.
2. They also said that their sand is wrong (I have no idea what that means). What is bad sand, this isnt even play sand rather it is live sand that they got suckered into buying in their all inclusive price.
There are better and worse sands, but rarely is a sand completely wrong. Most prefer sugar-fine playsand, but a lot of stuff will work.
3. Even though they are starting over with all new water and new sand (if what I asked in question 1 and 2 is correct) why are they putting 3 full size yellow tangs in the tank, Even though this tank which is planned for a reef is large is it ok to have 3 yellow tangs in it?
Have they already done this? If not, I'd love to know more about the tank before they gut it and start over. The tangs will be fine in a tank that size, but only once it's established and stable. I am a lot more conservative than Juthunter about adding fish, and would suggest going a bit more slowly. For a tank like this, where treatment of any disease will be extremely challenging, a quarantine tank will save a lot of heartache.
4. Can you have cleaner shrimp in a reef tank?
Scarlet cleaners are great in reef tanks. They clean up a bit, look cool, and make plankton.
Thanks for all your help and letting us and the elementary school lean on you all.
Adam
 

vegasadam

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Jthunter and Dave thanks for the replies. Dave the interesting thing is that the tank has been up and running for about a month with I think 8 powerheads/returns going the whole time. In fact from what I am told it has cycled but with only LR. Thats why I cant understand why they would start over.

The sand from what I can remember is LS from a bag the same stuff I was sold before i understood the whole play sand idea. It looks really nice if you ask me.

My fear is that they paid all up front for the whole tank including the stocking and I just dont want them being taken advantaged of. The LFS is very good at the building of the tank but the husbandry of it all IMO is terrible. Well I will be able to get you guys some readings on friday and yes its a lot of fun tinkering with a 450 gallon tank I just wish it was my own.

Adam
 

Juthunter28

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Well of course i would have a hospital tank....i only suggest doing them quicker because there will be less aggression towards all the fish because they will not have claimed territories in a small period....(read that in my Saltwater Aquariums for Dummies Handbook that i read like its a bible haha...)
 

wayne

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Jthunter and Dave thanks for the replies. Dave the interesting thing is that the tank has been up and running for about a month with I think 8 powerheads/returns going the whole time.<GOOD >In fact from what I am told it has cycled but with only LR.<Better> Thats why I cant understand why they would start over. <The only thing I can think they mean is that they want to do a large water change. That's ok, typically cycling this way will leave al ot of nitrate in the water, which needs to be removed. ALos if you got this info second hand from the school, it could well have been descienced>

The sand from what I can remember is LS from a bag the same stuff I was sold before i understood the whole play sand idea. It looks really nice if you ask me. <No idea,ask them>

My fear is that they paid all up front for the whole tank including the stocking and I just dont want them being taken advantaged of. The LFS is very good at the building of the tank but the husbandry of it all IMO is terrible.<I'm not usre why you think this? What do you think they're done wrong> Well I will be able to get you guys some readings on friday and yes its a lot of fun tinkering with a 450 gallon tank I just wish it was my own.

I'm not sure what really is wrong here. They've cycled the tank withthe live rock , and they want to do a large water change. Now they've added some tangs for algae control? This isn't an unusual story for setting up a large aquarium.
If you're getting your info second hand through the school , get it from the contractors mouth as they will undoubtedly reduce the science level.
 

vegasadam

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Wayne they want to break down the tank and start from scratch. Not a water change but all new water and all new sand. Why I dont like them is that they have sent over some 5 or 6 different people with 5 or 6 different ideas on how to do this tank. I know there are a lot of ways to skin a cat but newbs need consistency and as a LFS they should know this.

Why I think they are better at building tanks than the husbadry is from what a lot of people in the community have said and personal experience. For instance in my 142 gallon they sold me a naso tang and a yellow tang which is a lot of fish for my size tank. (since returned Naso). Also if they are going to start all over new water and sand which they have said why add 3 tangs to the tank as the first of any living creatures to the tank if the water is "bad". LFS reason for this is you paid a lot of money you should have a few fish until we start over. Isnt this thinking bad for the hobby? Plus Tangs dont control diatoms which they have plenty of because they have filled the tank with 450 gallons of tank water and said that they could top off with tapwateras well. To their credit they did say RO/DI was better top off. Finally even though they have there money they cant do all this for another month because their schedule doesnt permit. Again I guess my real question was does cycled water that is being circulated go stagnant? Does the sand go "bad"?
 
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