Mafia 100-The Witches Return-The Game

[AC] chupacabra;2751684 said:

I'm still looking into Rickets (one thing at a time please, I only just got back!) and reserve judgement until I'm done. As for tree... I said I was going to look into them, and my list of people to look into was not in order from "most scummy to least scummy", it was just people as I put the names up.

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I meant to say three people, not two since you had four (including Tree) on your list. So what I was getting at was it still makes no sense why you would include Tree, of all people, with those who you were looking at most.

[AC] narwhal;2751719 said:

Do not think so, anything I say, you will decide implicates someone on that list. I refuse to have a fellow towns person killed because of your ardor to have me lynched.

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[AC] narwhal;2751724 said:

This is so you dont go off all half cocked, I am assuming that I will be wrong about someone on my list, I have not made perfect yet. I realized upon rereading that my thought was not written as well as I would have liked.

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You haven't indicated any suspects other than Wiz this entire game. It's this refusal to give us anything that is making you look scummy.

Your suspect list wont get anyone lynched. That is a horrible excuse. If you're innocent then I'll look at those who hopped on the Nar train. If you're scum, then maybe it will implicate someone on your list. If that is the case then your hesitation is invalid anyways.

[AC] chupacabra;2751731 said:

This post will have been quite the work in the making. I wish you (and me) luck and understanding it, and make no promises to it's focus, as I generally change my mind as fast as a fat kid eats fries...



So.... They were going after wiz from the start. *begins rapid revisions of his thoughts on Tree* Still doesn't clear you yet though.


Wonder why no one noticed that C-Note voted Tree after they voted wizard? Since people DID read back, I'm surprised it hasn't been said already.

By the end of Day 1, Rickets had barely posted at all. In fact, they posted about the same number of times as wizard did.

At this point in the game (post 194) HH seemed pretty dead set that Doom and Wing were evil.

Post 211: Hammer asks Doom what vote switch he would have been comfortable with. Post 216: Doom skirts past the question by saying he doesn't like it, but understands why it was done. Only when pressed for an answer did Doom answer the actual question.

Narwall isn't making big or showy or impressive posts like some others. Seems to be a trend of theirs.

Post 337, Rickets finally comes back into the game. Just says he won't UD, gives an excuse, and promises to participate more in the game.

Nem, why were you so angry at me for asking for lists (to bring back a sore topic)? Oh, and later on you made a very sarcastic post. I don't like sarcasm. Not one bit. Can you attempt to be mature and restrain yourself from using it? Sarcasm just makes me want to leaves the games again.

So, now I must ask a question: Hammerhead, when did you stop thinking Doomsday was evil, if ever, and why?

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A few of things...

If you didn't realize until recently that Tree was the first person to go after Wiz then you must be playing a different game.

The Cnote vote on Tree has been discussed. What do you think started the argument between me and HH? Also, I even mentioned it when I explained my thoughts on everyone in post 472.

If you read what I was actually saying in response to Tree's questions you'll see what I was attempting to explain. I still don't understand why Tree dragged the questioning on and on but that is beside the point right now. I find it odd that you're even bringing this up right now.

[AC] RICKETS;2751737 said:

The scumden's looking pretty grim tonight, isn't it Wingnut?

I vote to burn Wingnut at the stake.

Obvious choice based on all that has posted. I agree with the case against Wing and don't see a compelling defense from them. Plenty has already been established to solidify my suspicion towards Wing so that's what I'm going with.

With that out of the way, I should list my other top suspects........ namely, Nemesis and Doom. I've already posted my comments about Nemesis. When I asked Doom to comment about my vote post earlier, I wasn't all the interested what they would say about me. I was very interested, however, how they would comment about Nemesis. I found those comments from Doom to be weak.

Incidentally, I've read the comments Wingnut and Chup have exchanged with some interest. While I was away from the thread today, I wondered more about what can be gleaned from N1 and N2 vote counts. This is what I noticed....

Wiz was high priest and while he was scum I still believe he played with limited time. The very first game-related post was from Wiz where he parked a random vote on Chup and disappeared for the rest of the day.

I don't imagine Wiz as evil high scum priest would have parked his vote like that on a fellow teammate, knowing he would not return for a long time and would not be in contact with the scumden while he gone. Mild distancing from a scummate from the very git-go would have required a bit more finesse in the game than I believe Wiz is known for. Wiz is anything but subtle when it comes to mafia.

I'll admit this is playing the odds, somewhat, but this small detail gives us a better-than-average chance that Chup is innocent. Anyway It's enough for me to lean Chup that way for now. And if that is true, it follows we should examine others who've been pointing us against Chup. Glancing through the N1 and N2 vote tally the names which stick out the most other than Wiz are Nemesis and Doom.

Day 1 - Wiz placed the first game vote on Chup and left it there. Day 2 - Nemesis held their vote on Chup until they were the last to (reluctantly) switch their vote to Wizard. Doom voted Chup.

Something to watch for later in the game.... if Wiz, Wing, Nem, and Doom all turn out to be scum, I doubt Chup is their teammate.

Taking a look at what posted today, I saw Wingnut is next in line to vote Chup. Ha... big surprise there. I can't imagine anything else Wingnut could have done to confirm the suspicion he has drawn from all of us than that. I also found this to be one more supporting point to the idea I was kicking around to lean Chup a townie based on Wiz's Day 1 vote.

Again, more on Doom....... from earlier in the thread, Doom made a post in disagreement with Hammer that one of the votes on Tree were there to protect Wiz. Looking at those three votes again, who do we find? Wingnut. I believe Doom made that post to draw attention away from their scummate Wingnut.

At this point, the ties between scum seem to fit quite well. I look forward to the witch-burning tomorrow night.

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To comment on the things I highlighted...

First, you essentially suspect me because I didn't agree with you about Nem. I think I made a fair assessment of your vote. I could see why you looked at Nem and voted there BUT I didn't think the evidence was damning enough to move either of you to my suspect list.

Second, I understand how it may seem like I defended Wing at first...but do you really think I would make it look like I was defending Wiz AND wing? Not to mention right when Wiz flipped scum I turned around and pointed at three people who voted him. Wing was one of them.

[AC] chupacabra;2751742 said:

I am now inclined, like most people I'm sure, to lean Tree innocent. Not that I would ever write it in stone -these are the mafia games after all- and I'm not going to follow tree like a lost dog, but I do think they have the towns interests at heart.

Rickets... you remind me of Rich, hard to pin anything on you and more often quiet then talkative.

Narwal hasn't posted much, and contributed less. I'm curious about their intentions, as they haven't made them entirely clear (at least I don't think so).

Chongo... sucks that you're leaving, but I would rather have someone pull out then UD unespectedly or not participate and end up the lynch for it.

Star-Crossed hasn't done much to get my attention, so I'll just leave them be for now.

HH, you are like a shark homing in on it's prey. Except without the feeding frenzy. I think you're innocent, but would like to know when Doom left your radar and scum list.

Doom. What can I say? I won't clear you, but I can no longer call you a high-likelyhood scum.

Wing, you have done scummy things, and I am starting to see you as evil. However, I will refrain from voting for you until later.

C-Note... his vote on Tree on day one could have been an attempt at defending Wizard. Cant get much of a read on you yet either.

If I've left anyone out, its cause I can't think of anything to say about them. It's 11pm here, so I'm going to bed. Cyall tomorrow.

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What made you change your mind? In the post I quoted you referenced my back and forth with Tree and said I was dodging questions. Now I'm not scummy?

Not to mention this list is almost pure fluff.

[AC] RICKETS;2751806 said:

I retract my vote on Wingnut.

It was unnecessary for you to come out, Hammer. I wish you had waited.

That said it allows me to reveal another reason that made me suspect Nemesis. This is actually what prompted me to review all of Nem's posts when I did...... it was Nem's reaction to Hammer being certain not only that Wiz was scum but to also name his role as high priest. No townie with any passing understanding of this game would have posted so strong a reaction to Hammer's post, IMO.

Now I'm torn having to decide whether I'll vote Nemesis or Doom.... those being the two I suspect most. Overall, I'd say Doom is more treacherous of the two and probably more crafty. I guess I'll go with that.

I vote to burn Doom at the stake.

Hammer, pulling our votes off a confirmed witch goes totally against the grain and I hate doing it. I've seen the town get skunked attempting such a plan too many times before. Talk it over a little more and make absolutely sure you want this. I don't know who the warlock is or how well they can be trusted. How will we know if they comply with our request to turn Wing instead of acting on their own? I don't expect Lady G will confirm Wing was actually turned from witch to townie for us.

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I'd like to know what about Nem's reaction to HH's post indicates they are scum.

And I'm flattered that you think I would be a bigger threat to the town. The good thing is that I am not.

[AC] RICKETS;2751839 said:

Lady G, please confirm two things for us?

1. Is the warlock a neutral player or part of the innocent side? (Just to make sure since no one has asked specifically.)

2. Has the warlock already cast their Day 3 spell and, if so, are they allowed to change it?

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I find it interesting that when I first pointed out that the Warlock was a town role you had no problems with it...now you do? Is it because you then tried to get people to doubt Tree?

[AC] narwhal;2752007 said:

If HH is telling the truth then it is likely that Wing is a witch.

As for the warlock's spell a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, there is always room for something to go amiss. The warlock may not cooperate, he might fall asleep and forget, he may get burnt at the stake tonight many things are possible. General Custer thought he had them right where he wanted them too.

As for a top three, I do really have one. I am still debating whom I should vote for.

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An innocent should be more behind the idea that lynching someone other than wing is best for the town.

If an innocent is lynched tonight we gain an innocent by turning Wing. So even in the even that people are wrong about who to lynch we are not in a horrible situation.

In terms of learning about the other scum it is the far better option. Everyone piling on Wing gets us nowhere tomorrow.

The way I interpret the rules the spell has to be cast. There is a very low chance that it wont be used on wing. The only legitimate claim is that the warlock is accidentally lynched. I highly doubt the Warlock is going to be lynched without putting up a fight

[AC] scoop411;2752012 said:

Doom that's right up there with Ricketts. We should do it but can we trust them after they're turned? Scum often like to agree while sowing seeds of doubt.

We all play to win. When we turn - we play to win for the new team. To suggest otherwise is nonsense.

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How is that not a legitimate concern? We don't know whether or not wing is going to play their new role or not. I don't doubt there are players that would say "screw it" and continue playing as if they are scum. Do you think they are going to turn around and feed us their teammates name by name? I wouldn't in their situation. That's a horrible way to win the game.

I think it needs to be discussed before wing starts posting tomorrow after being turned.

I vote to burn Nar at the stake

It's worse than pulling teeth trying to get anything substantial out of them.

My revised list is now Nar, Chup, BH and Rickets...obviously we pretty much know wing is scum right now. That amounts to probably more scum than we started out with but it's who I am most concerned about.

Lady G said:

It will show at night, for final vote count.

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Lady G said:

Yes, it takes effect when I get it. With two of them effecting the voting I didn't see how it would work in the nightly events.

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LG, is the person notified when the spell is cast that their vote will count as double?

Has everyone voted? Besides being obnoxious, I am lazy. Not a good combination at all.

LG, if a player is turned, are they allowed to share what they know with their new team. Also, if one is turned (either way), please verify that this is not optional. It is part of the game. There could be a spell that turns hammer into a witch, no matter how much they were trying to find and kill witches, hammer would have to be a witch. Would hammer be compelled to tell his new team who their partner was? If a witch gets turned, are they allowed to say who else is a witch? I like games where players get turned. I am not sure what are the rules in this game as far as turns go.

[AC] Tree_Hugger;2751933 said:

So Rickets, maybe you trust me 60/40 or 70/30. So where do you stand on nar? They seem to have some heat on them. You might have posted before, but do you have nar leaning innocent. I think you want to see doom and nem go first. I wonder what doom will think of this plan. Is this plan a mistake? If you were the warlock, who would you cast the spell on?

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1. Yeah, something like that. I messed up over the timing of the spells. That made me worry you might be pulling a fast one on us but I was wrong. There you go Tree, I was wrong. (It should please you to read that. lol.) For that matter and standing corrected about the spell timing, you can raise the trust factor a little higher than 70/30. I will add that I believe I know who you are which added to my level of distrust in your regard. That will make more sense after the game ends and we can reveal our identities.

2. On Nar, I was undecided. I've had them neutral or leaning scummy but I haven't been leaning them innocent thus far. I do suspect both Doom and Nem more than Nar, though, for the reasons I've posted about previously. Just now I've read Nar's most recent posts and those definitely read like scum under pressure. That tips the balance enough to justify voting them. Right now, I'm thinking about that. I don't know what the post count is but I think I've got a lone vote on Doom right now which doesn't do us a lot of good, actually.

3. No question..... if I was the warlock I'd cast my spell on wingnut.