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Emergency...sort of

Discussion in 'Coldwater Illness and Disease' started by ian2mic, Nov 6, 2010.

  1. ian2mic

    ian2mic AC Members

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    1. What is the size of your tank?
    55G

    2. What are your water parameters? State the brand of test kit used.
    I have an API liquid test kit, I didn't write the numbers down when I tested the other day but everything was perfect. Normal and safe.

    3. Is your aquarium set up freshwater or brackish water?
    Slightly brackish at the moment as I added 1 1/2 C of aquarium salt last week. I have done 25% water change since then so has a bit less salt now.

    4. How long the aquarium has been set up?
    5-6 years??

    5. What fish do you have? How many are in your tank? How big are they? How long have you had them?
    Common goldfish (mix of some sort, he has a fancy tail) 8-10" long, about 10 years old. Tankmates: tiny Otocat, small lory-? catfish (don't remember the name)

    6. Were the fish placed under quarantine period (minus the first batch from the point wherein the tank is ready to accommodate the inhabitants)?
    n/a, no new fish introduced in 2-3 years

    7. What temperature is the tank water currently?
    78-80 F

    8. Are there live plants in the aquarium?
    no

    9. What filter are you using? State brand, maintenance routine and power capacity.
    Marineland Canister filled with bio-balls, ceramic rings, white fluffy stuff, baggie filled with activated carbon (was removed during treatment)

    10. Any other equipment used (aside from heater and filter which are two very important components of the tank)?
    Air pump

    11. Does your aquarium receive natural sunlight at any given part of the day? What is your lighting schedule (assuming you do not rely on sunlight for our viewing pleasure)?
    no natural sunlight, hood lights are turned on during day, and off at night.

    12. When did you perform your last water change and how much water was changed? How often do you change your water? Do you vacuum the substrate?
    Wednesday was last water change of 25-30%, I am currently doing biweekly changes with gravel vacuum.

    13. What foods do you provide your fish? What is the feeding schedule?
    We feed him Omega One goldfish pellets (soaked) every evening

    14. What unusual signs have you observed in your fish?
    Over a period of several months: Red spot, veiny fins, cloudy eye, increased breathing, lethargy, swim bladder issues, fin rot

    15. Have you treated your fish ahead of diagnosis? If so, what treatments did you use? State your reasons for planning ahead of proper diagnosis.

    We've tried peas when he's having difficulty swimming, doesn't really help. Soaking food helps though

    Months ago, I tried a fungus cure because his ulcer? looked like it had a fungal infection. The fungus went away but ulcer didn't

    Tried 2 courses of Melafix, neither helped at all.

    Recently I tried Furan-2, it seemed to help for the 4 days it was in the water. But right after putting the carbon back in, the fish started turning vertical again and isn't healing as fast. Should I do another course or does anyone have another suggestion?

    All of his symptoms seem bacterial to me, hence the treatment with bacterial cures.

    Any more questions?? I'm labeling this emergency because this is the 3rd forum I've posted in and I guess my problem is so common that no one wants to offer any help. The biggest response I got back was suggestions for swim bladder issues. This is only a symptom so I need an overall treatment suggestion.

    Thanks for your help!!
     
  2. Rbishop

    Rbishop ...and over the edge.
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    Mr. Normal
    Some pics would be nice, if possible.

    Adding aquarium slat does not make your tank brackish.

    A 10 yr old common goldie should be bigger than 10" and a 55 gallon tank is way to small for one. Sounds like an old fish that is suffering from being stunted.

    Exact readings would help...what is perfect to you may be unacceptable to others.

    Water changes on a goldie in a small tank should be more on the order of 50% weekly minimum.
     
  3. ian2mic

    ian2mic AC Members

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    Ok, here's some pics. The last two are old pics showing him very healthy. He's very difficult to photograph. In the second one you can see where the red spot WAS, it really is healing great, it's barely noticeable today. I think the Furan did the trick, I just wonder if doing one more course if overkill.

    I'm going to have to disagree on his size. I can't find proof anywhere that a common goldfish (reminder...he can't be fully "common") would be bigger than him at his age. But if you can't point me to documentation on that I'll be happy to consider it.
    I have considered relocating him to a pond somewhere but I fear for his tail. I do not think he would make it in a pond with those kind of fins.

    P1290159.JPG P1290155.JPG Goldfish pretty 2.JPG bee you tiful tail swish.JPG
     
  4. Rbishop

    Rbishop ...and over the edge.
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    Pretty fish...doesn't look like a common though. Maybe a veil tail variation...also doesn't appear to have a 10" body length at all. What is normally considered a commom is a comet...they can easily hit 12-16" when given proper care and adequate size tank, and more preferably a pond, in 5-8 years.
     
    #4 Rbishop, Nov 6, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2010
  5. ian2mic

    ian2mic AC Members

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    Thanks, yeah, that's why I mentioned it wasn't really a common. I was counting tail in my measurement...didn't realize you would want body length, duh, lol
     
  6. msjinkzd

    msjinkzd AC Members

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    I am goign to move this to the goldfish illness section.


    Just from reading your description above, I think it would really help out if you increased your maintenance routine. Goldies are big mess makers and at least weekly water changes of 40% or so woud probably help out a lot.


    From your description, it certainly sounds bacterial to me. I would guess its septicemia. I would treat with the maracyn combo.
     
  7. ian2mic

    ian2mic AC Members

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    I will increase maintenance, I agree, I've been lazy. Should I treat with the Maracyn combo so soon after the Furan-2?
     
  8. RiVerfishgirl

    RiVerfishgirl AC Members

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    Since you have an API test kit, could you retest and post actual results? The definition of "perfect" varies from person to person.
    Did you test all of these?: Ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH?

    What you describe does sound bacterial. I agree with mjinkzed as far as the course of action that was suggested.

    Personally for persistant infections I tend to use tri sulfa, but this WILL kill your biological bacteria (though I feel this is a risk with most antibiotic meds, so it's best to use them in quarantine), so should not be used in your main tank.

    That is on the high end for a goldfish. They do prefer cooler water and in water of that temperature long term may be more prone to illness. It also may cut short their life span.

    The fish in question is a comet (long forked tail). Not a veil tail because the veil tail must meet specific set standards (split tail and not forked for example). By definition this fish is not a common because a common goldfish does not have altered finnage, but they are the same species and body type, and other than the tail length can reach the same size (not counting the tail).
    This doesn't mean that if the fish does not reach the species max possible size there is something wrong since not all fish will reach max recorded size and in fact most will not, even given proper water conditions. A 10" comet is not necessarily stunted from poor water quality and improper housing, even though this may very well be the case.
     
  9. ian2mic

    ian2mic AC Members

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    I'm sorry I haven't been able to get back online sooner. Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 20, I did not test PH.

    I can lower the temp...he always seemed more active, brighter, overall seemed healthier with the temp a bit warmer.
     
  10. Reframer

    Reframer AC Members

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    I would definitely get the temp down to around 72. Higher temps will make a fish more active, but it will also stress a goldfish who needs cold water. For the next 2 weeks, try doing water changes evey other day and that may be enough to get him going.
    The other thing is that goldies need a varied diet, you can't feed them too much protein or they get constipated and lay on the bottom. Try feeding a deshelled pea.
     

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