Mafia #67 - 50/50 -- The Play

[jpappy789]

Ice, I would like an explanation as to why you are reluctant to vote FF. You called Lab out early for saying she would vote FF but didn't...you did the same thing but gave a reason...apparently because he screwed himself over? I don't see why that is a reason to not place a vote, especially a retractable one.

I don't like how Kash is calling the FF vote a safe place already. That automatically makes someone second guess voting there for fear of looking scummy. I also don't like how she has suggested that FF screwed up and is being unhelpful, but never has called him suspicious or scummy flat out. She mentions that she is considering the vote (but wants to wait) and has been talking about how she could/would cut FF loose early if on the same team...it's curious, to say the least. All this talk about FF and how she would react but nothing direct about the scummy things he has said...

 

[jbradt]

The FF vote sure seems tempting. Asking to be investigated and then hinting at a communicating role not only is contradictory but scummy. I mean, look at post #59...he flat out answers Lab that he is trying to RC as a CI. Really, FF? That nervous about getting a scum role again? I highly doubt either team is going to want to investigate him now with all the attention, not to mention he's an early favorite for the lynch.

I vote to lynch FF

Ice, I would like an explanation as to why you are reluctant to vote FF. You called Lab out early for saying she would vote FF but didn't...you did the same thing but gave a reason...apparently because he screwed himself over? I don't see why that is a reason to not place a vote, especially a retractable one.

I don't like how Kash is calling the FF vote a safe place already. That automatically makes someone second guess voting there for fear of looking scummy. I also don't like how she has suggested that FF screwed up and is being unhelpful, but never has called him suspicious or scummy flat out. She mentions that she is considering the vote (but wants to wait) and has been talking about how she could/would cut FF loose early if on the same team...it's curious, to say the least. All this talk about FF and how she would react but nothing direct about the scummy things he has said...

Pappy, you and Labby both seem pretty sure about FF and the scumminess of his posts. I'm going back through now to really read instead of skimming the thread at work, so I'm making up my own mind, but I would love, just for the record to see a summary of your case against him.

 

[jbradt]

Does FF ever not bare watching? I just can't bare to read his posts lol.

Why do people say they would vote so and so but don't? That always bothers me. If you think you would vote someone then why not vote them. You can always retract. Only reason I can think to not vote someone you tell you would vote is so there isn't a vote tally record of who you were after.

Ice... I think Pappy mentioned this post earlier. Here is where you call out Labby for saying she'd vote for FF but didn't. I've got a couple issues with this. First, I've heard many players say this. I've said it myself, and I understand the mentality behind saying it. Why do you find this odd? Second, just because there is no vote tally does not mean there is no record of her statement. Something seems off with the logic I've come to expect from you.

 

[Kashta]

Ice, I would like an explanation as to why you are reluctant to vote FF. You called Lab out early for saying she would vote FF but didn't...you did the same thing but gave a reason...apparently because he screwed himself over? I don't see why that is a reason to not place a vote, especially a retractable one.

I don't like how Kash is calling the FF vote a safe place already. That automatically makes someone second guess voting there for fear of looking scummy. I also don't like how she has suggested that FF screwed up and is being unhelpful, but never has called him suspicious or scummy flat out. She mentions that she is considering the vote (but wants to wait) and has been talking about how she could/would cut FF loose early if on the same team...it's curious, to say the least. All this talk about FF and how she would react but nothing direct about the scummy things he has said...

Pappy, I'm concerned about FF too. But I'm also concerned about what looks to be a runaway train forming on one person... day 1. Also the fact that both Mad and Ice named him as scummy (or something like that) but withheld their votes.

Also, after going after Noodles so fast and so hard last game (which wasn't any fun)... I'm relucant to pick someone to vote early on with so little else going on yet in this game. While I agree with most of what was said and that it seems scummy as heck... I also wonder if this is an approach the mafia wants the town to take.

 

[Kashta]

"and that it seems scummy as heck... "

^^ Reference there to FF's posting.

 

[jbradt]

Ice's statement:

Under the Kashta quote it should have said:

This almost looks like mafia giving mafia advice.

Kash's reply:

Almost? Okay, perhaps it does on the surface. But if you think it through, your suggestion doesn't make sense. Also...if we're both mafia together and communicating (otherwise I wouldn't know it yet)... I'm fairly sure I'd kill him off early. I suspect JB has a lot more patience dealing with him as a teammate than I would have. Besides, in that scenario we'd have a communicating board I could use to ask him to STFU directly. Thus, no need to post that here.

Even if we're innocent communicating, I'd still be tempted to kill him off because his nonsense posts are distracting. I agree with Mad (and those already voting him)........ FF is being unhelpful.

If we're non-communicating good and non-communicating evil...then I wouldn't know he's even a teammate. Same is true if one of us is communicating and the other is non-communicating (either being town or scum).

Think that covers each of the options available.

Ice, how exactly does my comment almost seem like mafia advising mafia? I'm not seeing your logic there.



DD, same question for you...

How exactly does my comment almost seem like mafia advising mafia? I'm not seeing your logic there (either).

That said, I also believe FF is the safest Day 1 vote in town if you're someone looking to vote someone for a defensible reason AND not worry too much that your vote will be held against you later on if he flips innocent.

Kash, I know from last game, and I believe it was mentioned pretty clearly in the sign up thread that FF can't access the scumden board from home. Being this is the weekend, it stands to reason that you wouldn't be able to tell him anything outside the thread. This argument holds no water.

I agree with this statement 100%. I was being honest with what I said last game. I don't know if FF is good or scum. But I can't tell from his posting; especially day 1. After a couple days, when I've got a million data points to look at, I'll be willing to take a harder look at him. For now, I'm only pretty sure he's not communicating at this point. I agree that FF is not being helpful, but it's only about 15 hours into the game. If you want to find someone who hasn't been overwhelmingly helpful... throw a rock.

These early day 1 votes for the biggest X factor in the game, while somewhat understandable; disturb me a little. Add to this that if FF is communicating evil... he's bound to do quite a lot of good for the town along the way. :footinmouth:

 

[jbradt]

This early on day 1 it is premature to vote and I do not tend to place a vote unless I am pretty confident with where I'm placing it. I do know I can retract, and I often have. But that one statement alone, as of now, is not enough for me to place my vote on him.

Pappy, you and Labby both seem pretty sure about FF and the scumminess of his posts. I'm going back through now to really read instead of skimming the thread at work, so I'm making up my own mind, but I would love, just for the record to see a summary of your case against him.

I'd like to hear your answer to this question too, Labby.

 

[jbradt]

^^^ Sorry, the quote from Labby got in there from another line of thinking. Please disregard.

 

[jbradt]

Two things:
1) Its spring break got nothing else to do and was jokeing (sort of)
2) What makes you so sure im not on a communicating team? Only a member of a communicating team would know im not on it and even then i may be the SB (i wish) or a townie guy. AND if you are mafia feel free to invest me, then we can see how many people vote for me and when, cause i am not mafia (i wish i was thought, they have the most fun).

I'm going to attempt to push the [Translate FF to english] button.

1) FF, If you are really a non-communicating innocent (which is what I interpret this to mean) please remember to use your stickies. Labby is right that "mass posting" is only going to hurt your team.

2) Ok. I think this is what Labby is using as her basis that FF asked mafia to invest him, therefore he must be mafia. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I see FF implying that Labby is communicating because she seems to know he isn't. I interpret the second part as saying that if the mafia investigates him, they will vote for him; and he thinks this will point out mafia.

FF please correct me if I'm wrong.

Please keep in mind that I'm not saying any of this is true, it's just that I see a lot of either miscommunication or word twisting going on. Labby and Jpap seem to have changed the meaning of FF's post. At least the way I read it.

 

[Lab_Rat]

I'd like to hear your answer to this question too, Labby.

Well, for starters, asking mafia to investigate you is just plain scummy. Why would he have done this, other than he wants to join their communicating team? He tried to nullify what he said when it was pointed out, claiming he wanted both teams to investigate him. This makes no sense. As day 1 goes, that's pretty scummy. As I questioned him further I asked him if he was trying to role claim as a communicating innocent when he mentioned he could be a communicator. He said he was, then retracted. With as many scum as are out there, I think there is a good chance FF is one of them. It's why he has earned my vote. Obviously I am looking at everyone, but he sticks out as scummiest so far. Tell me JB, how is asking mafia to investigate you not scummy?