Bio-tank Self sustaining life.

[Margit]

:y220e: Yes! I saw this the other day.. It's amazing! It has so little water in the bottom and I think he mentioned he has 2 guppies in there and frogs who eat the guppy fry! (a little too complex for me) guppies are reserved in our mind as a possible fish we might add but I think they're too big and will create too much byproduct for the plants and cleaners to take care of.

Hi,

if you select wild guppies (feeder guppies) instead of the fancier ones, it would work. They are smaller, manage to find their food among the algae and plant roots and are incredibly resilient to whatever fluctuations you have in your tank. And if you place a cyperus in the tank, there's nothing that plant can't handle. you can plant it in a plastic wastepaper basket (soil and clay). Within a few weeks, the roots will completely hide the basket and provide a habitat for all sorts of organisms. Just one cyperus kept the water in my small pond clear - and there were hundreds of guppies in there.

 

[Mgamer20o0]

doesnt happen so often when most people agree with this. if you were in a place where you could keep it out side you would have better luck. you sure wouldnt want to go with anything that would breed and over run the tank.

if you had it out side at least it would have insect larva to help with a food source.

 

[hage0245]

This is a very interesting thread.....at first I thought most people would scorn the idea but I'm very surprised and happy that there have been so many good ideas thrown around. I have none, haha. But I'm hooked, I hope you keep us posted on your plans and how everything goes. Good luck, I hope 30 gallons is enough!

 

[aussie pride]

I have had mosquito fish in a 10g styrafoam (box without the lid) with some anacharis and whatever fell and grew in the box. I had it running for about 7 months and the mosquito fish population went from 4 to about 10 or 12. I had no filter, no heater, no water changes (only top-ups) and no feeding. The only feeding was mosquito larva, micro bugs and algae. I sat it on my back patio away from the dogs and direct sunlight. This experiment could work IMO.

 

[ryukin_5]

I think we can too! Thanks for your encouragement!
There are a lot of other people on other forums that seem to be pretty picky aquarium keepers telling us it's impossible, but if it can happen in nature, surely it can happen on a small scale. I personally think the key is to make sure any alterations you make are small scale and extremely slow. I would probably wait months after introducing a new element before adding another so that the ecology can make appropriate adjustments. If I think of this as actual nature, any drastic change (or too many at once) will completely disrupt it's balance.

The key would be; introduce by small increments, then wait for it to meet equilibrium again.

I would do it in a larger tank, but we just don't have the space for it unfortunately.

i think thats kinda what happened in my case ..... slow and gradual progression .
1.however the idea that if you plant it hevily at once and allow that to get established should help much
2.if also you can leave it uncoverd i think this would facilitate for nature doing what it does.
3.the shrimp thing sounds good too..


well alot of things i have read in this thred sounds like it can work so i would be inclined to try some hope you are ....

one set back i see is that it is going to be indoors my tub was outside so like everyone else that has sugested might be chalanging there.

again good luck...

 

[Reignbow]

I think it will be a mistake going with mostly organic substrate. Doesn't matter how many trumpet snails you go with it's still going to rot.... (insert a bunch of useful info here)

I was going to use some sand blasted lizard perch branches I have, but I could get some willow too. Yeah I live in Canada, we get feet and feet of snow. I am going to shovel a bunch into a giant rubbermaid bin I have. I know the PH will be very low... but I am not going to add any fish for many months, if not a year after the tank is planted. It should be plenty of time for things to balance out. Chopping a hole in any ice is not a possibility here. Creeks and ponds freeze solid. I could get out an ice fishing auger and bore through 10 inches of ice on the river, but I don't think I want to use river water. I can even fill the rubber maid 4 or 5 times to let the snow melt.
No, I can't heat it.. It's breaking the rules by interveining. I am thinking after I've had the planted tank with pond life for a long while (hopefully the PH will balance it's self out) will I ad fish. I will make a note of the fish you mentioned and see if they're supplied in my city. (I know the tank I showed has added technology. I was just trying to show how I plan to arrainge and grow the java moss around branches that stick out of the top.
Using a clay substraight is actually even better, there are lots of natural clays found locally here. It will be easier to create the slope from front to back with it than soil.
I will definatey make sure I get cherry shrimp.
Thank's for the awesome tips!

if you were in a place where you could keep it out side you would have better luck.

one set back i see is that it is going to be indoors my tub was outside so like everyone else that has sugested might be chalanging there.

again good luck...

Unfortunately that would effect it's equilibrium. I live in such a cold hostile winter climate that I would have to bring it indoors over winter. That would change the amount of available food, and the temperature which would change the ecosystem and chemistry of the entire thing. Winters here often reach -40 C/F.. that would freeze it solid. I'm sure the microbes and natural bacteria could handle it seeing as they recover in nature here every thaw... but the guppies and flora would die since I am not using native flora.

I am going to go with a pair of guppies, a small breed or feeder. If I go with non feeders, I will be sure they're fry because I want them to adapt to foraging and not hand feedings.

I am being told elsewhere that it might be a good idea to put petemoss under the clay from another source.

Ok so!

-30 gallon tank
-clay/sand/pebbles and stone substraight on an incline
-Sand blasted lizard perches and branches wrapped in java moss
-Asian bamboo (with leaves above the water)
-A happy stone Buddha in the front (for a little Zen ^_^)
-Precipitation water to almost fill the tank
-a litre of pond water/gunk

Let sit and wait for algae bloom before adding:

- Malaysian trumpet snails (soil aeration)
- Other algae cleaning snails (opinions on types?)
- Black worms (opinions on these?)
- Cherry shrimp

[I will be adding the above critters in small amounts to allow them to populate them selves. I will also take samples of tank water for micro critter population (pond life) to view progress under my microscope and monitor Ph levels]

let sit and wait for self stabilization

- when Ph levels are good - add a few feeder/small guppy fry (some will live, some will die - natural bio cycle will turn deaths into critter food/flora nutrients)

[Continue to monitor life weekly - including Ph levels and microscopic pond life samples, top up evaporation with precip water]

Long post, sorry. Any other tips?

Reign.

 

[nonamesleft47]

I meant using live willow branches (weeping, corkscrew, scrub willow, doesn't matter) as a way to export waste from the tank. Saltwater guys use mangrove in a similar way. You can just cut the branches off a live tree and start them in water. They will sprout roots and leaves at the top.
I would also add pond snails and ramshorns as well. I keep a type of native snail in my tanks, kind of a giant trumpet. If you weren't in the big white north I could send you some. They are detris and algae grazers and will burrow in light substrate.
The java moss will work well. Once things warm up I would try to collect wild algaes to add to the mix.

 

[RisiganL.]

I wouldn't add the blackworms. They prefer cool water shallow water, and a 30g is far to deep. I think after the tank seems to be up and running properly, you could add either mosquito fish or least killies. These fish can basically live in mud, so they are a good choice for your tank.

 

[Hurley]

I didn't see anywhere in the rules that it needs to be in an aquarium. Just build a pond outside? lol Just kidding...kinda....

But, if you do go forward with this, be sure to document it and take lots of pictures. I'd love to see how everything turns out.

 

[user_name]

if you could top off water changes with normal tapwater than yes it is possible. You'll want to get lots of plants and look into the walstad method. I would be sure that they will ACTUALLY pay you the 1000 bucks first, this could get expensive.