Beware!!!

[beviking]

I had a similar instance where I could smell and taste the chlorine in our tap water to the point I contacted the local water authority. I was told that chlorine dissipates slower in colder temps. Oddly, they were out to test the water in our area (not my house) and within 2 days, the water was back to "normal".
Pool supply places sell chlorine test kits too but I'm not sure how low the readings go or increments.
Chlorine bound with ammonia (chloramine) is more stable, it doesn't dissipate or break down as readily as chlorine. Aerating a bucket of water with chlorine over 24hrs will off-gas the chlorine, not so with chloramine.
MrPpers, sounds like you may have a faulty test kit. I don't know if the ammonia should test positive if chloramines are present, but it should after the dechlorinator is added and breaks the chlorine-ammonia bond that is chloramine.
Amquel and the like bind the ammonia so it is non-toxic to the fish. The test kits will still detect it but it's non-toxic. You're correct to assume the kit is useless if using such products.
Roan, I just noticed your post count vs. your join date! I hope you have an ergonomic chair and a good masseuse!!!

 

[Roan Art]

. . .MrPpers, sounds like you may have a faulty test kit. I don't know if the ammonia should test positive if chloramines are present, but it should after the dechlorinator is added and breaks the chlorine-ammonia bond that is chloramine.
Amquel and the like bind the ammonia so it is non-toxic to the fish. The test kits will still detect it but it's non-toxic. You're correct to assume the kit is useless if using such products.

It really depends on the testing method the kit uses. Most of the low end ones use the Nessler 1 part test which cannot distinguish between ammonia and ammonium.

The Aquarium Pharm master test kit uses Nessler, which is why we see ammonia after treating chloramine tap water. They apparently make a "2 step salicylate" test that can distinguish between them, but I've never seen it myself.

I have a new ammonia test kit coming from SeaChem that sounds interesting:

"This kit measures total (NH3 and NH4+) and free ammonia (NH3 only) down to 0.05 mg/L and is virtually interference free in marine and fresh water. Free ammonia is the toxic form of ammonia (vs. ionized Ammonia NH4+ which is non-toxic) and thus it is much more important to keep an eye on the level of free ammonia in your system. This kit is based on the same gas exchange technology that is used in the Ammonia Alert™ and thus is the only kit on the market that can read levels of free ammonia while using ammonia removal products such as Prime™, Safe™, AmGuard™ and any similar competing products. The other kits (salicylate or Nessler based) determine the total ammonia by raising the pH of the test solution to 12 or greater. At this high pH all ammonia removal products will breakdown and rerelease the ammonia, thus giving you a false ammonia reading. "​

Roan, I just noticed your post count vs. your join date! I hope you have an ergonomic chair and a good masseuse!!!

Is this your Sophomoric way of telling me I have too much to say? :joke:

Roan

 

[MrPpers]

My Aquarium Pharm kit is a 2 part reagent test not a singel solution kit. There is no way its bad. I also have another set of the same test and a kit from Hagen which is a 3 solution test that takes 20 min to render color but they all read the same, never any ammonia in tap water before or after dechlor with chloramine present.

 

[Red_Terror]

I have a question, why would our tap water have ammonia? Do they use this aswell in conjunction to chlorine?

 

[tricksterpup]

First of all, thank you guys for the replies!!!

Well, my LFS didn't give me no refunds nor a exchange whatsoever :rant2: which is fine with me, atleast i know what is wrong with my devil's... because i was going to treat them for ich and do a salt and high temp combo... i still added some salt though just to be on the safe side...
I did a quick check on them and they look alot better even though not 100% yet :clap:

Actually, you should be fine with the salt in your water with the Chlorine levels. When I was in college, we used to use Sodium Thiosulphate to our tap water to remove the Chlorine. It did wonders, we used to get it all the time from our labs. Also, when adding top offs to my saltwater tank, some times I do not add any dechlor and the Sodium will dissipate the Chlorine. I am not sure about the Chlorimines tho.

 

[Roan Art]

I have a question, why would our tap water have ammonia? Do they use this aswell in conjunction to chlorine?

The water doesn't have ammonia in it, it's chloramine, which is chlorine bound with ammonia.

This is a great thread to read up on it:

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=62633&page=1&pp=15&highlight=ammonium+chlorine

Roan

 

[laurel]

I'm always guilty of overdosing dechlorinator but now i'm using the right amount cuz i noticed it was getting expensive. Hehe theres a cheap way to test for chlorine. Mix ammonia in the water and if you feel queezy and you smell chlorine then its there lol! just dont uh really mix a lot or something cuz the chlorine gas will kill you

Actually, mixing household chlorine and ammonia creates cyanide gas which, yes, could be deadly. Not really something to joke about..

 

[Onikun]

Actually, mixing household chlorine and ammonia creates cyanide gas which, yes, could be deadly. Not really something to joke about..

You do mean chlorine gas right.

 

[Red_Terror]

Guess what, i checked my devil's today and they have white spots all over their bodies... i think the extra chlorine in the water really weakened them thus allowing the ick parasite to attach to them... i added a good amount of salt in the tank(1 tsp per gallon)... what is a good temp setting when doing the salt/temp combo? Just curious to what you guys use... my heater seemed to be faulty and it only goes to 80 degrees... will this be okay? if not then i will just go and buy another heater and kick up the temp to maybe 83 degrees if necessary... tell me what you guys think... thanks :shark:

 

[rrkss]

80* is fine. That is the temperature I used to cure most of my ich cases. 1 tsp per gallon is not enough salt. You need to go with 3 tsp per gallon of salt to really be effective. A simple test to see if you have enough salt in your tank water is to taste a drop (I know it sounds disgusting but won't hurt you). If the drop tastes salty, then you are fine if not, add more salt. If you are like me and want to be precise, get a hydrometer and raise your specific gravity by 0.003 from your tap water.