Confused on water problem

kraemerwa2003

kraemerwa2003

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Oct 2, 2006
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I have been cycling my new 20 gallon tank for a week. I have two java ferns and one java moss that has spread like crazy. The problem I am having is that today I checked all of my params again...all normal except the pH, it was too high. Soooo....I used Wardley's pH lower, putting in the recommended dosage, along with ammonia lock, to complete my week one cycling. After a few hours, I came back in, and BAM!! my water is an icky brown/cloudy, and I can't even see the back of it. Tomorrow I will do a 50% water change, but what could have possibly ever caused this? Has this happened to anyone else? I am not new to tanks, but this problem is new...so confused... :confused: :confused: :confused: :help: :eek: :huh:
 
Could you please be a little more specific on the parameters? It might make it a bit easier to figure out what's going on.

What else is in the tank, other than the plants? In other words, what's your ammonia source? Fish, or manually added, etc...

I pretty much consider the pH adjusting chemicals to be on a level with the 'Spawn of Satan', but it's in there now, so what's done is done.

You had two things happen rapidly, a drop in pH and a drop in ammonia.

I'm guessing a bacterial bloom, or possibly even a mass die off of nitrifying bacteria...?? It's pretty iffy without knowing the ammonia and nitrite levels before the chemical treatments.

Odds are, it'll clear with a series of water changes of 50%.
 
kraemerwa2003 said:
I have been cycling my new 20 gallon tank for a week. I have two java ferns and one java moss that has spread like crazy. The problem I am having is that today I checked all of my params again...all normal except the pH, it was too high. Soooo....I used Wardley's pH lower, putting in the recommended dosage, along with ammonia lock, to complete my week one cycling. After a few hours, I came back in, and BAM!! my water is an icky brown/cloudy, and I can't even see the back of it. Tomorrow I will do a 50% water change, but what could have possibly ever caused this? Has this happened to anyone else? I am not new to tanks, but this problem is new...so confused... :confused: :confused: :confused: :help: :eek: :huh:
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Don't mess with those pH adjusting chemicals, ever. Usually pH issues are caused by a lack of buffering capacity in the water. If your water has inadequate buffering capacity, your pH may become unstable. Adding acids or bases to adjust the pH will result in wild swings in pH that are harmful or deadly to fish. You must also add those chemicals VERY carefully with every water change. This is a real PITA. Most fish MUCH prefer a stable pH over a "proper" pH.

Also, what do you mean you "added AmmoLock to complete your one week cycling"? AmmoLock's only use is as an emergency measure to save fish from dying when you can't change water during a period of high ammonia. It has NO other use. If you have ANY ammonia in the tank prior to adding the AmmoLock, your cycle is not done, and adding the AmmoLock won't change that. Cycling usually takes a heck of a lot longer than a week unless you use BioSpira or get a filter from an established tank.

In any case, if you are doing a fishy cycle, you REALLY need to reduce Ammonia through water changes, as piling all sorts of chemicals in the water is really stressful to fish.

You need to post all of your parameters here. Also, it is not uncommon for pH to be unstable during a cycle. In any case, maybe a listing of your pH readings over a week would be handy.

You can also ask your LFS to check the GH/KH of your water.

Post all the numbers here.

SirWired
 
pH, it was too high.
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it would be helpful to know what you mean by "high" and ... what was it before. what's the ph of your tap water. what's the kH of your tap water.

Soooo....I used Wardley's pH lower, putting in the recommended dosage, along with ammonia lock, After a few hours, I came back in, and BAM!! my water is an icky brown/cloudy
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bingo !!! ammonia lock = bad. wardleys pH lower = bad. water changes followed by leave the tank alone for a week and it'll clear up.

all water supply whether municipal or well contains some concentration of calcium and magnesium (among other cations) which exist as salts of carbonates. hard water has more of these salts than soft water. these carbonates in solution exhibit a phenomona known as "buffering". when an acid is introduced to a water sample containing carbonates, the carbonates react with the acid and neutralize it, releasing carbon dioxide and a small amount of heat. the CO2 is exhausted at the water surface and the net result is no change in your pH. at some point, the carbonate buffer will become exhausted ... at which time, even a small concentration of acid will rapidly drop the pH of your water and kill your fish. simply put, carbonates stabilize the pH as long as they are present in sufficient amounts. when the carbonates become depleted, the pH of your water will plummet rapidly with the introduction of even a small amount of acid, killing fish, plants, and your biofilter. the chemicals sold for "adjusting" the pH of your water downward are typically but not necessarily acids of phosphate. this will add a huge phosphate load to your water resulting an an algae bloom.

also, Sudden pH changes can be quite deadly to some fishes. this is most often due not to the change in pH itself but rather, to the associative concurrent changes in (a) the toxicity of ammonia (which is more toxic at higher pH), (b) nitrite (which is more toxic at low pH) or (c) carbon dioxide (which is also more toxic at low pH and which interferes with normal respiration).

bottom line: leave your pH alone.
 
I have the testing strips, dip em in and it explains it by a little colored pad...pH was in the range of 8.0. On the bottle of Ammonia lock it says to use it when cycling...I know now not to add any of the crap to my tank...doing a 50% change and hopefully that will "clear" up my problem...no pun intended. After extensive and continued research find it is a bacterial bloom...not fun. No idea where the ammonia came from, other than the snails which had attached themselves to the plants at PetsMart. Other than the javas, I have a piece of natural driftwood, some plastic plants from an already established tank, and a fake log cave...
 
On the bottle of Ammonia lock it says to use it when cycling
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If you're doing a fishy cycle, and weren't able to do a water change. Still bad IMO, but that's just an opinion.

No idea where the ammonia came from, other than the snails
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Doesn't seem like they should put out much ammonia. Do you feed them? Could be decomposing uneaten food.

Ammonia isn't bad in a cycling tank, in fact, without it, the tank can't cycle...
 
nope, no food for the nasty boogers, I didn't want them, as soon as I collect them all, they are grub for my puffers...little guys love em :D No fishy cycle...oh well, I will definitely be cycling it for a while longer, another month...
 
You should probably pick up a reagent-based test kit. The dip-strips are notoriously inaccurate and hard to read. Most folks here seem to like the Aquarium Pharm. Freshwater Master Test Kit. Under $20 at Petsmart if you print out their website price before you go and ask the store to price match.

SirWired
 
awesome, thanks for the help guys...I cycled my 10 gallon and didn't have this problem, kinda upset. I have had tanks my entire life, and this has NEVER happened before...
 
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