General Clown Loach Questions?

[Zoomies]

General Clown Loach Questions…

I have a 46 gallon bow-front aquarium that has just completed a fishless cycle. Time to buy the fish!!

I have never kept Clown Loaches, but have decided that I really like them – so I want to build this tank around the Loaches. I already have lots of hiding places in it, and I know they will outgrow the tank in a few years. (I have plans to build a rather large river tank in the next two years.) Since I’ve never had any Loach before, I’d like to ask a few questions to the experienced Loach owners:

1. Even though my tank is cycled, I was thinking of waiting a few months until I introduced the Clown Loaches, just to ensure everything is nice and stable. Is that a good idea or do you think I’m being overly cautious?

2. How many Clown Loaches should I buy? I was thinking four would be a good number. (While they are small, the four would do well in the 45, and when they get larger I could put them in my (future) 100+ river tank.) Am I correct?

3. If I wait a few months to introduce the Loaches, I’d still like something on the bottom. I’ve always been fond of Corys and have had several in the past. Do Corys get along well with Clown Loaches? What other fish get along well with Clown Loaches? More importantly, what fish should I avoid putting with Clown Loaches?

Any help is much appreciated. Thanks!

 

[dethjam316]

Originally posted by Tando Murphy
I don't think 6 even would be too much for the 46 gallon, they don't grow all that fast, and as with most fish, they grow to the size of their environment (if they're crowded, they will be stunted and not grow as big.) But I'm a big clown loach fan myself, and can't seem to get enough of them.

tando, 95% of your advice is brilliant, but i can't disagree more with this point. i know i posted about it another thread already, but for the sake of the person asking about in this one, i will repeat it: it's not a good idea to encourage stunting the growth of fish!!! it shortens their lifespan and likely makes them more susceptible to parasites and illness. fish do not grow to the *SIZE* of their environments...with enough water changes and filtration, a fish will approach it's potential size even in a small tank. what fish DO show is the ability to grow to the size of the *CONDITIONS* of their environment. if you're fish doesn't reach proximity to their potential size, you, as the aquarist, are doing something wrong, whether you're not maintaining your tank, or are putting inappropriately large fish in small tanks. regardless, one should *never* buy a fish knowing they can't provide for its need. i'll step off my soapbox now...i just don't want people putting clown loaches and oscars in 10g tanks thinking "its ok, they only grow to the size of the 10g."

all that said...clown loaches are awesome. 6 in a 46 is not an awful idea...if you're committed to purchasing a larger tank...say a 75g but, much preferably for their sake, a 125g, within the next year or two. i have 6 clowns in a 55g, but they will be moving to a larger tank when i move to a downstairs apartment, and the risk of tanks crashing through the floor and killing people and fish is not a risk. a lot of aquarists say loaches are slow-growers, but this must be after they get a few inches in length, because mine have doubled in size in a matter of months.

also, if you want 3...get 3. just get them at the same time. buying one to "test the waters," if you will, would increase its stress dramatically. you shouldn't expect a couple to die. they may, but it hasn't happened to me. are clown loaches seemingly more susceptible to ich and other maladies than most fish? yes. and for this reason, you should have an ich remedy on hand just in case. every time i've gotten clown loaches (well...both times, i picked up 3 and then 3 more a couple months later), they've shown signs of ich. this is the best reason to quarantine fish, and treat them if necessary, after purchasing!

lastly, it may not be a good idea to add them now. try a couple more hardy, less expensive fish. if they do well for a month, then consider adding 3 clown loaches. and that's a wrap, for now.

 

[Zoomies]

Great! Sounds like the clowns will be okay for a year or two as long as I move them after that.

I've got one other question - In setting up my tank I went out and got decorations thinking about a 'theme' for the tank rather than the fish for the tank. (I'm hitting myself in the head right now.) I do have a ton of hiding places, but I didn't even consider the substrate.

I bought Topfin non-toxic epoxy coated premium quality aquarium gravel from PetSmart. There is not size listed on the bag, but the largest pieces measure about 1/4". As for color, I got 3/4 white and 1/4 'sky blue'.

The gravel is epoxy coated, but I wouldn't call it smooth. Will the cories/clown loaches have problems with it?

As far as the color goes, how big of a deal is that? I have a lot of darker artificial plants, wood and other decoration that are darker in color. Will the light colored gravel stress the fish and/or wash out their colors?

Finally, if I switch to sand - can I just put a layer of sand over the gravel, should I replace the gravel with sand, or can I do a cool thing where half the tank is gravel, switching to sand on the other half?

Thanks!

 

[dethjam316]

my understanding is that epoxy-coated gravel will break down over time, and that, despite its commonness, it's really not the best choice. i've used it before though, and never had any problems, so i'm guessing that breakdown occurs on a scale of several years. i wouldn't think it'd be a problem. darker gravel brings out colors better, yes; i use a light sand, though, and my fish seem fine with it. i just put a black posterboard as a background on the tank. i think this contrast works well.

as for the sand...i use sand is most of my tanks now. its the medium sand in the green and tan bag they have at most lowe's stores. i forget the brand, but it was the only "medium" sand. you shouldn't just put the sand over the gravel, because it will mix badly, possibly look awful, and you'll have pockets where the sand just sinks through the little crevices in the gravel to the bottom.

i have one tank that's 1/3 gravel, 2/3 sand. it looks pretty snazzy at times, though, really, i wish i'd just done it all sand. you can try this: you just have to collect as much gravel as you want out in cups (best done after a water change so the water level is lower, and in your case, best done without fish in the tank), and then add the sand in cups as well, depositing it right on the bottom. make sure your filter is off, or you'll have a big cloudy mess.

 

[dethjam316]

i agree that clown loaches are especially susceptible...absolutely.

but you're still incorrect.....as i said, from a purely biological standpoint, fish do not grow to the size of their environment, and even if they did, it wouldn't be good for them to do so! the growth of fish is much more attributed to the conditions of their environment, not its size. in our aquariums, these often go hand-in-hand, ie: it's easier to have good conditions in a larger tank. just because theoretically you could grow an oscar to 12" in a 10g given a ridiculous regimen of water changes doesn't mean it's a good idea or is healthy for the fish, but it *could* be done!

 

[chefkeith]

Zoomies-

If you really want to build this tank around clown loaches, you might not want to get Cories. Clown Loaches can do better when they have water parameters that are dedicated towards them. They like warmer water than most fish. The Rainforest climates, where they come from, near the equator in SE Asia, (Borneo/Sumatra) have water temps that are mostly in the 80’s (F). During the rain season water temps will be around 78F, during the dry season around 84F. Clowns can be kept in cooler water, but they won’t be nearly as active.

Good tank mates would be other fish species from the SE Asian Region, -other non-aggressive loaches, barbs, and danio’s. Check this link-(and see SE Asian River)
http://www.mongabay.com/fish/biotope.htm#Southeast Asian River
I don't want to bark on the wrong tree either, so I will say that Clowns could live with many other fish, with other water parameters if you'd like them too.

I like your idea of getting some other fish before the clown loaches to break in the tank. Buying healthy clown loaches can be expensive and tricky. Before you get your clown loaches you should have a separate quarantine tank ready for them and have some Coppersafe on hand. Be ready to treat them for ich and/or other external parasites.

Substrates- Clown Loaches love sand and the finer the sand, the better. You won’t have to worry about food ever getting wasted either. Clowns will sift through the sand for food, in which they suck the sand in through their mouths and blow the sand out through their gills. Clown Loaches sleep on their side too, which sand is a lot more comfortable for them to sleep on. Sand can be easier to keep clean too. Good placement of a powerhead will circulate the water and create a current on the bottom of the tank, moving any debris towards the intake of your filter.

How many clown loaches you get depends on how many sq. feet there is on the bottom surface of the tank. For small clown loaches, 1 sq. foot per clown is a good guideline, with a min. of 4 sq. feet or 4 small clown loaches.

I can’t think of anything else right now. Take care and please update us from time to time to let us know how things are going.

 

[Rhys]

Just adding a point where you said great they will be ok for a year or so. Not true they will be ok for 2-3 yrs.