Help please

StreetCypher

StreetCypher

AC Members
Apr 18, 2004
1,378
0
0
vancity, BC
Visit site
I'm suspecting my tank may have a breakout of ICK soon. THis is my first time dealing with ICK.
I am 99% sure that it came from a LFS. I recently purchased a P. delhezi from a LFS knowing that there were some fish with ICK. The fish were in quarantine, but the rest of the tanks were almost indefinitely exposed. I knew it was risky buying it, but, P. delhezi (let alone any polypterides) are very rare here (there were only 2 left). i noticed my clown loach and RTBS flashing as well.

Anyways, i'm preparing to use the salt method to cure it.

From what i know i should
1)raise the temp to at least 86
2)add 1 teaspoon of salt per gallon

I'm planning on adding the salt over a few days. I'm also going to point my spraybar up a little to increase surface agitation in order to get more O2 in the water. Lights will be turned off also (that will hurt my plants, right?).

I'm worried about the other inhabitants though. Heres some more info.

tank-55g
filtration-XP2 (no carbon)
temp-usually 79ish, but i already raised it to 80, then again in increments of 2
substrate-silica, live plants
water parameters-
ph-7.6
amm-0
nitrites-0
nitrates-5
maintenance-weekly 30% water changes with sand vac. Last water change was today.
tankmates-
1 lima shovelnose
2 pictus cats
1 bumblee cat
1 RTBS
1 clown loach (i think is showing a few cysts, also the only one)
1 P. senegal
1 P. delhezi

As you can tell all my fish are either cats or scaleless. If i'm not mistaken they are very sensitive to salt. Is there anything else i have missed?
Thanks in advance for reading this rather long post.


So far my clown loach is the only one affected... I was so close to giving him away too!!! Couldn't he have waited 5 more days!?!
 
Last edited:
You seem to be on the right track, you might take a real close look at the pictus, ICH seems to attack them easily and is nearly impossible to see on these fish. My experience with Pictus is that ich meds are close to deadly for them, salt is easier on them. Any method will cause some stress, but my pictus did OK through 2 weeks of high temp and salt at 2 teaspoons per gallon. Remember when people talk about fish being sensative to salt, they are talking about long term salt use which isn't a good idea for freshwater fish despite the popular urban myth. You may have already seen this article, but If not here is one from the Skepticle aquarist that I particularly like.
http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/docs/health/ich.shtml

I would get the salt in right away (obviously add it slowly, but don't delay) if the fish are flashing, the ich will be dropping off of their gills soon, and dropping into the substrate, it won't be long at elevated temps before it hatches and goes looking for a new host. the free swimming stage is when ICH is vulnerable to salt or meds so you want to have the tank ready to kill it when it hatches.
Dave
 
I would use CopperSafe from Mardel...I have used it with pictus cats several times with no side affects, it's safe, easy (1 time treatment, no removal of activated carbon, treats for 30 days), and very effective. The salt and high temp are still a good idea but you don't want to risk the ich getting out of control to the point where it is too late for chemicals. Definitely do not use anything other than coppersafe though, the other ich meds are dangerous and highly ineffective from my experience. Good luck!
 
I'm not sure if this is just me being paradnoid, but the pictus may have it too.
I'm in the process of a 25% water change focusing on cleaning the substrate. THen with the new water i'm going to add...10 teaspoon of salt
Temp has been raised again by 2 degrees, at a total of 82 degrees.

Is the free swimming ich visible with the naked eye?
 
Last edited:
No, the trophonts are too small to be seen with the naked eye.

I would not use any other medication. The cats in particular will do well with salt, for this short time period, but not with most medications.

I'd also encourage you to setup a quarantine tank for future purchases. While it may seem like a pain, it's much easy, and less stressful, than treating the entire tank.
 
spartan said:
I'm not sure if this is just me being paradnoid, but the pictus may have it too.

Is the free swimming ich visible with the naked eye?
Click to expand...

As Og said you can't see the free swimmers.
As far as the Pictus, I would be suprised if he didn't have it. I have never had a tank of fish get ich that my pictus wasn't among the infected animals. They just really are prone to getting ich IME. They are also next to impossible to see ich on. white fish that never holds still or even swims slowly. Keep bringing up the temp and adding salt in slowly until you reach your target. mark the day and give it some time after the fish show no more signs of a problem. I personally agree with OG in that you should avoid the meds with the fish you have. I can tell you, I have killed a few pictus over the years with ich meds, and I am a fimr beleiver in the salt and heat combo, not to mention it costs much less.
dave
 
I would not use any other medication.
Click to expand...

I'm with you on that. A Q-tank does seem like a PITA, but its probably better on the long run. Its one of those things you don't really consider until this has happened. Shows how inexperienced i am. :rolleyes:

I am a fimr beleiver in the salt and heat combo, not to mention it costs much less.
Click to expand...

I also prefer the salt method. I have always been skeptical of meds and their ingredients. Many are sold just to make money.

Anyways, heres my plan

Monday night- noticed a few tiny white spots on my clown loach.
Tuesday-25% water change with thorough sand vac. Replaced water with 10 teaspoons of salt in it. Raised temp to 82. Turned spray bar up for surface agitation for more O2.
Wednesday-25% water change along with sand vac. Replace water with 10 teaspoons of salt in it. Raise temp to 84.
Thursday-25% water change along with sand vac. Replace water with 10 teaspoons of salt in it. Raise temp to 86.
Friday-25% water change along with sand vac. Replace water with 10 teaspoons of salt in it.

1)How often do i need to keep doing water changes after friday?
2)Also, do i need to keep replenishing the salt?
3)How long until its safe to start to water change the salt out and reduce the temp? Is a week after the last signs of ick gone good enough?
 
Last edited:
You essentially want to reach a salt level of 55-165 teaspoons total. I would target 110 teaspoons of salt that would give you lots of room each way for error. I would probably add the salt a little faster. I usually add 1/4 teaspon per gallon every 2 hours until I hit my target. So you would want roughly 13 teaspoons every 2-3 hours until you total 110. Right now you are at 20 If I read correctly. Once you get to 2 tsp per gallon, then match you change water each time. in other words if you change 10 gallons put in 20 tsp of salt. Water changes help but aren't as critical as other things against ich. I'd just make sure you do enough to keep the nitrates very low and the tank clean. once the treatment is done just continue with normal maintenance, but don't add salt. the level will drop slowly via water changes, and eventually be non-existant. No need to massively remove the salt at the ned of treatment IMO.
dave
 
Wait a minute...

I'm remembering something...

Oh yeah! I remember reading a thread several months ago about adding salt to a tank for an Ich outbreak. It had some very good directions on how exactly to do it.

I believe it was RTR who said that you need to completely dissolve the water before pouring it in the tank.

The reason for this, I think, was that if the fish breathed in some salt before it was completely dissolved in the water it would cause painful irritation in their gills or something? That's what I guessed at least.

It seemed to make sense.

[EDIT]AHA!!!

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27083&highlight=rtr+salt

That's the one I was thinking of.[/EDIT]
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
AquariaCentral.com
Top Bottom