how long to medicate?

[Dahlia]

I've been medicating my fish for ich since last Friday with half doses of Quick Cure. I've done one water change in that amount of time (my ammonia and nitrites have now returned to 0, so I guess the filter was just initially stressed... maybe by the temperature change?)

It is a 90 gallon tank currently at 84 F to speed up the ich life cycle. The medication claims to get rid of ich in 2 days, although at half dose I suppose it doesn't work as fast. The reason for the half dosing is there is a loach in the tank.

The fish are still covered in ich, in fact they seem to have MORE than yesterday... what is going on? How long should I expect this to take?

 

[KateA.]

I always thought that while the ich was present on the fish, which is actually hundreds of the nasties in an egg or sac of sorts, it was impossible/difficult to kill. Once the sacs drop off the fish, hatch and become free swimming is when the medication kills them. I think the life cycle is 3 weeks? And in my experience, it always gets worse before it gets better. Ich shouldn't be fatal, but it can be if other things in the tank aren't right and everything combined gangs up on your fish and kills them.

 

[Sumpin'fishy]

Personally, I'd add 1 TBSP aquarium (or table/other) salt to the aquarium per 10 gallons. Even corys, plecos, etc. have seemed to do just fine in this small amount of salt. It really makes a difference in the ich infestation. It causes the fish to shed their slime coat and produce it more quickly, which sheds the ich cysts at the same time. If the ich cannot find a host in a week (approx 5 days at 80 degrees) the life cycle is broken, and they are eliminated. I personally continue temp and salt for at least one additional week after last seen cyst.

I would do a 50% water change and run some carbon in the filter to mop-up any residual QuickCure in the tank. This treatment is also less stressful to the fish than using chemicals. It has an added benefit of making breathing and respiration (osmotic balance) in general less energy-consuming than normal. This gives them more energy for their immune systems to help fight off infections, etc. I also suggest doing water changes (50%) at least twice a week, if not every day. Vacuum the gravel as well as possible during the water changes to remove more ich larva/eggs.

 

[famman]

Sumpin'fishy posted this last year;
"
I had alot of disease problems when I first got into the hobby, and I did ALOT of research on diseases. Learned alot by experience, too! I know most of us have had some kind of experience with ich, and we have all heard of different ways to beat it. My suggestions are based on what I consider to be a conservative, "make sure" method. Ich life-cycle is known to be 3 weeks at 70 degrees and 5 days at 80 degrees. They have 3 stages to their lives: 1)adult on fish 2)immature, free swimming 3)spores eggs in substrate. The spores and infesting adults are immune to treatments, the free swimming form is not immune (so this is what we treat). The trick is to keep destroying the free-swimming form until there are no more of the other forms left alive, either, due to normal life cycle.

I suggest raising temp to 80 to 82 degrees, and add 1Tbsp per 5 gal of Salt. Know if you have sensitive fish and act accordingly. Just for record, my pleco gets full dosage and acts just fine. The salt will ease osmotic pressure on the lungs and allow more easily the flow of oxygen to fish. Add recommended dose of treatment to fish, using quarantine tank if possible. I use Quick Cure, but hate how it stains silicone of the tank (this is also one reason why I prefer quarantine tank). I would treat for 2 weeks at this temp, just to be careful. It has been noted that occasionally cysts will go into a dormant stage and not spawn the free swimming form until more time has elapsed. For this reason, I double the time it takes to cure. Better safe than sorry. Also I would slowly drop the temp back to it's original level (about 2 degrees/day. I would not introduce ANY new fish before a month, just to give everything a chance to stabilize, and give you a chance to watch recovery process without additional stress. Finally NEVER add new fish without first quarantining them for at LEAST 2 weeks. Hope your fish make it through OK!
"
I think Sumpin'fishy's post is very informative.
good luck

 

[Sumpin'fishy]

Thanks for saving that one Famman! It gets pretty tiring writing the same post over and over, especially when they tend to be lengthy! I have tried to shorten my answers, but that post is pretty clear cut, and to the point! I have also, since then, been questioning the effectiveness/necessity of Quickcure or other ich chemicals. I just had an delayed outbreak on two wild caught fish that were sent to me and quarantined, only to show signs later. The treatment with QuickCure didn't seem to help at all, even with daily water changes and adding a full dose each day! Something that I haven't thought about till recently is how light tends to break down this drug! Also, I have had this medicine for about 9 months to a year, so maybe the effectiveness has deminished. Either way, I have been finding it to be unnecessary.

Anyways, I ended up just having the temp at about 79 degrees, and I'm adding salt only. Water changes about twice a week now, but all signs of ich have completely gone now! These fish seem to be stressed at 80 degrees and above so I'm taking it easy on the temperature (Florida Flag Fish). I am now just riding out the treatment for security sake. I Hope this helps.

 

[Dahlia]

It is good advice, and I'll keep it in mind if this happens again... but I think now that I started one cure I should probably see if it works before I switch? If ich has a cycle of 3 weeks at 70 degrees and 5 days at 80, and I've only been treating it for 4 days at half dose, perhaps the end is at hand? Has anyone had specific experience with doing a half dose of Quick Cure?

Thanks for all the info so far! If this still isn't working after 10 days or so I will switch to salt. My fish seem very healthy and lively so far so I'd rather not stress them any more by changing the water chemistry around a lot. I'm also not sure loaches are supposed to have salt, I'll look that up.

 

[stoopid]

Just a warning -- I think I lost one of my loaches/Botia to salt (one tablespoon per 5g is what the box recommends as a "tonic"). I then read further about the stress salt causes catfish, plecos, and loaches.

Now, I'm not giving up on salt, but before I go back to more than 1 tbls per 10g I will need to get some stronger bottom feeders (working on a trade now). My remaining 2 loaches are fine, so for all I know it was that loach's time and the readdition of salt after many weeks of no salt may have been coincidence.

There's also a split on these forums as to salt's necessity/effectiveness. I will note that I hear more praise than dissent about its proper usage.

 

[Casper]

I'm about at my wits end with ICH!
I have had tanks for over 3 years now and have NEVER had such a problem with ICH until recently.

I have been doing the 2 day cure forever and no results. Over a week now and my clown loaches are just simply covered in the stuff!
You can't treat loaches at full strength, so only giving half doses, but no results. I'm afraid I'm going to lose everything in the tank!
I am just now raising the temp to 80 and have put in 1 tblsp per 5 gallon, but just read in the above thread that that is hard on loaches too! ARGH!

I am having such a hard time with this I am about to give up the hobby of fish keeping. I would hate to do that, but I also hate watching the fish suffer with this severe cases of ICH! I'm thinking that there must be a new strain of it or something cause the Ick Cure is not working.

I have

2 marble angelfish
1 rope fish
1 black rope fish, but is really a worm
1 queen botia
1 black shark
5 clown loach

The loaches look the worst of all.

Did a water test and Nitrates are high, but can't add any enzymes cause of the medication in the tank.

Nitrate 80
Nitrite 0
GH 300
KH 300
PH 8.4
TEMP 75 now, raising to 80

Also put a water softener pillow in filter tank.

I have them in a 46 gallon tank.

I just hope the salt I just added does not stress them out further!
UGH, I'm so annoyed at this nasty little parasite called ICH.

 

[Sumpin'fishy]

I highly suggest against changing too many factors of the water chemistry at one time. If you do raise the temp, then do it slowly. 1-2 degrees per day is good. Do the same when lowering it. Also, I would do some decent sized water changes, too, since this can do more good than anything else! People underestimate the power of clean living environment. Water changes (with gravel vacuum) will also remove eggs and ich larva before it can get to the fish. Water softening "pillows" are unecessary and will just stress your fish more by changing the water they are used to.

I'd start off with a 50% water change NOW. That will lower nitrates (and all the undetectable dissolved organics) while cutting the salt content in half as well (since your loaches are sensetive). Continue doing water changes at least twice a week (50%) and every day would be better and is not too much! Every time you change water be sure to add back the appropriate amount of salt (1 TBSP per 10 gallons in your case)...and only for the water that was changed. Exact measurements are irrelevant, and just try to approximate the best you can.

 

[Dahlia]

What are the enzymes that Casper mentioned for nitrates? I've never heard of those... I just hear plants or water changes remove them.

Since there is a loach, bristlenose pleco, and corydoras in the tank I am treating I am not sure I want to add salt to the tank. If it is supposed to irritate loaches and catfish that seems like a bad idea.

It seems like they have less cysts today.

Also Casper, your clown loaches are more prone to ich than most fish as they have no scales. They're a lot harder to treat than other fish. Don't give up on the hobby! If you lose your loaches you might want to consider fish that are a bit hardier. Although I really hope yours make it.