Inverts Dying

C

Casino

AC Members
Feb 6, 2003
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Providence, RI
I bought 1 cleaner shrimp with 10 snails.....died in 1 hour. I then bought 1 brittle star and 20 snails....died in 1 hour. Bought 1 serpent star and 10 more snails...died within 1 hour.

PH 8.3
amonia 0
nitrites 0
nitrates 0
salinity .25
Temp 80

2 month old tank. Never used any type of copper. All test conducted with a salifert test kit and finally with a lamotts. All concured, salinity wth a retrofractor. I bought 1 star polyp the first time and thats doing great. All inverts were fine at the LFS, I know this because I went there regularly while I was cycling. Acclimated by placing bags in tank for half hour, then every 15 minutes add a cup of tank water to the bags for 1 hour. Everything is living, once the go into the tank, snails just lay there, inside their shells. I know they are dead cause of the awful smell. Shrimp started to jump up and down and finally just stood still, then died. Stars are living in the bag, but once I place them in the tank, they look like they are swimming down but just turn over a crooke. I have a yellow tang, royal gramma, perc clown and a lawnmower blennie, all doing great. Any suggestions?
 
I suspect that your acclimation procedure is to blame. Adding a cup of tank water at a time might work for fish, but not for inverts. A very slow drip acclimation process is preferred; I drip-acclimate all my inverts for at least two hours - usually more like four hours.

Did you test the pH and SG of your LFS water and then compare it to your tank water? If so, what did those test results look like?

Lastly, what's a retrofractor?!
 
what exactly is your salinity rating? is it 1.025 SG or 25ppt or .25 some other unit that i don't know about. if it's 25ppt then it's really low. the salinity of SW is 35ppt. if the salinity is 1.025 SG then you are fine.

other then that i think that it's your acclimation process like gcvt suggested. however, i have acclimated inverts in the same way you have and they lived fine. and my dad once didn't acclimate a pair of peppermint shrimp and they survived and are now at 3 months in my tank. however, i got them where i work and i know that my tank is almost exactly matched to the invert system at work. so check with your LFS to see what their water is. they shouldn't have a problem with telling you.
 
usually more like four hours
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I did this with the last batch at the LFS request and had the same result.
what's a retrofractor?!
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Whoops....sorry, Refractormeter...My bad.
what exactly is your salinity rating?
Click to expand...
1.025
The last 2 times while I was acclimating, I checked to see that both bag and tank water were the same in salinity, they were, checked PH, nitrite, nitrate, amonia...all the same in bag and tank. They were doing great in the bag, once I placed them in the tank..they all went belly up. I really dont know how to explain it. I guess the tank is cursed in not having snails and shrimp. I dont think theres really anything that I can do. Thanks for your help guys. If you have any other suggestions, please dont hesitate.
 
The first had been there for 2 months...second and third had been there 2 months and a few weeks. I know cause i also have a FWT and I use to go to mezmarise with there reefs.
 
Hi,

I'm really curious as to the progress of this issue. You are developing some serious patterns and are absolutely in a position to help others out by getting some defined conclusions as to "what's wrong." There is something absolutely lethal - and my first instinct was a simple one - acclimation. But if you truly are acclimating them properly, then it is something else.

A couple thoughts - and these are all things that are absolutely possible; only you can connect the dots, though.

Temperature. Take another reading with another thermometer. I mean this. They are cheap enough to buy, and every hobbyist must have a second thermometer on hand to verify the first. You say, "But my fish are fine." Your fish can adapt to conditions you would not believe. Believe me. ;) This is by far the easiest thing to "check." Probably nothing to do with your problem, but still shouldn't be so "given" that we overlook it.

Salinity. Here's the cheapest way to test/verify, and check/verify your temp as well. A glass floating hydrometer. Used as just an "idiot check" they have always served me well. It's real simple - salinity must float the hydrometer to where the green band is half-in/half-out of the water. Remember that the water line travels UP which can skew the preciseness of the reading.

Chemicals. Again, fish can adapt and are generally more hardier than shrimps. That your snails are dying all at once is an amazing fact that something is deadfully wrong in your tank. You can have fish thrive in +200 ppm nitrate. Absolutely. ;) Inverts may be a bit more sensitive. I'm not sure how lethal the nitrate actually is, but it is a god indication that something in the tank is causing that buildup. You will spend less on a second set of verifying test kits than you will on your next batch of inverts, and it's a good idea to have. Don't go gangbusters and buy a big lab kit - any cheap kit will work; it's just to verify the first, and as such will probably outlive it's shelf life after the first verification you use it for.

Alternatives: These can include the oddball stuff such as minute stray voltage. I hardly know enough about your system, so you get to play McGyver, here. :D But if I might suggest, here's what I would do.

Set up a quarantine tank using ONLY the water from your existing tank. Use no substrate, and no live rock. Get just snails. Acclimate them to the quarantine tank and then add. If they bite it right away, you know you have a water chemistry problem. If they live, then you can start digging into the alternatives like stray voltage, or something else that might be mechanically/electrically causing mishap.

If you have the means, you might set up a brand new second 10G quarantine tank, using all new saltwater - and let it mix. Don't cycle it, just set it/mix it before adding snails. The purpose is to cross-check by example your water chemistry. 5 snails in each - the new quarantine tank, and the quarantine tank using the old tank water. You can take it from there.

Good luck, I'm very curious as to the outcome.
 
Just another thing to consider--if your tank/decorations were used, they may have been exposed to a toxin that is now leaching out.
 
Thank to you all. I have done all theses things as sugested and everything, I mean everything checks out fine. Triple testing, copper tests, everything is new, nothing used. I have used numerous thermometers in tank and in bag and temps are the same, salinity checked with a retrofractor and both bag and tank, the same. Trust me, I have tried everything, even my LFS is stumped and dosent want to sell me anything till I fix my problem. The only other thing that might be the problem is that I use conditioned tap water, filtered through one of those pure water filters. So im ordering one of the RO/DI units from ARS and do a 50% water change with that water and in 1 week do another 50% water change and wait another week and then test with some snails. Its the only thing that I havent tried. If only I could tape and post a video of how instantly they die, from bag to tank..instant death, not even a few seconds...once in the tank there gone. What ever it is, its strong to kill them all so swiftly. I will keep you posted as the progress of this issue is resolved. Thank you.
 
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