large reef setup questions

[zekni]

I just recently bought a house with the perfect wall for a nice big built in tank. What I'd had in mind was one long tank, 8' or so, but according to plans I've been researching online, I'd be limited in how tall I could make the tank (using acrylic) because of the length.
I had my dad over this weekend who used to be a carpenter (now designs bridges for freeways) who thankfully is excited about helping me with this project. He suggested I break the one massive tank up into two smaller (shorter in length) tanks, which would allow me to go taller, and add volume that way.
This would take care of the "should I go freshwater, or saltwater?" questions, as now I'll be able to do both. Muwahaha. I've had fresh and brackish tanks for many years, however, now I need to really start learning about saltwater.
The tanks are going to be approx 54"Lx30"Wx48"T, I want a reef tank. Yes, I realize this is going to cost me thousands of dollars.
What I'm trying to understand is, with live sand and live rock, do I not need excess filtration? Just powerheads to move the water around? For the freshwater tank (breeding colony of african frontosa cichlids) I'm considering a pool or pond filter of some sort.
I realize for corals and such im going to need massive amounts of lighting, and obviously more than usual since this is going to be a tall tank rather than long. I'm thinking (still brainstorming here guys) that I'll build the initial "reef" out of non-live rock, and then seed with live. Is it possible to keep my corals and such to the top portion of the tank where the light is the best and have other critters lower down, or do I absolutely need lighting that will penetrate as well all the way down?
I think what I'm asking, is (corals and anenomes come on live rock in a lot of cases, dont they?) Will they move themselves where the best light is, or am i likely to lose some when I seed the dead rock with live? Maybe I could place the live rock closest to the top and let the little non-light-needing critters colonize the dead stuff toward the bottom to their heart's content?
Straighten me out here guys. I've got a while to plan this yet. Money really isn't too much of an issue, but obviously, if you've got a "you could spend lots of money doing this, but if you're handy you could do it this way" ideas, send them my way! What all am I going to need for this setup?
I have every intention of setting this up properly, so any advice if appreciated.

Thanks.

Zek

 

[slipknottin]

I just recently bought a house with the perfect wall for a nice big built in tank. What I'd had in mind was one long tank, 8' or so, but according to plans I've been researching online, I'd be limited in how tall I could make the tank (using acrylic) because of the length.

Not at all, you could have a 8' long tank that is over 36" high without any issues. Tenecor makes such size tanks http://www.tenecor.com/ultraquarium.php and you can make such a size tank with glass as well.

The problem is not so much the strength of the tank, its being able to punch light down into the depths for the corals. On a tank over 36" deep, your going to need 1000 watt halides if you want to be able to keep clams or SPS near the bottom. The cost for the tank will be nothing in comparison to your electric bill. Also, of course realize that unless you want to stick your head in the water, you can not actually reach the bottom of a 4' tank...

Generally with a tank of 36" deep or less, you can get away with 400 watt or even 250 watt halides.

Corals generally can not move themselves, but anenomes can. (be careful, as anemones can often move into a place where they contact a coral, and they will kill corals) You usually dont get that many sizeable corals or anemones with live rock, you buy such things after, then place them in the tank.

Take a look at Wayne Shang's tank, its 8' long, 4' deep, and 3' high.
http://www.seabay.org/images/forums/DSCN5326_800.jpg
http://www.seabay.org/images/forums/DSCN5320_800.jpg

BTW- he uses 4 250 DE 10k(front), 2 1000 20k radiums (middle) and 3 400 10k(back) for lighting, and his electric bill every month is nearly $1/gallon.

 

[wayne]

I would have some notes....

1. I would plan for a sump. You will need a bunch of kit for that tank, and will need/want to keep it out of sight. You will need to put a large skimmer somewhere,and likely calcium reactor.
2. You won't be using powerheads for this rather, rather a large pump from the sump to a series of outlets, plus likely another plumbed in for extra movement.
3. The tank itself is a pretty trivial cost. Your salt will soon cost you more than that. Your electricity bill may surprise you too.
4. For lighting start to investigate metal halide combinatiosns to suit the livestock you choose. Forget fluorescents PC's et al for this size, depth. MAybe 3 *400 or 3 *250.
5. Don't expect corals et al with your live rock, however do it right and cheap frags can grow pretty explosively, so in a year or two your tank will be looking good.

 

[FloridaBoy]

Keeping a full blown reef tank of that size will require a few more things you should be aware of:
1.TIME -- Maintenance-wise, you are taking on a huge headache with a giant reef tank. Although a level of automation can be built in, bigger displays like this are often reserved for curators in public applications, and even then they are often replaced after a few years with less demanding systems. Even evaporation can be a big issue.

2. ATTENTION -- Mixing fish and inverts on a large scale has always been a delicate matter for the long term, and leaving the system in the hands of a teenager or even a novice aquarist for 2 weeks while you visit Europe is not recommended; you have been warned.

3. PATIENCE -- This is true of any marine set up, and since you have no experience in that department, you need to invest in a good book and make sure you understand the various processes involved here; many of the aforementioned skimmers, overflows, reactors etc. can prove to be finicky gizmos requiring a lot of tinkering/adjusting. Stabilizing a marine system is quite different from a freshwater set up, not necessarily more difficult just different. You may want to consider a fish only marine system for a year or two before jumping from freshwater to a reef. Not saying this to discourage you, on the other hand veteran reef keepers on many forums can make reef systems sound very easy, and for beginners that can lead to erroneous assumptions. From the sound of your post, you may realize all of this already, if so then your'e on the right track, your research will lead to success. At least you won't have to say "why didn't someone tell me?"