Newbie making all the wrong moves

S

steelspy

AC Members
Dec 29, 2006
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Set up my tank on Xmas - Gift for my three year old

20 gallon long

Rinsed the gravel

Marineland Bio-wheel 150
Air stone

Filled with water and treated with start right Start-right

After some initial kills, was running with two julli cory catfish and two tetras

Tank was pretty stable at this point

Added a couple Java Ferns

Still good. Testing with strips. Things look OK

Three weeks pass and we end up at pet smart....

Got a little crazy. Added 12 fish and two more plants. Changed filter media.

Nitrite levels shoot up and fish start dying. Surprise, surprise

Start doing 75% water changes twice a day. Fish stop dying.
Got API master test kit. Nitrite levels are not good.
After a 75% change, I am seeing
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0-.25
Nitrate 0

Prior to the change, when changing twice a day
PH 7.8
Ammonia 0
Nitrite .50
Nitrates somewhere between 0 and 5.0

Prior to the change, when I miss a water change
PH 7.8
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 1.0
Nitrates somewhere between 0 and 5.0

temp 78 - I adjust the temp of the water I put in to match so as to avoid sudden temp changes.

I am adding Start-Right and aquarium salt to the water I add as well.

Have since added second Marineland Bio-wheel 150 and two more java ferns. I added the second filter because I had a failure with the first. Disassembly and reassembly resolved the issue, but I can't risk a failure while no one is home. I also read here somewhere that more circulation is better. Overkill, I'm sure, but what the heck...

Came home one day and there was an Angel fish from nana for my daughter.

Fish seem to be doing OK. Been a week since the last kill.
Surviviors:
(2) Julli Cory catfish
(2) Tetras
(1) tetra neon (3 died since my blunder)
(4) Mickeys
(2) Guppies (2 died since my blunder)
(1) Angel Fish

These water changes are killing me. If I don't get up early enough to do it before work, I spend 15 minutes of my lunch hour doing it.

How long until the Nitrites drop and Nitrates take off?
Anything I can do that will speed it along without risk to the fish?

I read that vacuuming the gravel is not always the best idea when you are trying to establish a cycle???
Should I continue to abstain from vacuuming?

I have also read people discouraging the use of charcoal. My filter media packs contain charcoal. The manufacturer recommends changing them every two to four weeks. Until the cycle is established, should I not change the media? Since I want to maintain bacteria, I would only change one filter at a time. The bio-wheel 150 has two filter slots, so I can insert a new one and leave the old one in for a while to let the bacteria migrate.

What are your thoughts on charcoal?
Am I off track about the filter media ?
Is the aquarium salt helping me?

I really don't have any trusted sources for gravel or filter media from an established tank.

Thanx in advance.
 
Ok, first off it can literally take 6 months (or more) for a new aquarium to become fully cycled to the amount of livestock in it. That is to say if you have 10 fish then eventually bacteria will build to the point that it can support 10 fish. If you suddonly added 10 fish at that point your aquarium would then go thru a mini-cycle until the bacteria reach a point that they can support 20 fish.

Personally I'd go ahead and vacuum the gravel. Siphons shouldn't be so strong that they could suck the bacteria from the substrate. Actually they'd probably suck up the substrate before getting the bacteria off the stuff.

I don't use charcoal unless there is some sort of chemical (like medications) that I need to remove from my aquariums. I haven't examined the newer penguin filters, but if they can hold 2 cartridges you should only replace one cartridge at a time. Heck since you have 2 filters you can just replace one of the cartridges every 2 weeks and keep the other 3. Keep in mind that the cartridges make good holding spots for the bacteria you are trying to keep.

As for the use of aquarium salts I don't personally use them. The only thing I would use any salt for in a freshwater aquarium is for the treatment of ick. Even then I would just be using table salt.

I know you didn't ask, but I honestly would not keep an angelfish in a 20g aquarium. They just need more space than that in order to reach full size. Also it is advisable to keep cories in groups of 3 or more and tetra species should be kept in groups of 6 or more. I do sympathise though because my 5 year old would love to have an aquarium with one of everything.

Anyways you should really refrain from adding more fish until your nitrites stay at 0.
 
The carbon won't hurt anything, if it is in your filter pads, just leave it. You can rinse the pads in some of the water you take out and reuse till they fall apart, though as Hound says, seems you have enough to replace one at a time and not be an issue.

Gravel vac will not hurt the bacteria level. The salt is a waste in my opinion, but not hurting the cycle.

Bio Spira may help, but I would just monitor and do the water changes. You should see the time span between changes increasing.
 
Thanx for the advice.

Will vacuuming the gravel impact the Nitrite levels at all?

I am assuming there is waste in the gravel which is ending up as Nitrite?

If I don't introduce anything new to the tank from here on out, is there any chance of ich?
 
vacuming the gravel will take out the fish poop and uneaten food, which as it decomposes will lead to higher nitrites and nitrates. simply taking the debris out before it starts to rot improves water quality overall.
most people believe ich is always present in the aquarium, but an outbreak occurs when fish are stressed and their immune systems are down. good clean warm water will usually be enough to prevent it.
when your carbon filter pads get clogged or gunky, just swish them in a bucket of old tank water. since you have bio-wheels really you could just clean the filter pads off with tap water if they get really bad, i always use the shower head to clean them because it has a good strong spray.
no need to toss them unless they are falling apart. then you can use sponges instead of paying $$$ for more filter pads. i buy the poly foam pads (like what is used on chair seats for cushion, find it in the sewing section) and cut them to size to fit in the filter. i use the old filter pad as a stencil/guide before throwing it away. then you just squeeze them out when they get clogged.
 
Valentines day - update

success!

Since my last post almost three weeks ago:

Lost a guppy

Nitrites were killing me. 75% water changes twice a day.

Started vacuuming with each water change. Looked like a lot of waste came out on the gravel. Didn't help my levels.

Finally broke down and added some Jungle Start-Zyme.

Nitrites dropped immediately. They have stayed down.

Nitrates are appearing and pH has been creeping up.
Nitrates 5.0 to 10.0
pH topped 8.0

75% water changes not impacting pH

Tried some pH normalizing tablets.

Algae Bloom!!!! Not sure if the pH tablets were a catalyst or not. Timing was coincidental if it wasn't related. Started on the gravel where the tablet dropped to. Was on the glass & gravel. Grew fast.

Moved all the gravel to one side, scrubbed one side, moved gravel back to other and scrubbed more.

75 % water change.

Cloudy water.

Pulled a bucket of water out of tank and rinsed filter material in bucket. Bucket got wicked green.

pH seems to be creeping down, Nitrates are also creeping down. Nitrites and Ammonia are zero. Slight cloudiness, but not bad.

I think I have things under control.

I am running four filter packets in my two filters. Would a new filterpack with fresh charcoal help my cloudiness?

I am trying a "light off" method and reduced feeding to once a day to make sure my algae issue is controlled. There is a little algae I missed on intake tube of filter I am using as a gauge. If it disappears, the lights off is working. If not, I'll try a blackout.

I have some growth on the java fern leaves. Some of it is broad leaf growth, other is long stringers. I think it might be algae.

The java ferns have dark spots also? Rot or normal?

All in all, I am pleased with how things are going. I appear to be done with daily water changes.

Appears I have completed a full cycle.

Next water change, I'll do an inspection of the plants roots.

(2) Julli Cory catfish
(2) Tetras
(1) tetra neon
(4) Mickeys
(1) Guppy
(1) Angel Fish

I'm not adding any more fish at this time.

I am considering adding plants after I find out what is growing on my java ferns. Should I do more ferns or can someone suggest another plant we might enjoy

Everything I've learned in the past two months has been from this site!

Thank You All!
 
I think the black stuff on the plants is just black algea. mine get it too, but the aglea eaters soon clear it up. I've had a bacteria bloom before, just changed about 20% of water and waited patiently for it to clear up. Usually over night, but sometimes a little longer. If you want to add more fish, try adding just 1 or 2 at a time. Good luck. Isn't this fish stuff FUN, LOL!
 
Oh yeah, forgot to mention that there are algea eaters that are great for getting rid of that algea. They are just call "algea eaters" at our local fish store, don't know any other name for them. They are light tan color with a dark stripe down there sides, not the ottocinclus though, bigger, they grow to 8 inches, but skinny, not wide.
 
You'll be cycled when you have no ammonia and no nitrItes and a level of nitrAtes. The cloudiness is probably a bacterial bloom and will "settle" in a day or two. I would leave the pH alone, fish will adjust to it. The best pH is a stable one. Not sure about the plants but I'm sure someone who does will chime in soon. Try not to mess with your filter too much, if the flow is restricted a quick swish in water taken out of the tank during a water change will knock off any big debris. Don't change your media, your beneficial bacteria is in your filter, you don't want to lose much of it.....http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97498
 
lovesfish said:
Oh yeah, forgot to mention that there are algea eaters that are great for getting rid of that algea. They are just call "algea eaters" at our local fish store, don't know any other name for them. They are light tan color with a dark stripe down there sides, not the ottocinclus though, bigger, they grow to 8 inches, but skinny, not wide.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a Chinese Algae Eater. Great algea cleaner when they are little but when the get older they can be really agressive. I do continue to get them just return them when the start getting agressive.
 
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