Peace lilies poison?

[plantbrain]

That's the plant.

I used them for many years and with many so called sensitive wild caught fish species.

Regards,
Tom Barr

 

[terror]

thanks tom had this plant for a few years already . didn't know what it was

thanks. btw how do i propagate this plant?

 

[midiamin]

Allelopathy has never been shown to occur in any natural aquatic system to date.

You need to be careful when looking at research that suggest ground extract chemicals are able to inhibit other organisms, then suggest that these same ground up plant extracts act and secrete this same ground up cocktail in natural systems..................

Yes, but from what I understand about Amazons is that they produce hormones to inhibit growth of other Amazons. Hence the old saying 'one amazon per tank'.

BTW, dieffenbachia are toxic to all (fish, us, animals, etc).

 

[plantbrain]

Old sayings..........
Maybe they are old.....does not make them the least bit correct.
I have pictures in natural systems that also definitely disproves and places serious doubt to this.

I have always found many of them together in close proximity.
also, the peace lily genus is very different from Echinordorus.
Never noted any effects growing different species of Amazon's together, noir has anyone I've met or talked to.

You cannot speculate here as the species to species alone can be very different with respect to allelopathic chemicals.

Such myths about sword plants are started by folks that do not test, that do not maintain things well, the plant grows and grows and gets huge taking over a 100 gallon tank, it's not allelopathy..it's competition for resources like nutrients, light, and CO2. Basically, folks that lack the ability to provide a control to reference from. They do not test or use methods to maintain stable non limiting system.

Swords can beat up on most plants(plant - plant competitions), they are large wetland weeds, not some sensitive mild mannered rare aquatic plant.

But if you prune them, place them in adequate quarters, dose routinely etc, then growing 5-100 together is hardly an issue.

ADG, ADA, myself and most other gardeners can/have /do easily keep many swords together. No impact of sensitive fish...........so if swords produce toxic chemicals, we have simply not seen such impacts on fish.

and that is the control from which I reference from.

You claim it does, so prove/show that it does(without interferences) and show cause. Show that amazon's produce a hormone(s) that inhibits other amazons please.

If you cannot or provide a reference for it............well........
I am active in this field and work with the top folks in the world on aquatic weeds. To date, no one has shown allelopathy exists in natural systems.
Not one.

So this would be indeed a monumental breakthrough if it where true........but as old sayings go............I have serious doubts and want to read the paper claiming this to be the case.

showing cause is much harder to show than the control, which has been done already for decades.........Many tanks have only one species and that is a sword....Amano did a lot with those in the past, ADG has several good examples.

Back to the topic of peace lilies being toxic to fish or not..........root exudates are toxic from this species on fish?

Regards,
Tom Barr

 

[Squawkbert]

Old sayings..........

Diana Walstad's book includes some tables that show diminished plant growth rates, in aquariums, of certain plants when in the presence of other plants. The effect was most pronounced with certain Lily species (if memory serves). She is not the original source of the included data, but every chapter in her book is thoroughly annotated, so I'm sure the source(s) are included at the end of the Allelopathy chapter (I'd look up the source & quote tha data, but I don't own my own copy - yet).

Keeping carbon in the loop may be an effective way of dealing with the issue, I suspect that YMMV as a function of the chemicals involved and their affinity for carbon.

 

[midiamin]

Old sayings..........
Maybe they are old.....does not make them the least bit correct.
I have pictures in natural systems that also definitely disproves and places serious doubt to this.

I have always found many of them together in close proximity.
also, the peace lily genus is very different from Echinordorus.
Never noted any effects growing different species of Amazon's together, noir has anyone I've met or talked to.

You cannot speculate here as the species to species alone can be very different with respect to allelopathic chemicals.

Such myths about sword plants are started by folks that do not test, that do not maintain things well, the plant grows and grows and gets huge taking over a 100 gallon tank, it's not allelopathy..it's competition for resources like nutrients, light, and CO2. Basically, folks that lack the ability to provide a control to reference from. They do not test or use methods to maintain stable non limiting system.

Swords can beat up on most plants(plant - plant competitions), they are large wetland weeds, not some sensitive mild mannered rare aquatic plant.

But if you prune them, place them in adequate quarters, dose routinely etc, then growing 5-100 together is hardly an issue.

ADG, ADA, myself and most other gardeners can/have /do easily keep many swords together. No impact of sensitive fish...........so if swords produce toxic chemicals, we have simply not seen such impacts on fish.

and that is the control from which I reference from.

You claim it does, so prove/show that it does(without interferences) and show cause. Show that amazon's produce a hormone(s) that inhibits other amazons please.

If you cannot or provide a reference for it............well........
I am active in this field and work with the top folks in the world on aquatic weeds. To date, no one has shown allelopathy exists in natural systems.
Not one.

So this would be indeed a monumental breakthrough if it where true........but as old sayings go............I have serious doubts and want to read the paper claiming this to be the case.

showing cause is much harder to show than the control, which has been done already for decades.........Many tanks have only one species and that is a sword....Amano did a lot with those in the past, ADG has several good examples.

Back to the topic of peace lilies being toxic to fish or not..........root exudates are toxic from this species on fish?

Regards,
Tom Barr

Submerged is where the effects occur.

 

[midiamin]

Old sayings..........
Maybe they are old.....does not make them the least bit correct.
I have pictures in natural systems that also definitely disproves and places serious doubt to this.

I have always found many of them together in close proximity.
also, the peace lily genus is very different from Echinordorus.
Never noted any effects growing different species of Amazon's together, noir has anyone I've met or talked to.

You cannot speculate here as the species to species alone can be very different with respect to allelopathic chemicals.

Such myths about sword plants are started by folks that do not test, that do not maintain things well, the plant grows and grows and gets huge taking over a 100 gallon tank, it's not allelopathy..it's competition for resources like nutrients, light, and CO2. Basically, folks that lack the ability to provide a control to reference from. They do not test or use methods to maintain stable non limiting system.

Swords can beat up on most plants(plant - plant competitions), they are large wetland weeds, not some sensitive mild mannered rare aquatic plant.

But if you prune them, place them in adequate quarters, dose routinely etc, then growing 5-100 together is hardly an issue.

ADG, ADA, myself and most other gardeners can/have /do easily keep many swords together. No impact of sensitive fish...........so if swords produce toxic chemicals, we have simply not seen such impacts on fish.

and that is the control from which I reference from.

You claim it does, so prove/show that it does(without interferences) and show cause. Show that amazon's produce a hormone(s) that inhibits other amazons please.

If you cannot or provide a reference for it............well........
I am active in this field and work with the top folks in the world on aquatic weeds. To date, no one has shown allelopathy exists in natural systems.
Not one.

So this would be indeed a monumental breakthrough if it where true........but as old sayings go............I have serious doubts and want to read the paper claiming this to be the case.

showing cause is much harder to show than the control, which has been done already for decades.........Many tanks have only one species and that is a sword....Amano did a lot with those in the past, ADG has several good examples.

Back to the topic of peace lilies being toxic to fish or not..........root exudates are toxic from this species on fish?

Regards,
Tom Barr

Submerged is where the effects occur.

tpm

 

[terror]

I just bought some lilies, will these be ok ? i placed them in my 15 gallon sump

problem is it doesn't have direct sunlight, but morning light only

any comments? will these be ok?

thanks.