Porous liner?

cmfeher

AC Members
Nov 30, 2009
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Chadds Ford PA
We had a 1500 gal pond put in about 20 years ago. The thick liner stays inplace thanks to heavy rocks that were put in place by a back hoe. It seems the liner has become porous with age. Five years ago we completely emptied it and sealed any area that seemed to be compromised, but the level keeps going down slowly and we would like to repair it once and for all. We now have a few perennial beds and some stone walls in the way, so bringing in a back hoe to redo the pond is out of the question. Has anyone dealt with a similar situation? what are our options? Is it possible to glue a new liner on top of the old one?
Thank you for your input!:help2:
 
You could just put a new liner over the old one. I wouldn't try and glue it on, it would be very difficult and I don't see any benefit to that. How big are the rocks? could two people with levers like crow bars or planks of wood move them?
What sort of liner is the old one?
 
drain it all down, drill holes in the old one so it doesn't hold water. it'll just act as a cushion for the new one.

fold out the new one and shove it under as many rocks as you can.

then your done!

-Eric
 
Thanks for your input guys! We cannot move the stones, they are more like small boulders, so we may try spraying on another liner, great idea Hankn, I had not thought about it. And I will make sure to drill holes in the old one, to avoid air bubbles, thanks Eric.
I will wait for the fall, I am too busy with work and weeding right now. In the fall, I will put fish, snails and tadpoles in our bathroom hot tub ( with an air stone of course) like we had to do a few years ago. We did not loose anybody and they seemed pretty happy not to have to deal with winter !:)
 
This was really interesting thank you for the links to those web sites. So is the regular liner better than the spray on if you are having problems? From the clips on their site it seems that they put enough coats on to keep the thickness uniform.

I really like how versatile this material is. The fact that you can spray directly on either dirt or blocks would make it easier to accomplish custom jobs, that otherwise would be impossible to do with other methods.

I agree with the answer above, if the new coating is able to stick to the old one it would create a cushioning effect.
 
What is your old liner made out of? Barring something bizarre like exposure to raw oxygen ions in space, EPDM does not become "porous." I wouldn't really expect that of even an old PVC liner either, although something like polyethylene (which I think was used briefly 20 years ago) could well become porous.

However, as with roofs, leaking almost never occurs in the broad areas of the pond unless there has been mechanical damage (tree roots for example). Leaks occur at edges and interfaces. The most likely suspects would be your bottom drain (if you have one), skimmer / edge drain, pump plumbing, sharp creases in the old liner which have cracked (I would think likely with PVC and PE, but not EPDM), or UV deterioration along the top edge. Since my reading of your note is that you lose a lot of water, the latter problem is probably not it, since it would stop as soon as the water dropped below the top edge where the leak was.

I would check these areas after draining the pond before getting more elaborate in your repairs.


A regular (45+ mil EPDM) liner placed over the old one should do the job handily. As mentioned above you would want to punch many holes in the old liner so that water trapped between them will drain out rather than stagnate.

Polyureas and polyurethanes are definitely NOT a DIY project.

These products, while pricey, have substantial technical benefits. However, being a 2-part reaction system they must be installed by professionals using precision equipment:

- a 49:51 mixing ratio is NOT the same as a 50:50 ratio, and the properties of the 49:51 coat will vary significantly from nominal. Good metering equipment is expensive but absolutely mandatory.

- you need to have a fairly heavy compressor (100+ cfm @ 100 psi or so) and use mildly expensive (~$10K) spray equipment

- as seen on the second website, you generally want to be wearing a full bunny suit and NIOSH carbon-filter respirator since the unreacted monomers in both Part A and Part B are between mildly hazardous and highly toxic, especially if inhaled during a spray application


If you do have this done for you, the resulting product should give you exceptional service. Follow the professionals' advice on surface preparation. I wouldn't think that you would need to punch holes in the old membrane since the new coating should form a fully-adhered layer on all of the surface of the old membrane. They may want you to cut out the folds and overlaps just to give a more uniform surface.
 
Did you originally have a regular liner and are now opting for the Polyurea Elastomer Spray Liner?

How much does something like this cost to put in verses the using a regular 45 mil liner?
 
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