Rummynose Tetras dropping like flies!

CatsMeowww

CatsMeowww

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Dec 7, 2008
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Chicagoland
About a week ago, I bought a school of 11 rummynose tetras for my 25 tall. I've lost about 2-3 per day, and am down to one lone tetra, who looks to be on the way out, this morning.

While I will be going to the LFS to ask some questions about their stock, I am wondering if there was something wrong in what I did, or the tank params. From my tests, all were 0-0-0 (ammonia, nitrate, nitrite). I don't have a PH test, however I had a pair of gymno's (temporary--moved to bigger tank) in there with absolutely no problems.

I'm really worried that I may have transferred whatever the tetras had/have to the female gymno. She is showing symptoms of ammonia poisoning, only the tank is registering 0. Any ideas on what this could be?

The only true symptoms are that the tetras are acting kind of twitchy (not glancing off of things, but just twitching in general), and rapid breathing as they get worse. I can tell which ones are on their way out, because they flip upside down and float towards the top, gasping for air.

Help!?
 
Oh, and the temp. was at about 70-71, which I have raised to 74-75.
 
What test method are you using? Unless you're very heavily planted with CO2, you should be reading about 0-0-10 at least. That would be a first place to start. Additionally, if your gymno is showing symptoms of Ammonia poisoning, have you tried a water change? Additionally, what water conditioner are you using? Sometimes water treatment plants switch up their chemicals during the spring since they switch to different water sources, and will end up putting in chloramine during one part of the year, and just regular chlorine during the rest of the year.

With all that said, here's the diagnostic form from the sticky at http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=180877. This will help others work on the problem as well.

1. What is the size of your tank?

2. What are your water parameters? State the brand of test kit used.

3. Is your aquarium set up freshwater or brackish water?

4. How long the aquarium has been set up?

5. What fish do you have? How many are in your tank? How big are they? How long have you had them?

6. Were the fish placed under quarantine period (minus the first batch from the point wherein the tank is ready to accommodate the inhabitants)?

7. What temperature is the tank water currently?

8. Are there live plants in the aquarium?

9. What filter are you using? State brand, maintenance routine and power capacity.

10. Any other equipment used (aside from heater and filter which are two very important components of the tank)?

11. Does your aquarium receive natural sunlight at any given part of the day? What is your lighting schedule (assuming you do not rely on sunlight for our viewing pleasure)?

12. When did you perform your last water change and how much water was changed? How often do you change your water? Do you vacuum the substrate?

13. What foods do you provide your fish? What is the feeding schedule?

14. What unusual signs have you observed in your fish?

15. Have you treated your fish ahead of diagnosis? If so, what treatments did you use? State your reasons for planning ahead of proper diagnosis.

16. Insert photos of fish in question and full tank shot if necessary. .
 
Okay...here goes. Nothing about this tank has changed recently. I can't figure out any reason for water quality problems, if that's what it is.

The 2 gymnos have been isolated in a 10 gal. hospital tank for now. Main tank is 25 tall. I did about a 50-60% water change last night, using Kordon's NovAqua Plus (used it for 2 years with no problems). I do 25% WC at least once every week, sometimes twice.

I use API's liquid tests...but I re-read them, and realized that I don't actually have the Nitrite one...I have two nitrate tests (doh).

Filter is currently a powerhead rigged to a sponge filter with peat and filter floss in the tube.

I have about 1 wpg plus very indirect sunlight that hits the tank. It is moderately planted with jungle and italian val. Temp, as noted is currently about 74-75.



I was reading about Neon Tetra Disease in the "sticky", and this seems to fit the symptoms these fish are showing. I have only found one with an obvious "cloudy spot" on its abdomen, but I initially thought it was just from the dead fish being in the tank until I got home from work. IF it is this NFS, how do I treat my gymnos to hopefully save them?

If it is a water quality issue, WHAT sparked it?
 
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And, so far only treatment has been water changes.
 
I don't think it's your fault, I think it's their stock. That's why they have a nickname among LFS - "crummynoses"

Unfortunately, few LFS will tell you everything you need to know - when did they receive them? From where? Have they been dying in their tanks? How long did they acclimate them?

I can tell you from working at Pet Supermarket for a brief time, sometimes they can be in "acclimation" for hours...not a good thing, not on purpose. Just that it gets busy and fish are not the first priority in a chain pet store vs. a mom and pop LFS.
 
Sorry to hear about the losses.

SO unforntunate to hear difficulties with Rummys and Cardinals (I believe both are still wild fish). Although had simlilar and same difficulties when shipped direct from suppliers but eventually found the way to properly handle them.
As I mentioned in different threads, it is so unfortunate that suppliers and wholesaler do not recognize the probelm when they ship/sell theirstock. Hopefully lfs would recognize the problems but depending on the quantity they receive, it is closed to impossible to diagnose the common illness among cardinals and Rummys when small amount are received (50-100). I am hoping staff @ lfs would recognize the problems as most of, but not all, my well operated lfs will have at least one staff who know what they are doing. Thus prevent further spread of disesase to hobbyist's tank as they will know how to recongnize/treat before selling to public.

WOndering what the pH & nitrite level might be in you tank???

Never assume that water is in acceptable range because you have fish living and doing well in the tank. Even if you had tank specifically containing Rummys and for long time, it does not mean water is good enough for new incoming Rummys, no matter how well they may be acclimated to lfs tank.
I read enough threads with similar situation where old batch drop as soon as new batch were added. Thus q/t is very good practice to follow.

Always check your water before heading out to lfs and such practice will ensure less complications/losses/heartaches.

Hope this helped abit.
 
If there's irritation around the gills, it could very well be an ammonia issue, but if the tank has been established, then I doubt it. In the ones that passed, did you get a look under the gill plates? Gill rot from bad conditions during capture/transport/sales could have happened, and the transition to new surroundings could have been just a bit too much for them. I'm a bit concerned since you said your other fish are now starting to show symptoms. Can you describe exactly what you're seeing on your gymnos?
 
Also, the API master test kit has two bottles for Nitrate (Nitrate #1 and Nitrate #2). If I remember right, it's 10 drops of #1, mix the vial, then shake the bottle of nitrate #2 for 30 seconds do it vigorously, otherwise you won't get accurate results, then 10 drops of bottle #2 into the vial, shake the vial for 1 minute and then set a timer for 5 minutes. I suggest double-checking your nitrate test.

From what it sounds like, I don't think it's a water source issue, your water treatment should have taken care of that. It probably is a stock issue. I keep a tub around for QT now (I used to use a 20 gal, but that's being used permanently), but even a 5-10 gallon tank can work for a temporary QT tank for new stock as well as a hospital tank.
 
I will be picking up the nitrate and PH tests on my way home tonight to complete the water tests.

I did try to get a better look under the gills of one of the tetras...it was hard to tell if the gills were inflamed, but the surviving little guy this morning seemed to have some red on the inside. They were all pretty skinny and small when I got them so the gills appeared to stick out a little.

The gymnos are just being generally listless, and just sitting on the bottom. I moved them to a 10 gal. hospital tank, where the perked up (although it could just be from being moved). The female was really having some labored breathing, but no redness or inflamation that I could tell. Male wasn't showing trouble with breathing.

I'll update with the Nitrate/PH tests later, once I get home.
 
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