I just came across this posted in another thread, Rob, do you agree?
here is the link to the thread if that was confusing which I think it is:
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114650
Sailfin Mollies
- Thread starter stephstar
- Start date
I just came across this posted in another thread, Rob, do you agree?
here is the link to the thread if that was confusing which I think it is:
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114650
For the mollies, there is no reason to do it slowly, or should I say more slowly than adding just that amount of salt. The Firetail might be a concern, MOST fish with scales don't mind low level salt, but some are very averse to it. It seems like a lot, but when you consider how much it takes to make full sea water it is pretty small. If you are worried about it, add half one day, then without doing a water change add half a few days later. It won't hurt a thing.
General accepted procedure to convert fresh to brackish or semi-brackish is to only move .002 per week, which is what you are doing.
The other consideration is you would need either a hydrometer or a refractometer to measure the specific gravity of the water, so you have no way to do it other than by estimate. Hydrometers are cheaper, but not as accurate. A refractometer costs about $50 at drfostersmith.com and a hydrometer is only about $12... (NOTE: a large percentage of hydrometers don't measure low enough to get 1.003)
GH and KH are independent of each other, but GH and KH both affect PH.
Crushed coral would only raise the KH. If you did this and still wanted your GH higher, you would need to add the epsom salts as described above. The marine salt is better all the way around for mollies.
If you haven't read it yet, this link might explain it better.
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75895
General accepted procedure to convert fresh to brackish or semi-brackish is to only move .002 per week, which is what you are doing.
The other consideration is you would need either a hydrometer or a refractometer to measure the specific gravity of the water, so you have no way to do it other than by estimate. Hydrometers are cheaper, but not as accurate. A refractometer costs about $50 at drfostersmith.com and a hydrometer is only about $12... (NOTE: a large percentage of hydrometers don't measure low enough to get 1.003)
GH and KH are independent of each other, but GH and KH both affect PH.
Crushed coral would only raise the KH. If you did this and still wanted your GH higher, you would need to add the epsom salts as described above. The marine salt is better all the way around for mollies.
If you haven't read it yet, this link might explain it better.
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75895
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I beg to differ here... GH can and does affect PH.... GH is a measure of calcium and magnesium ions.... If calcium goes up in the water the PH will also go up....
I will grant you that there is typically not a lot of free calcium in water the affect of GH on PH isn't very much, but it does affect it.
Calcium can be driven up by certain plants which are capable of breaking up calcium carbonate and using it as a carbon source. Hortwort is one if these and I know there are several others.
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No it won't. Calcium is not in and of itself alkaline. It's the carbonate (i.e. KH) which raises pH. An increase in Ca++ in the water is only associated with a rise in pH if it comes with carbonate.
Basic chemistry - proton donors lower pH, proton acceptors raise pH. Ca++ neither takes up protons (i.e. H+ ions) nor donates them. Thus it does not affect pH.
Biogenic decalcification does indeed raise pH but it's not because it puts Ca++ into the water. Indeed, it does the opposite, taking it out and precipitating it as insoluble Calcium carbonate.
Firstly, the plants extract CO2:
1. Ca++(aq) + 2HCO3- --> CO2 + Ca++(aq) + CO3-- + H2O
The carbonate ion can then do one of two things:
2. CO3-- + Ca++ --> CaCo3 (precipitates)
Or
3. CO3-- + H+ --> HCO3-
And in equation 3 you see it - the CO3-- is a proton acceptor, therefore alkaline, therefore the pH goes up. Nothing to do with the calcium.
Basic chemistry - proton donors lower pH, proton acceptors raise pH. Ca++ neither takes up protons (i.e. H+ ions) nor donates them. Thus it does not affect pH.
Biogenic decalcification does indeed raise pH but it's not because it puts Ca++ into the water. Indeed, it does the opposite, taking it out and precipitating it as insoluble Calcium carbonate.
Firstly, the plants extract CO2:
1. Ca++(aq) + 2HCO3- --> CO2 + Ca++(aq) + CO3-- + H2O
The carbonate ion can then do one of two things:
2. CO3-- + Ca++ --> CaCo3 (precipitates)
Or
3. CO3-- + H+ --> HCO3-
And in equation 3 you see it - the CO3-- is a proton acceptor, therefore alkaline, therefore the pH goes up. Nothing to do with the calcium.
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Its to early to think that hard ... but I see your point and I think I learned something new all at the same time.
ah....thanks?
I am confused. I will read again to clear things up, and read the article.
Thanks everyone!
I tried to take a photo of the my unknown fish so we could identify him, but he will not sit still, and all the photos I took are blurry. I have a new appreciation for the photos of fish now
. I tired to find a picture on the internet, but no, he looks alot like a minnow? But he does not seem to have scales? I might have to give him away, eh? I really love the mollies and they are more important to me to keep healthy.
I will do that, give away the firetail thingy until I know if he can tolerate salt.
Thanks.
I am confused. I will read again to clear things up, and read the article.
Thanks everyone!
I tried to take a photo of the my unknown fish so we could identify him, but he will not sit still, and all the photos I took are blurry. I have a new appreciation for the photos of fish now
. I tired to find a picture on the internet, but no, he looks alot like a minnow? But he does not seem to have scales? I might have to give him away, eh? I really love the mollies and they are more important to me to keep healthy.I will do that, give away the firetail thingy until I know if he can tolerate salt.
Thanks.
Hi there,
If you want more information specifically about mollies, habits, breeding, etc... here is a good link for you
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/mollies.htm
Lots of good information on the page, and many links right at the top to other pages.
If you want more information specifically about mollies, habits, breeding, etc... here is a good link for you
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/mollies.htm
Lots of good information on the page, and many links right at the top to other pages.
In the main an informative article, but confused here:
given that marine salt is a pH buffer and a water hardening agent, and adding it is "messing about with" the same.
Cichlid salts will do the same thing with the same effect without creating brackish conditions which may not suit other tank inhabitatants. The article itself points out that NaCl, common salt, itself isn't any help.
given that marine salt is a pH buffer and a water hardening agent, and adding it is "messing about with" the same.
Cichlid salts will do the same thing with the same effect without creating brackish conditions which may not suit other tank inhabitatants. The article itself points out that NaCl, common salt, itself isn't any help.
Karl,
That link was more directed at Steph than anyone, so she can read more about mollies and make up her own mind about how best to keep them.
If you want to debate the relative merits of the different types of salts as pertains to the article why don't you send the author a question? His contact information and bio are on that website. We already hijacked the thread once and I would rather not do it again.
Robert
