What is Going on!!!

DaveTMD

AC Members
Dec 26, 2002
16
0
0
54
Baltimore, MD.
Visit site
Background info: 36 Gallon tank, 100% Flourite substrate, AQ300 HOB filter, Ebo-jager Heater, 12 or so Live plants and 2 pieces of Driftwood.

Tank has been up and running for 4 days. Planning on a Fishless Cycle. Just as a baseline measurement tested the chemistry of the water today before I start the Ammonia input. The Tank already has ammonia in it. 3 mg/l Where is this coming from?
PH = 7.0
The Nitrites are coming up about .3 mg/l

The tank seems to have started without me.

Thanks,
Dave T
 
Did you add any water or gravel from an already up and running tank? If so it may have had some ammonia and stuff in it that went unnoticed.
 
andy16

No. this is a completely new setup no Gravel or water from any other sources.

The 1 thing I've noticed is that most people reference Ammonia in ppm. The test kit I have measures in mg/l. any thought's on that.

Dave T
 
im no expert so im sorry that was the only idea i had of what it could be.Hopefully other members of AC could pitch in and help.:) Best if luck to ya.
 
Odds are good you introduced a little organic material that decayed...likely on the driftwood...

but more critically....what steps did you use in setup...for example...water consditioners...which ones did you choose to use...plants...did you add uppliments other than the flourite? Any other chemical additions to the tank. The more info we have the better we can assist.

just remember...next trpi to theshop...get a big ole bottle of patience. Single most important ingredient you can add...and if you havent needed it yet...you will.

Tom
 
Thanks for the reply all,

Tom,
Tap water using Stress Coat to de-chlorinate no other chemicals have been added to either the water or the substrate.

What's my next move, again there are no fish in this tank.

Could the Plants be causing some of this?

If I do nothing will the ammonia continue until biological filtration takes place?

Thanks,
Dave T
 
The ammonia may be coming in part from the decaying organics in the driftwood, and/or also from chloramines in your water supply. Some water supplies use a chlorine-ammonia compound (chloramine) instead of chlorine. Your dechlorinator should have broken this bond before it neutralized the chlorine, leaving you with some ammonia in your water. Or at least thats my theory.

What kind of plants do you have in there? The general consensus on planted tanks is that you shouldn't try to fishlessly cycle them -- it may lead to a bad algae incident. Cycle first or skip it. Planted tanks don't cycle the same way fish only tanks do. The plants will get rid of a good bit of the ammonia for you. Check out this article on the subject. Especially notice the list of recommended starter plants -- good growth early on can help your plants out compete the algae. This is a good collection of links for the planted newb.

Keep checking the ammonia periodically; it should drop off, especially with the plants.
 
As stated in another reply...fin out if your local water supply has chloramines....if it does...you are dechlorinating...but the ammonia remains...thats what you are seeing.

Stress Coat...IMHO garbage....a very expensive dechlorinator...and a source for a lot of usually unneeded phosphates and green water down the line...

simple dechlor if only chlorine...Prime or Amquel of Chloramines....

because a cantainer says it removes chloramine doesnt mean it does...the above two are the only ones I have foudn to truly detoxify the ammonia...not remove it...detoxify.

fin out what the water starts with...and then we can go from there.

Tom
 
I agree, its probably the stress coat breaking down chloramines in your water, and other factors (partial decaying of driftwood, partial decaying of plants, etc.). Wait for the ammonias to disappear before starting your cycle.

That said, fishless cycling with plants is generally _not_ suggested. Even a short term ammonia spike in your water, coupled with lighting (for your plants) will most likely result in an algae outbreak. Either do a fishless cycle without plants, or do a fishy cycle with plants. If you plan on cycling with plants, I would suggest the following:

1.) Pack your tank with as many cheap/fast growing plants you possbily can.
2.) Give your tank a day or two to settle in (In the meantime get CO2 injection going, if you plan on using it).
3.) Add your herbivores (aka. algae eaters, be it shrimp, a couple of SAEs, or whatever). During this phase, be careful not too add too many fish. Although the smaller herbivores (ie. SAEs, C. japonica shrimp, otos, etc.) don't generally produce too much waste, it is still quite a possibility that they might produce more ammonia (fish waste) than the plants can take in.
4.) Give your tank a month (or more) to settle with the herbivores.
5.) Slowly start to add your fish.. a couple every week or so. Also, be careful loading fish here. Bacterial colonies are not as populous as they would be in a FO (fish only) tank. So overloading the biofilter is quite possible as well.
6.) After you've added all the fish you want, you can start to _slowly_ remove and add other kinds of plants. Don't remove too many plants at once, you need to give your biofilter a chance to compensate for the loss of your plant "filters".

I suppose I should add, I would look at getting a different dechlorinator. I personally use Seachem's Prime. Slightly more expensive per bottle, but its more price effective as less treats more and it removes any ammonia that is produced from the breaking of chloramine.
I would suggest doing a large water change to remove the ammonia in your water asap (or at least to a very low level). With the lighting your plants require, you may experience an algae bloom (like what I said before).

HTH
-Richer
 
Last edited:
AquariaCentral.com