Why won't anyone help.

kw0me

kw0me

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Feb 13, 2007
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Is it cause i dont have soe masive expensive tank setup or cause im an aussie? why when i ask questions i get a little help (thank you for the help you great people i have read and learned) but then thats it no more. WHY WHY WHY!?!?!?

Heres the dealio!
20litre (about 4 gal) bow front tank.
poxy filter that came with it and i modified to flow better and filter more.
proper filter i brought around 350lph box says upto a 100litre tank
heater keeps tank at about 25-27 (25 if i have the aircon on)
1.5-2kg of gravel (think thats about 4-6pounds)
2 fake log pieces
airstone burried in the gravel (lost the suction cup when cleaning)
and a plant im told isnt even a real underwater plant. (could be my fault for calling it the name it had in the petstore might be a latin name for it)

1 molly
1 bristlenose catfish
6 neon tetras

now i need a solution for my whirlpool effect made by the filter ive tried diff positions and the spraybar etc with no effect. also should i remove the carbon from it so i dont have to dig it up every 2 weeks to change it so it doesnt start re releasing(i have carbon it the other filter which is in the hood).

need some recomendations on percentage of water to change and how often.

also is it possible to culture a filter in a spare tank with a fish or 2 so im not overloading the bio aspect due to overstocking of the tank.

ALSO:
this tank after having so many problems with it is getting the arse as soon as i can afford my new tank wich is going to be l5ftxw2ftxh3ft so ill need ideas on heating filtering fish ect. looking at doing tropical freshwater so i can put my current fishys in there.
 
im asking how to slow the current down caused by my filter. and how to make my fishis tempory home more comfortable. oh also is it bad to turn a filter off overnight?
 
It's generally not good to turn a filter off for any extended period of time because anaerobic conditions can come about.

How to reduce the current...well, I once tied a sponge to the outflow of a HOB filter. That can help. It doesn't reduce it, but it diffuses it so it's not so direct. An airstone creates current as well, and it isn't entirely necessary unless you have only an internal filter and the top of the tank is really sealed up.

Maybe you should try a smaller filter? I mean a 4g tank doesn't require that much filtration to begin with.
 
(a) you've got too much fish for 4 gallons and (b) your filter is just too much for a 4 gallon tank. do you need lots of filtration? yes .. you're overstocked. your tank would be full with just the neon tetras. can you solve your overstocked problem by overfiltering? no, not in a 4 gallon tank. this is analagous to having 15 fish in there and trying to filter it with an 800 gph filter to make up for it. the 'whirlpool' effect is evidence of the excess power of that filter in only 4 gallons of water. that's hydrology for ya.

moreover, it's not simply a matter of how many fish in what size glass box. the number and size of the fish you keep in your tank should be based on several factors. it should not be based solely on the chemistry of your water nor on the magic of the inch per gallon myth. it's more than simply a matter of successfully keeping the ammonia and nitrites at zero or the fact that you may have "great filtration". certainly these are important issues, but one of the most important factors is almost always overlooked. the number and size of fish that one maintains in a tank should be predicated on the "biology" and behaviour of those fish.

this means that the interraction of a mixed community tank and/or the behaviour of a single species is the single most important factor to consider. you want the fish you're keeping to have the ability to exhibit "normal" and functional behaviour. normal behaviour is important. abnormal behaviour results in stress. stress leads to disease. disease can lead to death. for example:

1. if species (A) does not get along with species (B), then these fish don't belong in the same tank no matter how few fish you have or how large the tank. "getting along" is based on the visual and behavioural Q's that each fish species is genetically programmed with. this is why African cichlids don't belong in the same tank with Central American cichlids for example. Africans don't "understand" Central American fish speak and this leads to behavioural problems and stress.

2. if species (A) has specific food or water chemistry requirements which are completely different from species (B), then these fish don't belong in the same tank no matter how large it is.

3. if species (A) is aggressive and defends a territory of 2 square feet, then you cannot expect to successfully keep more than one of these fish in a tank which is smaller than 2 square feet. convict cichlids are an excellent example of this ... this little fish aggressively defends territories of about two square feet give or take. if you have a tank which allows only that much room and no more, the convict will defend the entire tank to the detriment of any other fish (no matter how large it is) in that tank.

fish need room to swim without having the rest of the tanks inhabitants "in their face" continuously. when crowded, fish exhibit stress syndromes that result in poor color, improper fin form, insufficient metabolic development, do not exhibit proper musculature, do not develop properly functioning organ systems and most importantly slowly lose their inherant resistance to disease. this results in a significantly shortened lifespan and along the way, lots of diseases for which the poorly conditioned fish is a good target..

think about your local lake or river --- the fish are free to inhabit whatever space suits them biologically. if it gets crowded by their standards, some will disperse and move to other areas where they again have the space they need to exhibit functional behaviour.
 
He said it was a temporary tank I thought?
I used sponges to defuse flow but that is about all I can think of a friend of mine cut down the impeller but I have not tried that.
I just bought a smaller Filter

:coffee2:
 
temporary doesn't make it any more feasible
 
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Just to say... there are a lot of people with small tanks on these forums and where you are from really has no bearing on the number of replies you received. Its really based on the right people reading your post at the right time (ie, they have time to reply, etc) and also whether they feel they have something they can contribute.

My first advice. Get a SMALLER filter. You do not want a whirlpool. The constant current will wear and tire out your fish and your neons could get sucked into it. I know, it happened to a few of mine. A sponge or panty hose over the intake will diffuse it and keep small critters from getting sucked in, but it doesn't do much for the force of the pull. Too high a current will definitely stress your fish. Just get a smaller filter.

Second, while you are out getting your new micro filter, pick up a 10 gallon kit and get to cycling :D cause you need it ASAP. Assuming your 4 gallon is properly cycled, you should move over a decoration or two and a bit of gravel to the new tank to seed the bacteria..you can also move over the extra filter off the 4 gallon and run it so the bacteria cultures in the new tank. Once this setup is ready for fish, I'd move over all your current occupants of the 4 gallon.

---I know you say that you are getting a huge tank, but if thats not going to be very very very soon, you should upgrade these guys to at least a 10gallon (don't wait until you can afford the big one) and then after your big tank is purchased and cycled you can stock the 10gallon how you'd like and use the 4 gallon as an Isolation/quarantine tank... or alternatively a group of Endlers Liverbearers would be small enough fish to live happily in your 4 gallon---

Third, don't turn off your filters. Its not a good idea. You certainly don't need 2 filters on a 4 gallon tank, if I'm reading your post correctly. That is definitely over filtration... imho.

As for culturing a filter in a second tank... well, if you are doing a fishy cycle in another tank just to get the filter full of bacteria, don't you subject those fish to a lot of mini-cycles etc if you are swapping the filter media out to the overstocked tank? I don't think its a good idea, just imo. But you have cultured a 2nd filter already by having 2 on your 4 gallon. You can simply move that filter to your new tank and start the bacteria there.
also should i remove the carbon from it so i dont have to dig it up every 2 weeks to change it so it doesnt start re releasing(i have carbon it the other filter which is in the hood).
Click to expand...

Just remove it altogether. What would be the purpose of running it without the filter media, it wouldn't be cleaning your water then... there is no need for that much water circulation and thats all it would be doing without filter media is simply creating a current in the water.

How frequently you change your water usually depends on what your water parameters are. Do you have a test kit? Have you tested your lvls of ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates? In a properly cycled tank your ammonia and nitrites should be 0 and your nitrates can be present up to 20. If it gets higher than that, you should do a partial water change to keep them down. That being said, for general cleanliness, even with good nitrate lvls, most people change their water weekly and do some gravel vacuuming. I'd say about 25-30% is good.

Do you know what the volume of water is in the big tank you plan on buying? Knowing that will allow people to give better recommendations as to what components you will need.
 
Actually I don't see a big problem with keeping six neons and a molly in a four gallon tank. I would hardly qualify that as overstocked.

But the bristlenose...yeah he has to lve somewhere at least 15 gallons at bare minimum. BARE minimum.
 
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