brand new

[Hunter]

Hey all. New to the site and to fish. I would appreciate hearing from everyone about this.

Just bought a new 55 gallon tank along with

1 red devil, 1 jack dempsey, 1 green terror and 1 tiger oscar.

all the fish are around 2 inches and the tiger oscar is around 3 inches. I also have 1 guppy and 1 small tetra (used to be 2 :)

I have a few questions.......

1. all my fish are afraid of me , whenever i walk up to the tank, they hide behind rocks and come out when i leave, I've had them for about 2 days now. Is this normal? Will it change?


2. How often should I feed them?

3. Will they ever eat the stupid guppy?

4. any other suggestions or comments would be appreciated

[DarthV]

Well I do have some bad news for you, you're going to have to cut back on some of your fish or they will do it for you. An oscar by itself will need at least a 55gal tank...same for the red devil or the green terror. Once your red devil hits about 5-6", everything else in the tank will be dead... devils are very nasty fish! The only combo I can think of for that tank is maybe the jack dempsey and green terror if they are both female...and that is with a very robust filtration system and a very good water maintenance routine.

1. most cichlids are pretty skittish while young and even more so when they are moved into an environment. They should become less spooked in a week or so.

2. I feed my smaller cichlids 3 times a day...enough each time so that they can eat all the food in 30-45secs or so.

3. I'd be surprised if the guppy and tetra live out the week.

[Hunter]

thanks for the reply! i figured the tank was small for the 4 fish. Unfortunatly...people at petsmart don't know sh*t.

The red devil is the most curious and interesting fish and sometimes picks fights, but the JD fought with him, and the red devil actually retreated..

My plan is to sell them when they become big and start over..

What should I feed them? I have blood worms/ pellets and can buy live feeder fish...whats best?


My plan is not to let them get huge. so ill sell them once they get around 5 inches.

Any thoughts?

also , what type of fish do u have?

[dbcb314]

1. its normal, be patient

2. thats pretty much up to you. my bro feeds his fish 3 times a day, i feed mine once. no more than 3 times though.

3. yes, im surprised its not already gone.

4. ok, you got some work to do. there is no way a green terror, red devil, jack dempsey and a tiger oscar will last in that tank. in fact, each one of those fish should be housed in a bigger tank alone. you need to get rid of the red devil and tiger oscar for sure. oscar gets way to big, red devil gets way too mean. it will destroy the fish you have with it. if i were you, i would get rid of all of your fish, take them to the lfs. either get smaller american cichlids (firemouths, convicts, rainbow, ect), community fish (tetras, danios, ect), or africans. you may (if you want) could keep either the green terror or jack dempsey. you would have to keep the green terror alone most likely, but you could probably keep the jd (jack dempsey) with some other stuff. but since you are a begginer, i would take them all back.

[dbcb314]

i didnt see Darth reply, must of did it while i was typing.

Hunter,

sorry to say this, but i doubt they last until they get 5 inches. the red devil might just kill them all at any time, especially if he grows faster than the gt and jd. the jd backing done the red devil is a fluke. it wont happen for long. red devils are mean as heck. plus, you wont get hardly anything for them. just sell them now and save yourself the money spent on food.

[Hunter]

well ****, sounds like i f'ed up:) I still love them all!

The red devil is the smallest fish of all, i did that b/c i had heard of how mean they are. I mean right now, the oscar is the only fish who has even chased the guppy....

I know this sounds stupid, but in order of aggression and ability to win a fight, what is the order of my fish?

[scott]

Welcome to AC Hunter! Where in GA are you? I can recommend some stores that will give you better advice and hopefully help you out a little.

If I were you I would skip the grow em and sell em idea. First off they aren't "worth" anything. You will spend more on food than you will get selling your fish. You need to have a rare or wild fish to get some money for it.

As previously stated your tank is, well, a disaster waiting to happen. If I could venture a guess I would say keep the red devil and return the other fish. Feed him pellet staple with a mix of frozen blood worm, mysis and formula two (pm me I'll tell you where to get it if your in ATL) with some spinach and romaine mixed in. Give him some ghost shrimp once a week and kick down the twenty bucks to get a ten gallon quarantine tank set up for some feeder fish. HTH.

[Hunter]

I am in Smyrna ...Thanks for the welcome...


The fish i considered having only one of was either a tilapia buter.....i cant spell it....or the red devil.

I will definetly stick with the cichlids

[Hunter]

i also have a pleco:)

[scott]

Both are cichlids.

Try taking back all of your fish. Don't ask for money. Keep the Devil. Add five giant danios. In three days I think you will see the true power of these fish. PM me I'll give you some stores.

[Hunter]

is it normal for my tank to kinda smell....a little like mildew....:(

[DarthV]

If I had to choose 1 species of cichlids for a 55gal, I'd probbaly go with the red devil...very interesting fish... once it gets a little larger it will probably charge and strike the glass trying to get at you. :)

As for food, try hikari cichlid gold or new life spectrum cichlid food. Both come highly recommended from a lot of cichlid keepers. I've switched over to some of kensfish.com's cichlid pellets and my fish love it, so that's another option. For treats and to vary diet, I throw in some bloodworms, spirulina sticks, shelled peas, fresh shrimp and live earthworms...

[Hunter]

What do y'all think about a tilapia for a single fish?

personality?

aggression?

do they eat lots of feeder fish?



OOPS YOU ALREADY ANSWERED SORRY DARTH

[peifc]

Originally posted by Hunter
I am in Smyrna ...Thanks for the welcome...


The fish i considered having only one of was either a tilapia buter.....i cant spell it....or the red devil.

I will definetly stick with the cichlids

You mean Tilapia Buttekoferi. That fish is nasty. Some said it is nastier than Red Devil. Some said Red Devil is nastier.

Even though your Red Devil is small right now, but that thing will turn his/her table on other fish. Red Devil is a predator. I have seen them give sneak attack on their own kind at the LFS.

As for Buttekoferi, this fish grows fast...as fast as Oscar. And it is so nasty that will kill any fish that house with it. Unless you plan to keep that fish solo. Red Devil is same as Buttekoferi. Most people will house such big fish in 75g tank alone. Might wanna think about saving money to get a bigger tank for these big guys.

If you want to see Red Devil in action, go to http://www.reddevilfish.co.uk/index.htm.

If you want to research more on other predator cichlids, visit these sites. These people have experiences on these predators and pretty much sum up what you need to know.

http://community-2.webtv.net/MorganaLaFey/StansAquariumPage/
www.aquamojo.com
www.cichlidscene.com

[DarthV]

Originally posted by Hunter
is it normal for my tank to kinda smell....a little like mildew....:(

Mildew? how long have you had this tank setup? If you just bought your tank and fish the same day, you might want to read up on how to do a fishless cycle! Take ALL of you fish back to the store and get in store credit and then read up on how to properly cycle your tank. I fear that you red devil might not have a chance to kill the other fish, ammonia or nitrite will do the job for him and kill the devil as well.

[scott]

Your tank smells for lack of water changes. Change forty to fifty percent of the volume per week.

[Hunter]

IVE had the tank for a week before i put fish in there....i checked for amonia, it was at 0..... so i dont think its that


What else could it be?

[peifc]

Well, all tanks (especially the new one) need to be cycled before any fish is added in. My 72g tank, I have to cycle for a month before I add any fish in there.

[scott]

Hunter, check out cycling. Your tank smells because of build up of waste in the water. Water changes will help. If you haven't cycled the tank pm me.

[Hunter]

****

[Hunter]

am i screwed?:confused: :mad:

[DarthV]

Not screwed, but lubed and bent over ;)

You might be ok if any local pet stores carry a product called Biospira. It can cycle a tank almost instantly (or claims to, some members have tried it successfully).

If not,

Take the fish back and get your money back or in store credit for the full value of the fish. Then start doing a fishless cycle with clear ammonia...it should only take 10-14days or so to do it that way, then you can add in a red devil and the giant danios.

[Hunter]

So if i get bio spira, then not only am i lubed up, but it will get spit on!? ...j/k

ok, so ill get bio spira...how much $$$$? and what is a Danio?

[DarthV]

Giant danios are 4" or so torpedo shaped speed machines...they are lightning quick...they will give your devil something to chase after.

I've never seen any Biospira where I live, but I think you're looking at probably $40 for enough to do a 55gal tank. It has to be kept refrigerated or frozen (can't remember which) so it is pretty pricey, but supposedly it works great.

scott should be able to direct you to any stores that carry it in GA.

[Hunter]

will my tank be ok overnight u think? not like I have an option.... Unfortunatly, im really busy with my job, so it will be tomorow afternoon till i get it

[peifc]

Your fish will be ok for another day.

[DarthV]

I would go ahead and do a 30% water change or so, just to knock the ammonia concentration down. Make sure the water is dechlorinated before being added to the tank.

[Hunter]

k thanks a lot
for the info....ill have lots of other questoins...please bare with me:)

[Hunter]

you know whats weird...my oscar is the only one that chases the guppy and tetra around , the jd and gt dont...the red devil very little... why is the oscar a lot more aggressive toward bate fish?

[DarthV]

Hrmmm with an oscar, I wouldn't say that's aggression. Oscars will eat pretty much anything that they can catch and that can fit in their mouths! There is a huge difference between aggression and feeding behavior. Cichlids like the red devil, red terror and trimac (to name 3) are very aggressive fish...for the most part they aren't out to kill other fish for food..it's more territorial aggression...they want to eliminate any fish that they see as threats for food or breeding grounds. Then again the guapotes cichlids are both predators and very aggressive for territory. This makes matching up tankmates a little on the difficult side!

[dave76]

My GT is a pussycat most of the time unless feeding. Then he can be a pr*ck. Tilapia buttikoferi is an extremely aggressive african, probably the most aggressive african. imho they are rather drab in appearance and it only fades as they get older. If you want to get one make sure you see what an adult fish looks like compared to a juvenile fish. And shoot the questions away, thats why we hang out here, is to talk about fish and try and help out ya know;) .

[dbcb314]

ive cycled all my tanks with fish. the 55 i used zebra danios. my 30 i used africans of some sort (dont remember). my 20 i used tiger barbs. in my bros 30 he used giant danios. in fact, i was told to cycle a tank with either zebra danios or giant danios. back then, i never heard of a fishless cycle...

[Hunter]

well i just added some bio spira....and changed the water before hand ...about a 25-30 percent change. They should be better.

The amonia was at a .50 ppm concentration....i know not good, but the bio spira should take care of it right?

[dave76]

just keep your eye on the ammonia, and to help out with the levels I would cut your feeding waaaay down, the less food they have the less waste they produce the less ammonia in your tank.

[Hunter]

thanks for the reply. But my tank still stinks....:( :confused: what the f**k is up with that? Its really clean... no visible mildew...will it just take time for the biological filter to develope?

[DarthV]

If it is an earthy type smell, then it's normal... a well established tank will have that kind of light smell, but it definitely shouldn't be too strong.

[dave76]

Doing the water change method yes it will take quite some time to develop. Think of the bio filter as algae and ammonia as sunlight. Without sunlight algae will not grow. ammonia is the fuel for nitrifying bacteria. and when you do water changes you are diluting the fuel for your bio filter. At levels of .5ppm ammonia can definatly hurt your fish. adding bio spira will speed the development of your bio filter but without ammonia present to feed the bacteria it will just die off. Did you take any of the fish back or do you still have the whole population?

[Hunter]

i still have the whole population....it is still at .5 ppm.... even though i added the bio spira last night.....

there also is very very hard to see while stuff on the inside of the tank walls.. looks like tiny white cotton stuff..is this the bacteria? or what? algea?

yes i have the whole population, and they are getting along good, the red devil is still just really hyper and curious but definetly not aggresive toward the other guys.....they oscar is always hungry, but again he is bigger than the other guys.

The JD is a puss*Y HE IS always scared.....and the GT always goes really fast, and puts on the brakes, swims really fast, puts on the brakes... hes kinda weird.

[Hunter]

nevermind, the oscar goes after my green terror and JD he leaves the red devil alone

Hes a good bit bigger than the other cichlids at least 3 inches if not more

[scott]

Google planaria. Might be the white things. It's from over feeding and over population. We have already established this. I would recommend taking back the fish you don't want ASAP. If the tank has been set up about a week the chasing is starting now because they have become comfortable and are establishing territory. Nipped fins will soon occur. Death will eventually follow although they are probably to small to actually kill each other right now. Stress from all of the chasing can kill them though. Cutting down the population will also reduce the waste, surely the reason you still have ammonia levels.