sugar and yeast mix....smell?

[Andy16]

Does the sugar and yeast smell bad when if ferments?

[djlen]

You won't smell anything until you go to change bottles. When you dump the old stuff it'll smell briefly until it all goes down the drain. I don't think it smells all that bad. Kinda smells like bad "rot-gut".
Len

[Starry]

It's not supposed to smell while it's hooked up because your hook-up should be really tight. When you open the bottle to dump it, it'll smell like alcohol, which is the by-product of the fermentation.

However, mine smelled one time, and it wasn't the alcohol smell. I used really really old Jell-O (like 5 years expired or something, I found it in the back of a cabinet), and it smelled really bad. I only use fresh ingredients now :)

[anonapersona]

Be sure to not let it spill anywhere. I cap the fresh bottle before I leave the kitchen and I cap the old bottle before I return to the kitchen to dump it, just in case I should trip over the cat.

Be sure to never let the tank water siphon down the tubing if the bottle is located below the tank. I set the bottle and bubble counter/scrubber on top of the hood before I change out bottles and leave it there until it is going well.

Even so, with the water pump that powers the reactor in the bigger tank, on occasion it has managed to spill out even above the tank. Even the bubble counter water smells bad. I now change it with every bottle of yeast. Makes me wonder what has gotten into the bubble counter.

[Andy16]

Its just a diy reactor hooked up to a diy duffuser. My parents wouldnt want to have my room smell like alchohol:D

[mogurnda]

Doesn't smell in operation, but I find it pretty foul when I dump the old cultures. My wife says it smells like a bakery, but it smells to me like a track shoe.

[Andy16]

I couldnt just dump it outside then. Thanks every1.

[Mgamer20o0]

i think its best just to get a new bottle every time.

[Andy16]

So a new 2 liter bottle everytime you change it?

[superjohnny]

A new bottle is unnecessary (besides, you shouldn't be drinking that much soda anyway). Once you put the top back on it doesn't smell anymore.

As a general rule of thumb... anything that ferments will have a strong odor. Keep your nose away from the lid and you're fine.

And for the rest of the kids out there... if you drink it you won't get drunk, you'll get really sick (like stick-your-head-in-the-toilet sick).

[mogurnda]

And for the rest of the kids out there... if you drink it you won't get drunk, you'll get really sick (like stick-your-head-in-the-toilet sick). Sounds like something one would do on a bet. Like drinking the scuzz from a protein skimmer.

I always use a new bottle, because I drink too much soda.

[Andy16]

I was not planning on drinking it. lol. SO it shouldnt make like a room smell or anyhting. Just when you change it.

[anonapersona]

Originally posted by superjohnny

And for the rest of the kids out there... if you drink it you won't get drunk, you'll get really sick (like stick-your-head-in-the-toilet sick).

Really, have you ever tasted it? It smells nasty, but the bubble counter water smells like setlzer water maybe with a tiny whiff of alcohol, maybe. I didn't have the guts to taste it.

Someone online was discussing whether the alcohol could travel with the CO2, into the tank or into the bubble counter fluid. Being water soluble, I doubt it would travel in the gas. But, I don't know. I sure wouldn't ever drink that nasty brew.

FWIW, my son was trying to brew his own soda pop, using blackberry juice and yeast. The info he had suggested that the mix in a sealed 2 liter bottle would get carbonated long before it fermented, fermentaion would take about a month. He tried it, but he didn't use much sugar. It carbonated well in a few days -- I made him quit as I was so worried that the bottle would explode and, even inside the plastic bag, be powerful enough to mess up the kitchen. He tasted his soda and it was not good, you could taste the yeast. It was interesting nontheless.

[cpr4cpu]

the swill in the bottom of the bottle is pretty foul smelling, but harmless unless there is unfermeted yeast which can continue to ferment (much faster in your belly than in the bottle) and cause excessive intestinal distress.

If you can smell the stuff you either have a leak at the bottle, or the flow rate is too fast in the water column and the smell is escaping through the airline in the tank. I do not use a bubble counter so I go directly from the bottles into the tank and when the CO2 is too fast to disslove, some of the faint fermentation smell is noticeable, to combat theis I have reduced the quantity of brew in the bottle to half full, not 2/3 or 3/4 full. It seems to have helped.

[Andy16]

Thanks for all of your help! Has any of your reactors ever exploded? I would liek to know how to prevent this.

[swampfox25]

Some one said never to let the water siphen into the bottle. Whould one of those $0.99 checkvalves work or would this make the bottle gain to much pressure before it can open it?? Just an idea I duno if anyone has tried it

[anonapersona]

i found the one time I relied on the checkvalve it had failed, perhaps carbonic acid ate it up, I don't know. I just make sure to put the bottle on the tank, with the line looped on top of the bottle, as the water pump pressure in the reactor gives about 6 inches of water rise above the tank level when the bottle is uncovered, even on top of the tank. And always have a towel handy.

[Andy16]

So make sure the bottle is above the tank? Im thinking abouti making a box to put it in so if it does explode it wont get all over.

[anonapersona]

Originally posted by Andy16
So make sure the bottle is above the tank? Im thinking abouti making a box to put it in so if it does explode it wont get all over.

Better to plan for it not exploding that to plan on it doing so.

It is fine to have the bottle below the tank while it is making gas well, the bottle is ugly and there is room to hide it below the tank. But, if you open the bottle, the loss of pressure will suck water up the airline from the tank (actually it seem to be water expanding as it absorbs the gas, but I'm not sure of the mechanism -- whatever, it draws water up the line.). Once that water gets above the edge of the tank, gravity makes it flow down the line all over the floor. So, just don't do that.

If you open the bottle, put it on top of the tank first. Easy.

That isn't exploding, it just runs yeasty sugar water from the generator, or even the bubble counter, up the line to the tank if you aren't careful. A check valve ought to hold it. I don't know why mine failed. I don't trust check valves that are plastic that have had CO2 and water in them now.

The reactor could explode, I've read about that in the old Krib archives, but never in recent times as far as I know. More often some pet or sibling or baby knocks it over. Nasty goo travels up the line into the tank. The soda bottles are unstable so tie it to something or use a square juice type bottle.

If the airstone has fouled from not using a bubble counter, you'll probably notice that reduced rate before much pressure would build up. If you had a bubble counter that fouling wont happen.

f you have a bubble counter you'd notice if it were filled with yeasty goo. The bubble counter liquid would have traveled into the tank, but it is pretty clean water, not dangerous. It ain't fool proof but it buys you time to notice the problem.

So, if you're going to build anything, build a bubble counter, and make sure the line is long enough so that you can easily move the generator and the bubble counter to the top of the tank together, be sure the lines are long enough.

[Andy16]

Since i dont know what a bubble counter is or what it does i cant really build one:( This is like hte stupidest i ever felt when it came to my aquarium. lol.

[superjohnny]

I can understand you not knowing what it is, but you should know what it does... it helps count bubbles.

Check this out: http://www.petsmart.com/products/product_33004.shtml

The bubble counter is the gray thing in the middle with the two black suction cups at the top. CO2 enters from the bottom and floats up the series of stair steps until it is released at the top. This not only helps you count the number of bubbles your CO2 is putting out, but it increases the length of time the CO2 is exposed to water and thereby helps it dissolve. It's not as efficient as a CO2 diffuser, but it works ok.

[Andy16]

I was actually thinking about buying that instead of making it all myself.

If you have to count the bubbles, when are you supposed to stop? Don the bubbles just keep on coming out?

[superjohnny]

If you are trying to measure something your measurementhas to be relative to something. In this case it is relative to time. So you may want to measure how many bubbles come out per minute or per second.

That Hagen thing is basically the same as a 2 liter bottle. It is a chamber where the yeast/sugar reaction occurs... nothing more. It is better looking than a Pepsi bottle, but IMO any hardware is unattractive.

Save your $ and DIY. It's very simple to modify a 2 ltr bottle & cap. Just drill a hole in the cap, shove some tubing in there and seal it and you're done. There's nothing special about it.

[anonapersona]

parts for the DIY

generator:
bottle - 2L soda or 2L juice
drill with small bits
sealant - several in case one fails
alcohol - to clean surfaces before sealing
6 ft silicone tubing ($8)
small bottle for bubble counter

reactor:
pump or powerhead ($10) or the filter in or output
large cylinder, clear (found item)
filter sponge, bioballs or scrubbie ($2 scrubbie, had filter sponges)
sealant ($8 aquarium sealant bought, had Liquid Nails on hand when that failed)
maybe airstone, maybe not ($1 for 2)

Or filter to feed bubbles into that won't lock up and actually does a good enough job. I'm not comfortable that this won't damage parts so I won't do that.

If you have all that laying around, make it. If you don't have that accumulation of aquarium junk yet, buying all the bits and parts is going to be a bit of $ and a lot of running around by the time you are through.

I spent as shown above to build the DIY for the 29 gallon. The Hagen at $20 was slightly cheaper, not much. But it never leaks, never siphons. I have both, I like both, both work, for nearly the same cost, one is a whole lot easier and actually more adjustable for the small tank in that you can turn it down but you can't turn it up for the larger tank.

Now that I have more junk accumulated, I could build one for nothing out-of-pocket. If (when) I set up another 10 or 20 gallon, I'll buy a Hagen for it probably, just tacking it onto the next online purchase. For 30 to 40 gallons, I'd DIY.

[anonapersona]

Originally posted by Andy16
If you have to count the bubbles, when are you supposed to stop? Don the bubbles just keep on coming out?

LOL!

[anonapersona]

Sorry to laugh, just the picture in my head...

here is a link with photos what will help you to see what we are talking about

CO2 article from eheim-UK site Corydorus World article and photo by Matt Nace (http://www.corydorasworld.com/diyco2.htm)

[Andy16]

But wheres the bubble counter? i understadn the generator part.

[anonapersona]

Hmm, somebody help, we need a photo of a bubble counter.

that great treatise on CO2 by laSeur or something like that that was located at the corydoras site is gone, won't come up.

I can'tt think of any other sites that show a bubble counter.

I'll describe mine; A small glass soda bottle with 2 holes drilled in the top, water in it, one airline goes into the water the other does not.

The input line comes from the CO2 generator and goes into the bottle about 1 1/2 inches below the surface of the water in the bottle. The gas bubbles through the water and leaves the bottle from the second line that is above the water level.

I can see the bubble rise and count how fast they are going. If it is 20 per minute, that might be too much, if it is 3 per minute that is too little. In between is OK. It has a rather steady decline so I can decide when I need to change the bottle.

[Andy16]

I sorta gotcha but i cant totally picture it. That was a good link or the co2 generator though.

[anonapersona]

Aquabotanic store - Aquamedic bubble counter (http://www.aquabotanic.com/abstore/index.html) (need to clink on CO2 systems on left and then scroll down to go to the parts I want you to see)

this one seems to be set up for the glass to be on the bottom, full of water, as I described, the long tube is the input, the bubbles rise through the water and exit out a short tube, not really seen in this photo, just imagine the glass about half full of water.

Mine is sort of based on these, but I use a 6 oz glass soda bottle and cap for the glass part and I don't have a rigid tube, just the airline extending into the bottle. I've done them with rigid tubes, but that was just one more part to leak. (Leakes have plagued the DIY stuff!)


Another type is run with input on the bottom, outtake from the top, the bubble counter is the clear glass part.

Custom Aquatics- regulator, solonoid and bubble counter combo (http://www.customaquatic.com/customaquatic/pic1.asp?CatID=co&brandID=MK&itemid=co-MKMA957US)

Note that both of these use checkvalves, but metal, not plastic.


Going back to the Aquabotanic site, look at the Turbo powered reactor. And the

Aquabotanic - plantgulid Turbo power Reactor (http://www.aquabotanic.com/abstore/index.html)

See the little tube going into the unit? If you turn the water pump part off, and the unit is inside the tank, you can count the bubbles as they rise (while it is on there is just a whirl of bubbles and you can't count anything) I don't recall if there is a check valve in that one.

Also at Aquabotanic, look at the Reactor 500, this one runs with flow down and bubbles going up, you can see the bubbles and it is powered for greater dissolution. Compare that to the Hagen non-powered diffuser, almost the same thing, but flat and no powered counter-flow.

So you can see the gamut of types of bubble counters and varieties of reactors that may or may not include a built in bubble counter.

Most of these are sort of easy to build, if you have stuff laying around and are handy, or for not much difference than the cost and run-around time, you can just buy one that works fromthe start, no needing to mess with it, fixing leaks and whatever.

Several different ways to do the same thing.

[superjohnny]

Andy I don't know if you read my earlier post so I'll re-post it.

Click Here --> http://www.petsmart.com/products/product_33004.shtml

The bubble counter is the gray thing in the middle with the two suction cups on top. It's next to the big gray container.

The thing is... bubble counters are ANYTHING THAT HELPS YOU COUNT BUBBLES. This is just one example.

[Hebdizzle]

the bubble counter and the reactor are the same thing for HAGEN!

Aaron

[Andy16]

Well it sounds simple enough. I cant wait to get started because this is going to be my first diy project.

[superjohnny]

You don't need a drill, but you do need something to cut a hole into the cap with. I use a leather hole punch from my all-purpose tool. Make the hole round and slightly smaller than the CO2 tubing. I use aquarium sealant to prevent leaks. $1.79 at the LFS.

If your mom catches you using her good pearing knife to drill a hole in a pop cap you're going to be in for a world of hurt. Consider yourself warned ;)

[Andy16]

:D We have a drill thing that i can use to make it easier. does the hole size matter?

[anonapersona]

yes it matters, I think 11/16ths is the size you want, better to get it as small as possible and enlarge if required. If you use silicone tubing, it may hold tight with no sealant.

It is hard to pull it through, cut on a diagonal and pull with a pair of needle nose pliers. If you can't do it, enlarge ever so slightly with the next sized bit. Keep the edges very smooth and clean, no ragged bits. Cut the tubing a bit long in case it tears and yu have to try again.

[Andy16]

Thank you for all of your help!
I have thought of a cheaper and healthier alternative then a SODA bottle, its very simple, a WATER bottle.

[superjohnny]

Hehehe :) You're a good man Andy ;)

[Starry]

-----> http://www.qsl.net/w2wdx/aquaria/diyco2.html

everything you need to know about DIY CO2, except the Jell-O recippe. And trust me, you want the Jell-O recipe. More stable, lasts for 2-3 months, versus 2-3 weeks for regular. To get the Jell-O recipe, go to my website (http://aquaplants.web1000.com/art1.html - I think)
or do a search for DIY Jell-O CO2 on a search engine or here on AC forums.

[Andy16]

I couldnt get into your site starry:( It said i needed a user name and password. The other website was very informative thouigh thanks;)