blue-green bacteria

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fishfrenze

Flower Girl @}---'---
Jul 29, 2003
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Hello,
I've been "lurking" around these forums for a couple weeks now and have been learning alot! However, I need your help with a problem I have in my 30 gallon planted tank...it seems that blue-green bacteria has taken hold and is beginning to form "slime" layers on the gravel and driftwood. The tank has been set up for about a year, but has only contained plants for about 3 months (my first attempt :) ). I have recently started adding Flourish Excel and am wondering if this has anything to do with the blue-green outbreak?? Also, my Anacharis "melted" away over the course of a week (for what reason, I still can't determine) so now I only have a few small pieces growing. I'm wondering if the death of this plant gave the blue-green an opportunity to take hold since I heard the plant is thought to have "antibacterial" properties. I would be so grateful for any suggestions on how to irradicate the cyanobacteria and then prevent its return. Thank you in advance!

Melanie

Tank Specs:
30 gallon
3 watts/gallon pc fluorescent lighting
pH: 7.6
KH: 4 dH
NO3: 8-10 ppm
NH3: 0 ppm
NO2: 0 ppm
Fert. regime: Flourish (2.5 ml 2x/week), Flourish Phosphorus (0.75 ml 1x/week), Flourish Excel (2.5 ml 3-4x/week), and Leaf Zone (15 ml 1x/week).
**I will be playing around with DIY CO2 on my 72 gallon this weekend (no fish yet...still fishless cycling). If all goes well, I hope to add DIY CO2 to this 30 gallon!
 
Calling Tom Barr....

Melanie needs help!

I wish I could give you the correct advice, but I'm no plant expert.. We have had a bout of cyno-bacteria and it's not fun. A 3 day total blackout (not a good word, oh well), may be needed. This will weaken your plants some, but they may come back just fine...

There are certain nutrients needed, in certain doses... Hope others can offer much more.

Looks like you don't have CO2 DIY or injection going on.
 
My bet?

Tom Barr will say that you need to dose iron, Flourish Traces (a lot of it), Potassium and add CO2 to balance out your light level.

But that's just what I think Tom will say. Don't take any of that as gospel until you see it written in his own hand. :)
 
Thank you, thank you, thank you! So much information!!

Melanie-- When you refer to *fishless* cycling, do you mean that you have been adding ammonia?
Click to expand...
Not quite...I've been adding fish food and allowing it to break down.

Looks like you don't have CO2 DIY or injection going on.
Click to expand...
No, and I think this is the main thing limiting my tank. I was always reluctant b/c I was worried about pH crashes, reactor explosions, etc. But since I have an empty 72 gallon in its cycle, I figured this will be a good time to mess around with DIY. I think the next step will be adding it to my 30 gallon to get these plants off and running!

----------
I've regretted the choice of gravel as the substrate for the 30 gallon and have wanted to change it. Now with the BGA outbreak, I have more motivation to break down the tank and start over...this time with CO2 injection, KNO3 dosing, and increased trace dosing....like Tom Barr suggests. I'm actually thinking of gradually moving the fish and plants (after thorough sterilization of course) over to the 72 gallon when the cycle is complete. That will allow me to change out the substrate (I have a couple left-over bags of Profile) and play with DIY CO2 on the 30 gallon. Then I will gradually move the fish back. I know there are easier ways to rid myself of BGA, but this way I can take care of 2 things at once. With the new substrate, CO2 injection, and new fert. dosing, I can hopefully prevent BGA from ever returning!

Again, thanks for the wealth of information!

Melanie
 
Could the outbreak problem be the cycling method? I thought I read here that plants + fishless cycling does not work. Searching found a few threads, I did not go through them all but here is one:
http://64.191.28.50/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7304&highlight=fishless+cycle+plants

Also, clarification? First you said you have no fish then the last post stated I'm actually thinking of gradually moving the fish and plants (after thorough sterilization of course) over to the 72 gallon when the cycle is complete.
 
Plants don't need a cycled tank, why would they?

They remove the NH4 directly and the end product of the bacterial cycle, NO3, as well. Plus they remove PO4, K, CO2 etc and add O2.

Generally hair algae and green water will be caused if you have too much NH4.

The solution is the same though, grow the plants well and the algae does not grow.

I would suggest with 3w/gal of PC lighting on a 72 al tank to get CO2. There's no way Excel will add enough carbon for your plants at this light level/intensity. DIY is okay for smaller tanks but a large tank with nice lighting certainly warrants a gas CO2 system. And for the cost of a needle valve, you can add CO2 to the 30 gallon tank also.

Your nutrients will not matter until you address the CO2 issue, you will have bad algae till you do.
You can either lower the lighting level to about 1.8-2w/gal and use excel or get CO2 gas and keep the lighting level.
You can also lower the lighting level and add CO2. Lower light + CO2 yield some of the nicest results for folks generally, I'm a bit more advanced/experienced and use high light. Many new folks are frustrated with higher light.

Regards,
Tom Barr
 
I'm talking about too many tanks at once here. :) I have 3 watts/gallon on my 30 gallon which has been set up and cycled for a year. That's the tank with the BGA problem. I also have a 72 gallon which is fish-less cycling. This tank will have 2.25 watts/gallon once I order the bulbs and get the hood set up. When I mentioned gradually moving the fish over, I meant from the 30 gallon established tank to the 72 gallon once its done cycling. Sorry for the confusion :)
I guess CO2 is my first priority here...I plan on working on that tomorrow and hopefully will be able to black-out the tank by next weekend (wincing and holding breath...I'll be ok :) ).

Melanie
 
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