View Full Version : Tetras are territorial?
stoopid
09-04-2003, 8:50 PM
I noticed that over time my 6 Black striped tetras and 6 Snow tetras have taken on territories in the tank. When I first introduced the Black tetra they schooled together a lot, then slowly began picking on each other and establishing rank. Then, once the Snow tetras were added, it's become a territory game. The only time they come together is during feeding.
Since I only feed them once a day, should I increase that? I am thinking they're hungry or at least feel food isn't plenty enough so they establish territories to ensure 'their own'.
Reason I ask is I would prefer to not increase feeding frequencies as the water quality's good in the tank ATM. If it's just normal behavior I'll live with that, although I bought them with the intent of having them be my schooling fish.
ChilDawg
09-04-2003, 9:38 PM
I think that the tank might be a little crowded, and the Tetras may be feeling that and showing it in their behavior.
anonapersona
09-04-2003, 9:40 PM
My ember tetras have done the same thing. Each has staked out a roughly 3 inch square, I wonder if they take turns sleeping behind the log.
Maybe I'm an optimist, but I think it is done to insure that the school all gets food should it begin to rain from the sky suddenly.
when food does appear, no tetra seems to try to chase the ohters away.
stoopid
09-04-2003, 9:45 PM
I guess overcrowding's a possibility I didn't consider...
If a tetra swims into another's territory it gets chased away, but once food is present they all abandon their stations to eat and seem to return to their assigned seats once the feeding's done... so I can't see much positive from this (maybe I need to round a few up and return them to the LFS).
ChilDawg
09-04-2003, 9:47 PM
Are they overzealous in their guarding of territories? If not, I wouldn't worry about it *for now*, but as some of the cichlids grow, you may have water quality issues rather than territoriality issues.
wetmanNY
09-04-2003, 11:11 PM
Are these Black Neons? I've noticed some "station-keeping" too --like a moveable, temporary, personal territory. Mine are competitive and hardly swarm together at all. Unlike the GlowLights in the same tank...
anonapersona
09-05-2003, 7:57 AM
With the ember tetras, always 8 were out in open water, in roughly the same spots, but not always, and the spots do change. One tetra has a crooked tail fin and I can see he's moved from front and center to the side.
I see the ones toward the back seem to be sleeping, still and slow to notice if food appears. The ones in the front are alert and defend their spot, or maybe the captain is chasing the enlisted men back to their posts out in front where strange things suddenly appear.
Sorry to move in on this post. But what is a "snow" tetra??:confused:
stoopid
09-05-2003, 8:31 AM
Black tetra (http://www.random-abstract.com/archives-gm/00002025.html)
I can't seem to find the white ones... the ones listed as "snow" and "white" tetra don't look quite right.
They just chase the intruder out of their little section and go back to being fish... maybe I shouldn't care, but it's hard getting decent schooling fish in my tank with 3 medium sized cichlids.
ChilDawg
09-05-2003, 9:04 AM
Fishbase doesn't have a "Snow Tetra".
Could the January Tetra (http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.cfm?ID=12367&genusname=Hemigrammus&speciesname=hyanuary) be what you're keeping?
stoopid
09-05-2003, 9:06 AM
Nah, I think their name has something to do with their fins... they're body type is like the Black tetras, but they're off white and slightly smaller.
ChilDawg
09-05-2003, 9:10 AM
I found a "Hi-fin Snow Tetra" on someone's personal page, but I have no clue what they are as there are no pix...so they look kinda like the Black Widow?
stoopid
09-05-2003, 9:16 AM
Originally posted by ChilDawg
I found a "Hi-fin Snow Tetra" on someone's personal page, but I have no clue what they are as there are no pix...so they look kinda like the Black Widow?
yeah, their body type is exactly like the larger black ones.
Tetras are not really "territorial", but schooling fish do have "personal space" requirements. Think of it as a bubble of space around the fish. They do have a pecking order within the school, just as Barbs do. If there are more of them (the normal colored Blacks and the "albino"/amelanistic form are the same fish) than the tank can handle, you get exactly the situation described.
It is not necessarily a bioload over-crowding, but a personal space overcrowding. Schooling fish cannot or will not school unless several requirements are met - one of theose being significantly more swimming space than the total required by the personal spaces of all the memebers of the group. Black Widows (the old name) are among the fiestier Tetras.
HTH
stoopid
09-05-2003, 9:45 AM
Makes sense, and that would explain why the Black ones can steal the cichlid's food during feeding and not get their arse handed to them :p
I'll need to contact my LFS and see about bringing the white ones back (if I can catch them).
ChilDawg
09-05-2003, 9:46 AM
So the "Snow Tetras" are just amelanistic Black Widows?
Jeez, that was a lot of Googling to come up empty-handed and find out that the answer was that easy...thanks, RTR!
I have seen the fish in both color forms (can dyed be far away? Or are they out already?) under so many names I can't track them all. I still think "Black Widow" - which seems uncommon these days. IMHO it suits the fish as it hints of their temperament.
And you are welcome. :cool:
OrionGirl
09-05-2003, 2:09 PM
Sadly, the dyed form is out. I've seen them in 'halloween' colors, orange dyed in with the natural black.
ChilDawg
09-05-2003, 2:44 PM
www.***************** is selling all the berry colors of the Black Widow. Boo to them.
wetmanNY
09-05-2003, 5:58 PM
Before they were "Black Widows" these tetras were "Merry Widows"-- nowadays who knows what the words "operetta" or "corset" even mean?
ChilDawg
09-05-2003, 6:08 PM
Originally posted by RTR
Aggghh! :mad:
My sentiments exactly. What dumbassed scheme can they come up with next?
stoopid
09-06-2003, 10:52 AM
I traded in my 6 whitish/snow tetra for an Odessa Barb, and now the remaining 6 black tetra are much more at ease. The new barb's pretty active and colorful, surprised my cichlids just ignore him...
So the verdict was overcrowding (of tetra). Thanks to all.
ChilDawg
09-06-2003, 10:58 AM
You might wind up with a problem keeping the Odessa solo. They're "naturally" (not found in the wild, but their nature is that to which I'm referring) gregarious...
stoopid
09-08-2003, 6:59 AM
Originally posted by ChilDawg
You might wind up with a problem keeping the Odessa solo. They're "naturally" (not found in the wild, but their nature is that to which I'm referring) gregarious...
Yeah, he's a handful, but boy does he keep the tank active! (and helps those remaining Tetras stay in shape).
ChilDawg
09-08-2003, 8:01 AM
If it works for you, more power to you! :)
As long as it's not out-and-out destroying the other fish in the tank, it would be okay, I guess.
stoopid
09-08-2003, 11:18 AM
Originally posted by ChilDawg
If it works for you, more power to you! :)
As long as it's not out-and-out destroying the other fish in the tank, it would be okay, I guess.
So far he only cares about the Tetra, and they're **** fast themselves... at least there's no evidence of damage to any of the tetra yet...
If the Odessa barb is contantly chasing the Tetras, that is damage through stress, whether physical injury is involved or not. If the barb is doing sprints at times after the Tetras, that is not as bad, but frequency would havr to be weighed.
If it were my tank, and it is not, I'd have more barbs or none.
stoopid
09-09-2003, 7:18 AM
Originally posted by RTR
If it were my tank, and it is not, I'd have more barbs or none.
That's sound advice, I'm actually going to be stopping at the LFS Friday to get one or two more (depending on what they have). That was my intent all along as I was told he may want a playmate and I only have enough room or one/two more fish before the tank's "full". If I had the money to spare Friday I would have bought more then.