Guilt ridden Gooner to give you all more grief

[treacle]

Hi folks

My new fish keeping hobby has resulted in my first dalliance with the extremely useful vehicle of forums on the net. However after receiving so much helpful advice a few weeks back, I suddenly find myself reluctant to bother you with yet another problem.

It is as though I feel guilty for not having stayed in touch these past few weeks to tell you that everything has been going relatively well and am only back pestering you the moment I have a problem :)

However I am not going to let my reluctance to take advantage of your good nature and superior knowledge, prevent me asking for help, because at the end of the day, it is my fish that need your assistance and I am their only voice :)

I mentioned the fact that I started having a brown algae problem and along with the fact that I have been told that I have too many tiddlers in my @15 gallon tank, I have been doing regular water changes (about 66%) and gravel cleaning once a week and currently have a more powerful filter than is recommended running in parralel with my piddly filter (I've had the new one about a month and the literature recommends running both for 8 weeks)

On Friday we first noticed what looks like a cell of the brown algae on the long flowing tail of the fish we originally adopted. I think it is a Veil Tail, it is about four inches long but has lost its gold colour and is completely silver/salmon coloured with a gorgeous gossamer tail of about a similar length.

I guess that it might not be the brown algae on its tail (it looks like a single brown transparent cell stuck on one side of the fishes tail fin, with a darker brown dot - more of a dash than a dot as it is narrow but a couple of mm long - running from the centre to the perimeter, if the cell is a circle, the darker brown dash looks like a line measuring the radius) but a parasite and on enquiring at the pet shop, it was suggested that I try to detach it with a fingernail.

Following his advice, I did begin to attempt this, by cornering Ridley with the net when she had nowhere to run as I changed the water yesterday. However I am far too squeamish and couldn't bear to traumatize the poor fish by handling it and although I managed to get her sort of in my hand, there was no way I was going to hang onto her long enough to try and flick the offending object off with a finger nail. :eek: It was far too distressing for the both of us and so before even thinking about giving it another go and freaking the fish out completely, I thought I should seek some more informed advice first, both to find out what it is and how best to get rid of it? :confused:

I certainly wouldn't look forward to the thought of trying again to get it off with my fingernail but it is so obviously attached to one side of her tail that in spite of my cowardice, I cannot look at her in the tank without being tempted to stick my hands in and give it another go

Further to the advice received here when I had an outbreak of Ich, the addition of salt appeared to work so effectively that I was tempted to see if would destroy whatever it is on RIdley's tail but I thought I had better seek your advice before doing anything further. I guess I would also have to remove all the live plants again because I assume that an increased concentration of salt would kill them off?

And I am hoping that one of you kind souls will get back to me fairly soon, or else with my obsessive nature and my inability to stop worrying about it, I will undoubtedly end up down the pet shop soon enough, with the store owner talking me into buying more chemicals to put in my tank (and it would seem unfair having to inflict more chemicals on the other fish just to treat the one)

Once again my utmost thanks in advance for any advice that you can offer to assist me (and Ridley of course) and my apologies for not showing my face anywhere here (I've never been the most sociable sort) in the meantime - unlike at the footie match, I am afraid I am guilty as charged because I "only sing when I'm losing"! Or my cry for help is like the postcard from the long lost son to his folks with the message "weather great, send more money" :D

Peace & Love
Bernard

[stoopid]

Well, I got 2 paragraphs in, then realized the scroll bar was indicating there was a lot more... I gave up when I saw the story...

So, what's your fish problem??

[demon_surfer]

now now stoopid have some patience. :p

Im not going to be much use in this problem unfortunatly. I have never heard of a brown mark on a goldfishes tail. most funguses that i know of stay white. the salt treatment is probably a good place to start however hopefully more knowledgable about goldie illnesses. It may be a parasite but i dont think it would be on the tail in that case.


as you can tell im just guessing but hopefully i can get the ball rolling here.

oh...stoopid does kinda have a point though he did say it in an obnoxious way. I dont mind reading long passages and find your writing style very intresting. but you would get more replises if it was easy to read! :)

hope this helps

[stoopid]

Originally posted by demon_surfer
oh...stoopid does kinda have a point though he did say it in an obnoxious way.

MooooOOOOoooo

[Tempest]

If you have faith in this pet shop to know what they are talking about, I think I'd net the fish, bag it, and take it to them to look at. Perhaps the person who suggested removing the spot would do it for you. At least they would be able to see if it was indeed a parasite and what sort. We have one or two shops in my town who employ specialists who would know but I would give them a call first to see if they were *in* that day.

[Dapple2]

Bernard-

The best bet is to set up a q-tank to treat the fish seperately. (Then you won't have to worry about the affect of the meds on the plants, etc) You can usually find cheap ones second-hand. In the meantime, I'd recommend prophylactic dips, salt dips being the old stand-by. I generally follow the Innes model, starting with two tsp a gallon.

Judging by your wonderful writing style (I think it's fun to get the whole story!), you'll probably find this website highly informative. This link will take you straight to the salt section, but the rest of the site makes for good reading as well. http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/docs/health/salt.shtml#saltbath

If you or someone you can bribe is a good artist, perhaps you (or they) can post us a pic of the nasty ;)

[SimonWoodstock]

wow, i feel like i will be taking a test on this. :)

i bet you have some good pick up lines for the ladies....:cool:

haha

[kveeti]

All I can add is a handy thing to buy and have near the aquarium is a large magnifying glass. Mine is 10x. You could maybe see a lot clearer what you're dealing with.

[famman]

Don't feel guilty about being away, your questions are always welcome.

You could ease up on the water changes I think.

Trying to catch the fish and removing the parasite while possible, is not really practical without sedation, and may not remove the problem anyway. It sounds like a parasite, fluke for instance. Read up on external parasites and appropriate medicines, post any more questions.

good luck
:)

[kveeti]

This looks quite close to your description. About 3/4 ways down there are 3 pictures under fish louse. There's a column with treatment options.
http://www.2cah.com/pandora/Disease.html

[treacle]

Having looked at the disgusting pics, it does look most like the lousy louse but cannot see any legs

There was great whooping and a hollering when I noticed that Ridley the four inch long Veil Tail had somehow managed to lose its unwelcome guest which was attached to its four inch long tail fin. :D

I was hoping that one of the others might have been so hungry that it had eaten it (as I was still hoping in vain that it might be algae) but our delight soon disappeared some hours later when we saw that the 'orrible little organism had attached itself to one of the tiddlers, a one inch long Fan Tail, also on its tail fin :(

However since this fish is much smaller, it might be a lot more feasible to move it into the bowl I have and see if I can either remove it myself (unlikely), or nip around the pet shop for some advice

Nevertheless any further suggestions inspired by a more accurate diagnosis (on the off chance that the fact it has moved from one fish's tail to another makes it easier to identify) would be most gratefully received

Sadly I don't possess a flash mobile phone capable of taking pics, or any kind of digital camera. I will see if I can catch someone round here with one and get a photo

Once again sincerely grateful to all of you who have taken the trouble to get back to me

Kind regards
Bernard

[treacle]

I am feeling particularly proud of myself.

While Ridley was far too wriggly to let me get anywhere near attempting to remove what I assume was a louse, I collected Splash (the little tiddler Fan Tail, so named because it is silver coloured bar the splash of deep orange/red between its eyes and top of its head - which is so distinctive that when I told the missus that I'd got a fish from this particular tank in the pet shop, it turned out to be exactly the same one out of about twenty that she had identified!) by letting him/her swim into the bowl as I put it in the tank.

Once in the bowl I cornered him/her with the net and tried to get at the louse attached to the rear fin. He/she was just as jumpy as Ridley at first but being so much smaller, was much easier to keep under control and then all at once Splash went completely passive. No doubt it's my imagination running eild, but it was so still in my hand, it was as though it knew I was trying to help by removing the bothersome bug

In fact it was so still that for a moment there I thought it had died of shock and instinctively let it go before I had managed to lose the louse, to make sure it was still alive. I then took Splash is tail in my hand again and the louse came away without much hassle, caught it in the net and I'm overjoyed to say that it's probably living the life of riley, with all it's kith and kin, having flushed it down the karsey :D

I am now wondering what caused it to be in my tank in the first place and having read the useful information I was directed to, the most likely source I can think of is the frozen cubes of blood worm which I use as an occasional weekly treat? Could this be the case because I am wondering if I want to try and avoid a repeat performance, I wondered if I should in future stick to the goldfish flakes?

What's more while such 'orrible organisms are obvious on the silver coloured fish, I am almost certain I wouldn't be able to see them on the two pitch black Moors

As always not sure what I would have done without the aid of all your most reassuring replies

Can't thank you enough
TTFN
Bernard (now able to go to sleep without fear of nightmares about the little blighter devouring the entire fish :) )

[demon_surfer]

thats great! glad you got the sucker off him

[Speedy]

Gooner eh? me too although its been a while since ive been to Highbury...come on you reds!!

[Dapple2]

Good deal! I'm sure you and the fish feel much better now!

I kinda doubt he could have come in with the frozen food, but it couldv'e been clinging to the Moors before moving onto a lighter coloured fish...

[treacle]

Thanks Demon, Dapple, Speedy et al

BTW Speedy I was just talking to another Gooner who has literally just emmigrated down your way. Not sure if they're in Auckland but if you are interested in hooking up, let me know

TTFN
Bernard