View Full Version : Ph level
Hi, I am nearing the end of ccycling my new tank and doing daily ph readings to make sure everything is going fine. Today I noticed that my ph had sky rocketed, yesterday morning I had a reading of 7.2 and this morning it was 7.8 (I didnt test it last night, my bad). I pulled some gravel out and did an acid test on it and it didnt fizz, I put some Ph Down in it which dropped the ph momentarly, but after an hour it was back on the rise. I have no rocks in the tank only my gravel and filters. I am kinda at a loss for what is doing this, and was wondering if anyone has any advice to offer. If this has been answered before, please point me to the thread. Any help is greatly appricated.
Thanks
blitzen25bm
10-25-2003, 4:53 AM
was it always 7.2 until today? whats the ph of your tap water. test it for a few more days to see if it stays stable and check it at the same time everyday. you don't have yo mess with the PH just make sure it stays stable and you will be ok.
Hi, Ph of my tap water is 7.35-7.42, it is jumping between these two numbers. And the water has been between 7.15-7.20 for the last week. I put Ph down in it to get it to my desired ph level.
WaterBaby
10-25-2003, 8:21 AM
My pH seems to jump up between the tap and the tank. I "age" water in jugs. When the water comes out of my tap it's around 7.2. By the time I'm ready to do a water change with my aged water, the pH jumps up to around 7.6 to 7.8.
The water in my tank is 7.8, and my fish don't seem to mind it. I have had forum members tell me that a steady pH that is on the high side is better than one that keeps fluctuating.
I used to add a pH stabilizer to get it to 7.0, but found that I spent alot of money on something I didn't need.
JSchmidt
10-25-2003, 11:42 AM
It is not uncommon for tap water to contain dissolved carbon dioxide, which is acidic in solution. In these cases, as the CO2 offgasses into the air, the pH of the water will climb. You can easily check to see if this is the problem in your case. Just draw some tap water into a clean glass, let it sit overnight, and then check pH.
Using pH Down and other pH-adjusters is very often (almost always?) a losing proposition. Generally what tends to happen is that pH drops immediately after adding the stuff, then rebounds by the next day. This pH yo-yo routine is much more stressful on fish than just keeping them in the higher pH water. I keep lots of fish in my pH 7.6 - 7.8 water that are supposed to need soft acidic water, and many others do, too.
With some fish, who are either very sensitive (e.g., discus) or that are being encouraged to breed, the pH is more critical. Mostly, stability is more important.
HTH,
Jim
Ok i've read that most Malawi cichlids can stand high Ph levles which is what will be going in the tank. But I was going to transfer 2 of my bigger clown loaches over from my existing tank whish is @ 6.9 to this new tank as they are getting a bit to big for the tank. I know a change right over to a much higher Ph will stress the poor little things, so I was wondering on whats the best way to acustome them to the new ph they will be moved to a 2-3 weeks time? Sorry if its kinda off topic with the Ph level.
Leopardess
10-25-2003, 8:24 PM
As mentioned, a steady pH is FAR more important than a specific pH (unless you're trying to breed discus, or something of that sort). Also, chemically trying to alter pH is a disaster waiting to happen. If you find your pH to tend to stay rather high, you can consider using peat moss in your filter to lower it...in a natural, steady manner. Driftwood also has a slight affect on pH because it releases tannins. Also, if you have plants (and even if you don't) you can inject co2 into the tank to keep the pH lower, although I'd opt against this unless you know how to keep the co2 ppms steady.
As for transferring the fish, do what you do when you get new fish. Remove the fish from their current tank and place them into some sort of clean container. Gradually add water from the tank that they will be going into. That way the shift isn't quite so sudden :)
SteffJ
10-26-2003, 8:22 AM
The ph in my 55gal. is pretty high also, 7.6 to 7.8 I have never really worried about it before, the fish don't seem to mind, they have proven to be very hardy to my novice skills.
I use well water to fill the tank, which has a high ph on it's own. So I was thinking of using distilled bottled water, which has a low ph (like 6.9) when I do water changes or when I need to replace some water. Does anyone have an opinion on this? Should I not bother and continue with the well water? I always try NOT to use any kind of chemicals in the tank.
btw the fish in the tank are a pair of jags and a pair of dempseys, I've had for about two years.
Leopardess
10-26-2003, 12:37 PM
Don't use distilled water unless you feel like buying a water supplement. Distilled water lacks all of the nutrients and minerals that are necessary to keep fish healthy and happy. We get all of our minerals from food, but fish absorb theirs through their environment. Granted, you can use it, you just need to find a mixutre that can be sold with RO water/units.
A constant pH is much more important that a specific target pH. Also, 7.8ish isn't that high...not high enough to make a big difference, especially if the fish are accustomed to it. Tetras can even be okay in a pH that high...:)
Ok, im kinda getting worred now, my ph has kept rising overnight, its now on 8.1. I know its said that its better to have a stable ph over a certain level to obtain, but the level doesnt seem to stop going up. I've tested the gravel for Calcium Carbonate by doing the acid test and that didnt fizz. My other tank which came from the same tap stays steady at 6.9. If I plant some plants, will that help lower my ph back below 8 as im not sure if many (if any) fish can live long lives in ph 8 water. Thanks, sorry about rambling, im just a little nervous about all this, is still really new to me.
Locust
10-27-2003, 3:01 AM
8.1? Yeah, I'd be getting a bit worried, too. Test your tap water like JSchmidt recommended. If you find that the tap pH stays stable, then there must be something in your tank raising the pH.
Did you get your gravel from a fish store? It's possible that some of the gravel has started leaching into the water, and you may have just tested gravel that hadn't...
Also, plants aren't likely to effect your pH. Since you don't have any fish in your tank you can spend some time trying to figure out what's raising your pH (for that much of a shift, there most be a cause...).
Sorry I forgot to mention that I tested my tap water like suggested, That kept jumping between 7.99 and 8.09. Im worried that as where I am has just between declared a drought effected area they have changed where the water comes from, not our normal reserve. And yup my gravel is from my local fish shop, he told he he tested it before he bagged it, and I tested it when I got home. Im rather stuck and really appricate the help im getting, i'm just hoping soon I can find the answer to my problem.
Leopardess
10-27-2003, 10:34 AM
well...if the problem is the water (which you can tell by setting aside some tap water and testing it) it should stay pretty constant. If you are concerned about it being too high, you could TEMPORARILY use distilled water until you get back to your original water source. Or try using natural spring water...it still contains enough minerals. And, feed your fish well during this period. Spring water is a MUCH better option.
It sounds to me like it very well may be your gravel (despite the fizz test...sometimes the acid in vinegar can't make it fizz). I would think about removing all the gravel and leaving it as bare bottom until you can get some you KNOW is 100% safe...the fish won't mind - I promise:)
You can think about using some black water extract...if it syour water thats the problem. Its kind of expensive, and will color the water, but it lowers the pH. You can also MAYBE think about setting up a CO2 system to lower the pH...however the initial drop is another big shift in pH.
It sounds to me like its the gravel, especially if it keeps rising. I'd remove it to be on the SAFE side...and if it turns out to be something else, you were better safe than sorry:)
OrionGirl
10-27-2003, 12:51 PM
What else is in the tank besides gravel?
If this is a cycling tank (no fish) then the pH can fluctuate as a result of the bacterial processes--fairly normal. You'll need to check the hardness of the water as well, and these factors can impact the stability of the water for pH. Hard water tends to be more stable than soft water. Check to see if your tap water goes through a softener process as well.
If the water is changing after aging, something else is going on. Run the same test, but make sure to use a large, open mouthed container, like a glass bowl, and agitate it very well. Water that has gassed off excess CO2 should be stable--the fact that yours is not indicates something else is going on.
There is gravel, and power heads and the intake and outlet of my canister filter. The Ph stopped rising today and held steady at 8.13 and its hasnt budged and inch higher. Im happy thats its stopped moving, will that just mean it was raising up against my Ph Down that I had put in it? But am now happy that it has stopped going up. Now should I let my cycle run its course, then decide on what to do? Thank you all.
Just checked the water again and it hus begun to drop. As of 15 minutes ago, it was jumping between 7.93-8.01 so im hoping this means good things are on the way.
tomm10
10-29-2003, 8:30 AM
In the first week of cycling my 10gal the Ph was running around 7.8 and jumping around a bit. I think Oriongirl was probably spot on (big surprise there) when she said it could be the cycling that is throwing the Ph off. By the end of the first week of cycling my tank had leveled off at 7.2 where it now stays.
Hopefully thats whats going on with yours.
Ok with my nitrate, nitrite and ammonia levels at either 0 or below anything I should be worried about and With my Ph level still rather high (was jumping around at 7.9). What can I put in the water to drop the Ph? Ph Down doesnt seem to be working that well as the water rebounds back to a high level in a few hours time. Thank you, the help is VERY MUCHLY appricated!!! :D
OrionGirl
11-03-2003, 9:08 AM
Unless you are trying to breed soft water fish, don't try to modify your pH. And, please, do not use the chemical products--their effects are usually limited, and can cause a host of other problems (like algae blooms from the phosphates in these products). If you must reduce the pH, if this is a planted tank adding CO2 will help. Some driftwood, or a baggie of peat in the filter, will also help. However--a stable, high pH is better for fish than one that jumps around.