HEY! My tank is too clean! ....Huh?

[Anthony8858]

I've been posting about a "cloudy water" condition in my 36 gallon the past few days.


Anyway.......One of the "aquarium experts" from the local aquarium shop gave me the courtesy to stop by my house and take a look at my tank.

As soon as he walked in the room, the first thing he said was that my tank was too clean, and that I should leave it alone. No water changes for a month, along with regular feedings.
He took water readings, and said everthing was OK.

Can someone explain a tank that's too clean, that caused cloudy water?

[aquariumfishguy]

Well in a newly developed aquarium, if your always cleaning the filters, or doing water changes all the time along with adding lots of chemicals your tank can get cloudy fast. What this "expert" should have said is that you are doing water changes, or cleanings to much and that maybe you should lay back on it for a while and let nature take its own course. Simply telling you it's "too clean" doesn't help and frankly, I'd be skepticle about asking this "expert" for advice in the future. ;)

[OrionGirl]

No such thing as too clean. You can disturb the bacterial colonies too much (ie, rinsing them in hot chlorinated water, or constantly replacing the biological media). This, however, has nothing to do with wate4r changes. Water changes are crucial to removing waste other than nitrogen. Professional discus breeders, for example, do 100% water changes daily--and their fish are obviosuly thriving.

But, why don't you tell us what your care regimen is, and we'll see if it's excessive.

[dethjam316]

i would think a tank would be "too clean" if you were to say...completely rinse out sponges and replace filter floss (or whatever you use) daily. decimation of bacterial colonies would qualify, i would think.

[Anthony8858]

Here's a link to my prior post.

When he said "too clean", I believe he meant that the beneficial bacteria has yet to make its presence known.

The funny thing about all this.....I used this same water for my daughter's NEW 10G tank about 3 weeks ago, and it looks beautiful.

http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21072

[OrionGirl]

I doubt it is the water itself, but rather a difference between the tanks. Anything in there that couold be dissolving? Sounds silly, but I know someone who thought a stalagmite would be a cool decoration--until it turned the tank into a milkshake.

Either way, I would not quit doing water changes. Maybe take a cup or two from the healthy tank? It's possible your tank lacks beneficial microfauna that normally feed on the bacteria, keeping it under control. If your daughters tank has a helathy population, you could infuse it into your tank easily.

[Dangerdoll]

right, my sister had this happen to her (not the one with the SW) and after about a month she finally gave me a call and asked me why her tank wouldn't clear up even though she was changing the filters once the clouds start (I think she was changing them at every couple of days give or take). I told her to step back and stop worrying about it and explained the whole kit and kaboodle about the beneficial bacteria needed and that she needed to let the tank run it's cycling course. I explained the importance of allowing her tank to process (cycle) without her intervening constantly (as far as changing the filter once she sees it cloudy) while conntinuing to do the normal maintenance as far as water changes and checking levels. She had a few fish left in her tank and lost some of course due to following the "let the tank sit a day and you're good to go" idea (a very very common misconceeption I've found). Upon this advice, with the few fish she had retained, she wrote down a schedule to follow for the cycle and not long thereafter, things were finally on track.
I'm assuming by "too clean", the AE meant all of your levels were in range and he/she was at a loss as to what the problem was. My guess, along with everyone else here is if you were replacing the media too frequently because of the cloudiness, you were simply not allowing the bacteria to take it's rightful place in your set up.

[Anthony8858]

I have to agree with many of you.

I'M GUILTY of obsessing over my cloudy water.:sad

I blame my 9 year old that comments every time she passes my tank:rolleyes:

There's nothing I can do at this point, other than wait.

[travelinman1969]

I have been told by people that my water and tank are too clean too. But my nitrates have been at over 60 ppm for over 3 months, been coming down slowly, but it's been a battle. Right now at 60, 2 months ago at 160 ppm. I have some plants in it but a big bio-load, and everyone keeps asking me how I keep my tank so clean. I don't like to embarass myself and tell too many people about the nitrate issue. Obviosly I have a good bio-filter. Nitrite 0 and ammonia 0. But the tank is awesome looking. Should I worry about cloudiness when the nitrates go below 20?

[RTR]

Being too clean is to me akin to being too rich. I'm game to try for it, but don't believe it is possible or likely.

Inappropriate cleaning, as others have already pointed out, is a different matter entirely. You can processes the filters and the tank in such a manner as to slow or block development of the many types of bacteria and infusoria that are normal inhabitants of our tanks. Until all those microbes balance, the tank will not be stable. Nitrification may be fine, but all the heterotrophs have to balance as well.

And for travelinman, no, your tank is long established and you are making needed changes gradually, not suddenly. You can expect your tank's micro-inhabitants to adjust their populations easily to the target levels, so long as you don't do a full tear-down and reset in attempt to get there faster.

[travelinman1969]

That kinda goes along with a new thread I'm about to start, cause unfortunatly, I'm moving in 2-3 weeks and will have to do a total tear down.

[aquariumfishguy]

I believe most people out there would say "nah, my tank could never be too clean...infact it needs some work".

I would be in that boat, being that if I had more time for my aquariums I could do more to them. ;)

BTW...my nitrates are at or slightly below 10 and have stayed this way so I dont think it means something bad...it is usually a really good thing!

[750t]

I know everyone thinks Im crazy but I still think its that stress coat crap. Since when is aloe vera found in a amazon river or lakes in central america. I also know that after I stopped using it and cleaned out the left over sludge I never had this problem again. Just my two cents. If this tank is five months old the new tank syndrome would of done ran ran it course.

[ewok]

Originally posted by 750t
I know everyone thinks Im crazy but I still think its that stress coat crap. Since when is aloe vera found in a amazon river or lakes in central america. I also know that after I stopped using it and cleaned out the left over sludge I never had this problem again. Just my two cents. If this tank is five months old the new tank syndrome would of done ran ran it course.

care to come over and show me where stress-coat is causing me a problem? i use it every water change, and up until recently i had 7 tanks, NO cloudy water and NO losing fish. now i only have 3 but i have probably 100 fry.........

while stress coat may add some extra stuff that isn't really needed, it's NOT the culprit here.

edit: btw, any updates?

[Anthony8858]

Did a 20% water change with water that I put into 5 gallon jugs 3 days ago. Did not touch gravel, simply siphoned water out. I did this 24 hours ago. NO STRESS COAT.

Sorry to say that my water does not look impressive.

Starting to get disgusted.

[ewok]

you aren't by chance using water from the hudson are you? ;) :D

edit: i'll come back to this, don't worry. :)

edit2: i sent you a pm.

[Dangerdoll]

give it a chance Anthony, it's not going to be a quick overnight fix. I know it's tough to sit and just let it look unsatisfying to you, you've got to allow the tank to do what it must though....

[DeVitaf]

I am having the same issue with one of my tanks. The water always has a milky white coloration. If you look at the tank from the front you really can't notice. But the cloudiness is obvious when looking through the side of the tank.

I do 3 25% water changes a week, it seems like a lot but I have an 8" flower horn in my 50g breeder that leaves human sized turds all over my sand substrate. It becomes unattractive quickly. The water changes are really me sucking his poop out of the water with my python.

The tank is filtered by a magnum 350 PRo with the two biowheels and a magnum HOT 250. I have been battling this discoloration for a while. My tank has been cycled for 5 months and it would seem that I have plenty of filtration.

The only additive I add is 'Proper PH 7.0' to neutralize chlorine and buffer the PH. Could this be causing the cloudines? I have heard differnet opinions on this product.

I just can't figure out why my cycled tank with no ammonia, no nitrite and <10 nitrates looks cloudy.

My only other suspicion is that maybe I didn't rinse the play sand properly. Although I remember standing in front of the kitchen sink for hours straining sand through my pillowcase.

Any thoughts?

[Anthony8858]

You sound very much as I do.

I keep mentioning how my 10 gallon is crystal clear, even though I took the water from my 36 gallon to fill it.

You just reminded me of the ONLY difference between the two......It's the gravel!

The 10 gal has medium to large gravel/rocks, while the one giving me a hard time has small / fine to medium gravel.

Could this be the culprit? Who the heck knows.

Is there a way to change gravel without destroying my tank?

[dethjam316]

i changed from large gravel to sand...err, am still changing. rather than pull apart the whole tank and do it in one huge project, i've been changing over a period of months. right now the tank is about 80% sand, 20% large gravel, which i've left in for longer than i'd intended because one of my spiny eels seems to oddly prefer that portion. what i did was basically remove the gravel a little at a time while i was doing water changes and began to add sand to those sections. did they mix in parts? sure, but that didn't bother me much. and i also lost some sand i'd put in to replace the gravel as i removed gravel, but at $2 a bag for sand, i wasn't too broken up about it.

going the opposite way, i would think, should be easier, because you can just suck sand or small gravel out with a large enough hose. just add the gravel in cups, a little at a time, so there's not an avalanche falling on your fish.

my sand-based substrates took a lot longer to clear up to crystal-clear water than gravel tanks, but i prefer the look, and i think my fish do as well. also, my plants have always grown better in the sand.

[TonyB]

its strange but my tank has me completely puzzled.

i've had it for about 8 weeks and for at least 7 weeks the cloudiness drove me crazy.

Then i had a huge water change, much more than i should have (at least 40% which i now know is not a good idea) I also gave the filter a good clean (in tank water) and done the gravel

Put new water in and within 2 hours i had a severe bacteria bloom (white cloudy water) i it really put me in a bad mood :mad:

That was 3 days ago.

Now my tank is fantastically clear and it looks brilliant and i havent got a clue why and apart from a problem i have with a molly the fish are looking great.

:)

[OrionGirl]

Large water changes are not a bad thing. Large water changes that significantly change the water parameters (ie, cause a huge chnage in pH, temp, etc) are a bad thing, because they can shock the fish. But, large changes using matching or close water parameters, are very good.

[Mark_b]

If its a bacterial bloom or algae bloom then a uv steriliser will cure it! It will kill any suspended bacteria but there will still be plenty on your filter media so dont worry about your biological filtration being destroyed - the uv will only kill the bacteria that actually enters the chamber and most of your bacteria will colonise surfaces and not be suspended in the water. I bought a cheapo garden pond uv sterilser with an 8w uv tube and it works fantastically and was a lot cheaper than the ones designed for aquaria! I realise that they are still not cheap though.

The other possibility as you have just mentioned is that your substrate is different between your tanks. It could be that the gravel itself is dissolving or at least is very dusty. To see if it is the gravel clouding your water then takesome of it out into a glass jar and fill it up with some tank water and put it in a dark place to stop algae growing. If it goes clear quickly then you know its not the gravel! Saves you changing the substrate in your tank only for you to have the same problem!

[Mark_b]

When i say cure it what i really mean of course is just that it will clear the water!