Stress Coat

[WaterBaby]

I just bought this for bathing my hermit crabs, and it says that it's a water conditioner. Since I bought a large bottle of this stuff, I was going to use it as a water conditioner in my tanks since I ran out of the Marineland Bio-Coat.

I have read some posts on this product adversly affecting their tanks (white slime, cloudiness and such). Does this happen because too much is used? It says it has Aloe Vera in it which in itself is "slimy".

Should I not use it for water conditioning?

[ChEeRs_BiG_EaRs]

i dont even use a water conditioner, i fail to see the point. could you pelase tell me why you want to use the conditioner, unless you ahve very sensitive fish..
Justin

[WaterBaby]

I age the water to gas off the chlorine, but I have had a problem with chloramines in the past, so it's just a precautionary thing I do. I must admit, I don't always check the ammonia levels of my tap water. :o

[JSchmidt]

A lot of us prefer not to add stuff like aloe to the water because we see no need and because of possible adverse longterm effects. If you have a bottle of StressCoat it won't hurt your fish to use it, especially for the short term (i.e., until the bottle is gone).

Be advised that if your water has chloramines, StressCoat will free the ammonia from the chlorine, but won't neutralize it, like Amquel or Prime will. The ammonia will be freed and can be taken up by the biofilter, but some people don't like to repeatedly expose their fish to even relatively low levels (generally < 1 ppm) of ammonia.

HTH,
Jim

[WaterBaby]

So,

You're saying that "if" there are no chloramines in the tap water, there is no need to add "anything" to it before a water change?

Letting it sit for a few days to gas off the chlorine would be good enough?

[Slappy*McFish]

yes

[golfer]

Doesn't the Stresscoat bottle state that it removes chlorimines????

[JSchmidt]

Yes, but if you go to their website and look at the details, they admit that StressCoat breaks the chlorine-ammonia bond and neutralizes the chlorine, but does nothing for the ammonia.

Jim

[chefkeith]

Stress Coat doesn't foul up ammonia test kit readings either. Which is why I sometimes use it. I use Ammolock 2 to detoxify Ammonia. Both products are made by the same company and compliment each other quiet well.

Personally, I like the Aloe in Stress Coat. Its another reason why I use it sometimes. I don't see how it can harm fish in such a low concentration. It can only help, IMO. Aloe does help to heal fin damage, which is good to have for fin nipping fish like Tiger Barbs.
I also use Prime, Insto Chlor, and Amquel.

These products all have different benefits. I don't think any one product is perfect or should be used for all occasions.

I do like the idea of aging water, but I have to deal with choramines though. For me, aging water also cause's space and time issue's since I live in a small home. I use a python.

[JSchmidt]

StressCoat doesn't affect Nessler ammonia tests because it doesn't do anything for ammonia, just like plain old sodium thiosulfate. :)

I'd really like to see some proof that aloe has any beneficial effect at all on fish. I've yet to see anything that proves it speeds healing or helps fish develop a better slime coat. (Even worse, it's hard for me to believe that the delicate tissues in the gills benefit from being coated with that stuff.) Maybe it does help, but I've yet to see anything but anecdotal evidence that it actually promotes healing.

I've become extremely skeptical of many of these products that seem more aimed at satisfying needs of the fishkeepers than of the fish...

Jim

[chefkeith]

I'm kind of pro-aloe.

There are many natural ingredients in aloe vera. Only a few I know off hand, such as Vitamin C, E, and Zinc. I wonder how many of the same things in aloe are in aquatic plants?

[Captain Hook]

I've been using aloe water conditioners with years and have had great results. I used Aqua-Plus for a long time but recently bought a large jug of Big Al's Water Conditioner at a great price. I believe it is the same product as Stree Coat marketed under Big Al's name.

I have never had any problems using these products and find they do a good job of keeping water quality high. I haven't lost many fish in the years I've had my tanks.

[RTR]

I believe that my fish are fully capable of producing their own slime coat - that is an essential part of their nature. I am unaware of tropical rainforest stream banks being lined with dripping Aloe vera plants or of that being esential for the captive culture of fish, so I don't use it. I did not use it when I was younger, and saw reason to change when it suddenly became a hot item in dechorinators (long before chloramines were in common use) as a branding tool. To me the "need" for Aloe vera or other slime coat "enhancers" is a maketing need, not a fish culture need. Your dime, your choice.

For chlorine-only water, I age it. For chloramine-containing water I use Prime or Amquel.

[chefkeith]

I have this question- Do vitamins and minerals leach into the water from aquatic plants?

[steve_bkk]

I agree with RTR.

Steve

[JSchmidt]

Originally posted by chefkeith
I have this question- Do vitamins and minerals leach into the water from aquatic plants?

I'm no plant expert, but I always thought it was the other way around... plants tend to take up those things from the water and store them.

Jim

[chefkeith]

There's still alot for me to learn on the subject of plants. It will make some interesting research when I decide to add some real plants to my tank.

On Stress Coat- some of their claims may be either false or misleading. I thought aloe was water soluable, so I don't see how it can replace a slime coat. Perhaps its some other ingredient in the Stress Coat that replaces the slime coat? I can understand how aloe can enhance the growth of the slime coat because of the vitamins and minerals that aloe provides.

[JSchmidt]

Originally posted by chefkeith
On Stress Coat- some of their claims may be either false or misleading.

Misleading claims from a company selling aquarium products! Imagine that!

:D

Unfortunately, that's more the rule than the exception...

Jim

[RTR]

Meooow! :laugh:

[yhbae]

Don't believe in aloe but I still use Stress Coat as it is the cheapest one I have found so far (until recently). So far, it causes no problems so I'll continue to use it until the current supply runs out. Then I'll probably shop for the cheapest conditioner again, may or may not be stress coat...

[JSchmidt]

A one gallon jug of StressCoat costs $25.59 and treats 7680 gallons (.33 cents per gallon of treated water).

A 16 oz. bottle of Chlorinex costs $6.49 and treats 7000 gallons (or .09 cents per gallon of treated water).

[Both prices quoted from That Pet Place website.]

Both dechlorinate water. (In fact, I'd hazard a guess that they have the exact same dechlorinator.) You can get plain sodium thiosulfate (the active ingredient in many dechlorinators) from a number of fish supply houses for a fraction the cost of either of those.

It's your money...

Jim

[chefkeith]

Originally posted by JSchmidt
A one gallon jug of StressCoat costs $25.59 and treats 7680 gallons (.33 cents per gallon of treated water).

A 16 oz. bottle of Chlorinex costs $6.49 and treats 7000 gallons (or .09 cents per gallon of treated water).


Your price per gallon math is way off, but yeah I agree, Stress Coat is very expensive compared to other conditioners.
I don't use Stress Coat much, but I'm glad I have it. I don't think its good to use for water changes because of its high cost. It is good for occasional use though, like to treat fish that are injured or have torn up fins. My fish seem to heal alot quicker when I use it.

[JSchmidt]

Originally posted by chefkeith


Your price per gallon math is way off, but yeah I agree, Stress Coat is very expensive compared to other conditioners.

StressCoat
$25.59/7680 = $.0033/gallon = .33 cents/gallon

Chlorinex
$6.49/7000 = $.0009/gallon = .09 cents/gallon

:confused:

[chefkeith]

My mistake then. I've never seen anyone use cents instead of dollars when talking about money.

[yhbae]

Sorry - let me re-phrase my sentence:

It is one of the cheapest conditioner I have seen around my area that does:

- Remove Chlorine
- Remove Cholramine
- Remove toxic metals

These are what I want, and most conditioners do remove them. I looked into ChloroOut and although it is cheaper, it only removed chlorine...

[JSchmidt]

StressCoat does NOT remove chloramine.

From the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals website FAQ on StressCoat ( http://aquariumpharm.com/flashSite.html ):

Does Stress Coat remove chlorine and chloramines?

It removes chlorine and the chlorine component of chloramine.


Will Stress Coat detoxify Ammonia?

No. If you need to detoxify ammonia use Ammo-Lock 2.



It does nothing more than ChloroOut, at least as far as chloramines are concerned...

HTH,
Jim

[yhbae]

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't that part of chloramine removing process? Since stress coat will remove the cholrine component, only ammonia (the other component of chloramine?) will be remaining which will be removed by the bacteria (hopefully!).

I personally don't want to add any ammonia removing chemicals into the tank as it might disturb the tank chemistry balance...

[RTR]

By not treating for ammonia along with chlorine, you are ammonia-stressing the fish every time you water change, which is sort of defeating the purpose of that exercise is it not? You are, in effect, minicycling every water change. Not in my fish tanks, thank you very much.

[JSchmidt]

Originally posted by yhbae
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't that part of chloramine removing process? Since stress coat will remove the cholrine component, only ammonia (the other component of chloramine?) will be remaining which will be removed by the bacteria (hopefully!).

I personally don't want to add any ammonia removing chemicals into the tank as it might disturb the tank chemistry balance...

Some products that claim to remove chloramine actually detoxify both harmful components - chlorine as well as ammonia. Amquel, Prime and AmmoLock2 are the products I'm familiar with, and used as treatment for new water, you almost never hear of problems with them for general FW use. The don't seem to have any negative effects for 99% of us.

Other products (e.g., StressCoat and most garden variety dechlorinators) may say they remove chloramine, but only detoxify the chlorine, freeing the ammonia. Personally, if the product is leaving behind half the toxic chemicals, I don't consider it to have 'removed' chloramine. That the ammonia isn't treated isn't mentioned on the packaging, last time I looked, which I find a bit misleading. At least they tell the truth on their web site.

Whether one gets worked up over the amount of ammonia freed from chloriminated water by StressCoat and its ilk is a personal choice. My main objection is that for about the same money as a gallon of StressCoat, you can get a gallon of Amquel that actually will detoxify chloramine, not just chlorine.

Jim

[yhbae]

As I mentioned before, I have nothing for or against stress coat - it worked for ME so far, and I will continue to use it until it runs out. I'm not 100% sure if I have chloramine as my call to the hydro company didn't give me any confidence if they do use it or not... I use it as a precautionary measure only.

It is interesting though - does anyone have problem using stress coat in water that actually does contain chloramine? If this is the case, surely we would have heard it by now as this product is super popular on the market. Last time I studied chemistry is over 15 years ago, so I'm not going to even try to figure out what chemically happens within the water.

I'll look around to see what is the best value around when the current supply runs out. If I can get the Amquel for a cheap price, I'd try it out. I have a feeling that I don't have chloromine in my water since I have never detected any sign of ammonia just after water change, though.

[yhbae]

Originally posted by RTR
By not treating for ammonia along with chlorine, you are ammonia-stressing the fish every time you water change, which is sort of defeating the purpose of that exercise is it not? You are, in effect, minicycling every water change. Not in my fish tanks, thank you very much.

Just some random thoughts - fishes do produce ammnia continuously, correct? By adding chemicals that remove ammonia, doesn't this starve bacteria, leading to small decrease in population? As soon as the chemicals have been used up, you will end up with fishes producing ammonia at slightly faster rate than what bacteria colony can handle, hence mini cycle... :D (I could be completely off...)

On the other hand, if these are those chemicals that converts ammonia from toxic form to non-toxic form that bacteria can still consume, I guess this problem doesn't exist.

Hey, go easy on me I'm only trying to learn... :D

[JSchmidt]

Amquel, and maybe Prime and AmmoLock, don't deprive the ammonia from the bacteria. They just make it non-toxic to fish.

If you don't have chloramine, i.e., if you have only chlorine, using Amquel or similar is not very cost-effective. There are a number of places where you can get sodium thiosulfate crystals that you mix with distilled water, providing a basic dechlorinator for a fraction of the cost of Amquel (or StressCoat). Even better, you don't get all the other crud that's put into StressCoat!

Even cheaper, buy a big plastic garbage can and age your water a day or two. If you have chlorinated (not chloriminated) water, the chlorine will offgas on its own and you won't have to add a thing!

Fishkeeping really needn't be about all these expensive (and mostly unnecessary) products the industry would like you to buy...

Jim

[chefkeith]

I can't believe this tread is still alive.

Calling the Stress Coat ingredients "crud" is kind of a slap in the face, don't you think?

HTH-

Technical Reference Sheet
Stress Coat®

Purpose and Benefits:

Stress Coat forms a synthetic slime coating on the skin of fish, replacing the natural secretion of slime that is lost during netting, handling, shipping, fighting and other forms of stress. Stress Coat is a patented water conditioner suitable for fresh and salt water aquariums, water gardens and ponds. Stress Coat contains Aloe Vera, which acts as a liquid bandage, to protect and heal damaged fish tissue. Stress Coat instantly removes chlorine and heavy metals such as copper and zinc from tap water. Stress Coat also removes chloramines by breaking the chlorine-ammonia bond.

The effectiveness of Stress Coat with Aloe Vera has been proven by independent studies conducted at the University of Georgia, School of Veterinary Medicine. Researchers found that Stress Coat helped heal wounds and speed tissue regrowth. Dr John Gratzek summarizes the results: "Personally, I am satisfied with the results since my initial thoughts were skeptical to say the least. These definite statements can be made without equivocation: Stress Coat in no way harms aquarium fish, alters pH, or affects the biological filter. No ammonia or nitrite was detected in the test aquariums. The results indicated that the Stress Coat formula reduced the wound size compared to untreated fish tissue." Aloe Vera is high in mucopolysaccharides, an essential component of many tissues and believed to help in the healing process. The glycoproteins Aloctin A and Aloctin B are also present and identified as the probable tissue-healers.

Directions for Use:

Each dose of Stress Coat removes 3.0 ppm chlorine and 0.3 ppm heavy metals.
To protect fish and condition water:
Add two teaspoonfuls (10 ml) for every 10 U.S. gallons of aquarium water.
To remove chlorine and heavy metals and neutralize chloramines:Add one teaspoonful (5 ml) for every 10 U.S. gallons (40 liters) of tap water.
For tropical fish use only. Do not use on fish intended for human consumption.


Compatibility:

Stress Coat can be used with freshwater tropical fish, marine fish, invertebrates and coldwater species including koi and goldfish. Stress Coat will not harm aquatic plants. Stress Coat may cause foaming in marine aquariums using a protein skimmer. Stress Coat will not interfere with water test kits.


Here's a link to the MSDS of Stress Coat-

http://www.aquariumpharm.com/msds/85_StressCoat.pdf

[JSchmidt]

Originally posted by chefkeith
I can't believe this tread is still alive.

Calling the Stress Coat ingredients "crud" is kind of a slap in the face, don't you think?



I don't think it was a slap in the face... mildly insulting (to the makers of StressCoat), maybe, but not a slap in the face...

;)

Healthy fish grow wonderful slime coatings all on their own. If the point is that aloe vera speeds healing, I could accept that. But I don't see any need to continually expose my healthy fish to anything that "forms a synthetic slime coating on the skin of fish" (and on the gills and any other exposed tissue), especially when that stuff adds substantially to the cost of what is really a glorified dechlorinator.

And I still think their statement that it "removes chloramines," while technically accurate as they clarify it, is misleading. It removes chlorine, nothing more.

I'm sure there are lots of worse things one can put in their aquarium, and maybe there are no longterm bad effects from using StressCoat. My point is just that it is not necessary and the same effects can be had in much, much cheaper products.

That's all...

Jim

[chefkeith]

I agree with everything you said, I wouldn't use Stress Coat for healthy fish either. My dime.

Take care.

[RTR]

I can't believe this thread is alive either.

My fish are not wounded, are very rarely netted if ever, are not stressed, are not fighting, have not been shipped either for several years or never. Why would I need or want a synthetic slime coat? I age almost all my water and check for chloramine - if present (rarely), I use an agent which will inactivate the chlorine and complex the released ammonia into a harmless form (which Stresscoat will not do) .

If it is an agent that I neither want or need in my tank, to me that makes it pollution.

All IMO, in my practice, and in my tanks. In your tanks, the choice is yours.

[Captain Hook]

RTR are you saying if my water has chloramine and I only stress coat there could still be some harmful material going into my tank?

[yhbae]

Yes, that is exactly what RTR is saying - more ammonia in the tank, hence mini-cycle according to him/her.

I'm still not convinced which is better - the one that leaves some ammonia behind or the other one that removes too much ammonia for the natural balance... :D

[RTR]

Yup, that was exactly what I intended. Chloramine breaks into chlorine and ammonia, both harmful. Stresscoat inactivtes the chlorine, fine, but it leaves the ammonia free in the water and detectable by hobby test kit. By definition, detectable ammonia is harmful.

It is not possible to "upset the natural balance" with Amquel or Prime, as they lock the ammonia into the ammonium ion form (which is harmless to the fish and which is still available to nitrification bacteria).

My fish and my tanks do not ever see any detectable ammonia. I choose not to stress or risk my fish without any reason for doing so.

Your tank, your choice.

[yhbae]

One more question... :D

If this product works so well in converting ammonia from one form (toxic) to another (non-toxic) without disturbing bacteria, how come this isn't used commonly during cycling? It sure sounds like a super-safe way to do a cycle using live fish?

[RTR]

Because it won't do a thing to nitrite, just as toxic.

Besides, you are supposed to cycle w/o fish. :)

[yhbae]

Originally posted by RTR
Because it won't do a thing to nitrite, just as toxic.


****, how stupid of me... Somehow, I was convinced that I this is it! :D



Besides, you are supposed to cycle w/o fish. :)

Yaya, I'll probably do fishless cycling for my next Lake Tang tank... I found out the hard way how painful it is to cycle with fishes. (None dead, but water changes daily for 30 friggin days in a row!)

Hmmm... come to think of it, I didn't have to cycle for my next 5 other tanks... LOL... man, I'm loosing it way to early for my age... :D

[RTR]

LOL @ yhbae - that is the value of the board, they help us avoid blind spots and pitfalls!

[yhbae]

If this doesn't conclude this thread, nothing will... :D