Oxygen content or chemical problem?

[bortsamson]

Ok, I regularly do water changes 1nce a week, 20-25% each time on my 56 gallon

Awhile back, I made the mistake of using seachem's PH Neutral. I thought it was good, cause it lowered, I hoped anyway, my hardwater PH
well, sure it did, but along with that came massive algal growth on my plants.
I read the container, sure enough, contains phosphate.
but, I was extemely busy and even fitting in the water changes was tough, but I stuck to it
soon, the water started to get that icky film on the surface. Mine was so bad, that I could watch it fight the surface agitation I used to try and break it up
well, my busy period ended and i finally got a chance to clean the tank properly, made myself a surface extractor, and got the film cleaned up
howver, I noticed that the fish, at certain times, all of them would be at the surface gasping for air. I tested the water, all good, no ammonia/nitrite
after I cleaned the tank and filter, and hooked up a new filter (fluval, weee) and changed to Amquel, the surface film was completely gone, and everything seemed good
but, it seems now, that when I change the water, and if I fill the tank past the output of the filter(s), within a few hours they are all gasping at the surface again.
I test the water, but I cant trust the reults cause using my test kit for ammonia the water goes grey and silty, hehe, no help there
but, if I move the spraybar and fluval output to disrupt the surface, in a little bit, they arent at the surface struggling to get oxygen, but they arent having a good time either

anyways, my tank is planted, so that disuption isnt my friend, at the same time my fish have to live!

HELP! Is my oxygen content permantly sabatoged since the surface film, or what

more info
PH in tank 6.6
ammonia 0
nitrite 0
nitrate unknown
and these episodes ONLY happen after water changes

maybe its a PH spike...come to think of it...cause I have peat in the fluval to help soften the water, works awesome, fish are much happier, now that I think of it, the PH in my tap water is like 7.6, could that be causing the stress to the fish when I change the water?? or is it just a gas exchange problem?:sad :sad :sad :sad :confused: :confused: :confused:

[bortsamson]

*bump*
I know its quite a read, but any help please:shake:

[DEmigh]

I don't know how much help this will be, but maybe it'll get the ball rolling w/ someone else:

I think SeaChem makes two products with "Neutral" in the name. One is Neutral Buffer, and the other is Neutral Regulator. One has phosphate buffers, the other doesn't.

[bortsamson]

the one with phosphate, is the one I WAS using

[DEmigh]

Okay, still thinking...

How are the plants doing? Any change in their appearance? What kind of lighting do you use? Do you have an oxygen test kit?

[bortsamson]

pants are doing better, since I started adding ferts.
Now, I thought that the ferts and dechlor might be interacting in some way, but, I was addding the ferts long after this original problem was happening

no, no oxygen testing for me
but, it seems also like my tank is unable to KEEP oxygen in it as well, ida know, still hoping for help, not to say you havent helped so far, heheh

[DEmigh]

What's the spectrum (i.e. 6500K or whatever) and intensity of your lighting. With a planted tank, there is bound to be a relationship between nutrient uptake and lighting. Are your lights getting old? If flourescents run hot, their output can begin to deteriorate fairly quickly.

Edit: Also, check this thread (http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21995) in the Aquatic Plants forum.

[bortsamson]

umm, that question may be a bit of a sidetrack, I dont think the lighting has something to do with the fact this only occurs at water changes. I would think it might be the case,cept I dose the tank 2 times a week and, like I said, it only happens when I change the water, not during the dosage mid-week, but, ya never know

[bortsamson]

*bump*

[DEmigh]

Originally posted by bortsamson
umm, that question may be a bit of a sidetrack, I dont think the lighting has something to do with the fact this only occurs at water changes. I would think it might be the case,cept I dose the tank 2 times a week and, like I said, it only happens when I change the water, not during the dosage mid-week, but, ya never know

Yer right :emb:

I'm in the dark here (sorry, I couldn't resist that stupid little pun :rolleyes: )

Maybe you could ask an administrator to move this thread over to Aquatic Plants. You might get more help there.

[Grassguy]

What are the other readings on your tap. Does it have any chlorine, chloramine, ammonia? Have you tried using an airstone. Might not be good for the plants but help the fish. I personally have an airstone for aesthetics, and my plants are doing fine. I'm not sure this is an answer, but may help. just my 2c

Has you water dept recently done anything different? That may cause a change in what you add to the tank.

[bortsamson]

water dept. around here uses chlorine, the water reeks of it.
Now, they may have recently added something to the water to deal with the cold, perhaps
I have a smaller 4 gallon planted that has a betta and a snail, with a UGF powered by an airstone, and the plants in there are doing great, so maybe I will use an airstone or somethin on the other tank too, this morning I moved the output of the fluval up again to actually spill into the water, that should help with oxygen problem
Now, interesting point, since I moved the output of the filter to disturb the surface of the water, the plants seem to be doing better, now, it could be because I started using fertilizer(sp? I'm lazy) but regardless, update, the fish are looking much better and breathing normal---er again, I will have to research this some more, thanks for helping, any more ideas, dont be afraid to tell me, hehe

[bortsamson]

ok, I do believe I found the issue

water out of my tank(from tap) PH 7.8
water IN my tank PH 6.6

so, in the process of doing my water change, I exposed my poor fishies to PH shock:shake: :shake: . Nobody is dead, or looking hurt, but i know it did stress them, but I only did this twice
I now age my water and am running the water-to-be-changed thru peat to get the levels the same
I just feel bad for my fish, they suffered cause of my ignorance, but, everyone does make mistakes, right??:(