Ich problem gone bad!

[Hoosier]

How do I start this off. Well, I've been treating my fish for Ich for two days now. I've raised the temp, added tablets, the works. Now it seems that there are a couple more problems. It appears that 2 or 3 of the fish now have fin rot or they're getting chased and caught because some of their tails aren't all there anymore. And my last problem is there seems to be some white-mucus like stuff growing over the eyes on a couple of my fish. So I have three problems that I need some help on please! 1-Ich, 2- Fin rot or something, 3- White stuff growing over the eyes. I've had nothing but problems since I've sat this up. I want to give up so bad, but it's nice to get off work and sit back and relax and look at the tank. But please help with this problem!!! Thanks!!

[victimizati0n]

Change your water alot more.

I really dont know what to say about the medication, I would treat for ich first then the finrot, but hopefully you can treat all at the same time.

I have never had ich in over 13 years, so i really dont remember.

Also, it sounds you have bad water quality if you are getting finrot, and that eye condition (cant remember name right now)

[Hoosier]

The water here is bad. I'm going to start treating it today. I got distilled water at the store today. $25 bucks worth of water! I hope that this water will help out more. Thanks!!

[travelinman1969]

First off, invest in an r/o system, it's cheaper than bottled water, trust me. I have a 150, 10, and 5 and was buying bottled water for changes. That's a real pain.

Next, what are the water parameters? What size tank? What do you have in there. It may be cheaper and easier to start over. You have 2 problems not 3. Ich is one the other is fin rot. The cloudy eyes are part of that. There is another name for it but it goes hand in hand with fin rot. Don't treat for both at the same time or you will probably be starting over. Make sure you are removing the carbon through all this.

If it were me, and the fish weren't that expensive I would seriously consider startin from scratch, but I don't know what you have. Let me know, I can probably help, I've seen all kinds of stuff and rarely ever lost a fish.

[PumaWard]

Okay, do this.

Ich can be treated very easily by raising the water temperature (a degree an hour) to 86F and adding tablesalt. If you have catfish/loaches in the tank 1 taBLespoon/10g of water. If you don't have the previous mentioned fish, than 2 taBLespoons/10g will work. The salt should also be added slowly. Ich medication should only be used as a last resort or in fish who cannot tolerate high temperature, IMO.

While you are treating ich with the above mentioned method, you can also begin treatment for the tailrot and cloudy eyes using Kanacyn or similiar product at the same time. Just make sure that you remove all the ich medication with a 50% water change and having activated carbon in your filter for a few hours. Remove the carbon before beginning treatment with the anti-bacterial medication.

Distilled water is not necissary (pure distilled can actually be harmful to fish). I wouldn't use it at all; if you can, I would return it. Water changes should be done every other day using the same water (which I hope is your tap) that the fish have become accustomed to.

HTH


*Edit: Forgot to ask, what is your tank size and what are the fish species?

*more: What are your water perameters (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH)?

[Hoosier]

Sorry that I left out all of the test results. Here is all of them from today (3-1-04). Nitrate=20ppm, NitrIte=5.0, Hardness is 150, Alkalinity is 120, pH is 7.8, and Ammonia is between .25-.35
My tank description is a 29 gallon with the measurements of 30" in length, 18 1/2" in Height, and a width of 12". I have the following fish...3 Tiger Barbs, 3 guppies, 2 Dalmation Mollies, 2 Blue Gouramies, 2 Kissing Gouramies, and 2 Red Wag Platties. They all get along well, but I think it's overpopulated. I set up a 10 gallon today to use as my hospitol tank, but I might move some fish into that tank to thin out my 29. I took out some gravel from the 29 and put into the 10 to help out with the cycle. I raised the temp. today to 82 F. I added the salt a few days ago, but I've been doing 20% water changes everyday, and haven't added any more salt. Anymore suggestions would be helpful!! Thanks!

[Hoosier]

About the carbon, I have two filters on this tank. One that hangs on the back (with the carbon) and I have a UGF powered by an aquatech powerhead which is 170 gph. Do you think I can just not use the filter that hangs on the back, and just use the powerhead while I treat this tank? I have more information on another thread...it's on carbon started by fishman101. You can glance at that if it might help out any. Thanks!!

[PumaWard]

With the activated carbon on there, you medications will be removed. I would just dump out the carbon and put the filter back on because, with your nitrite and ammonia readings, you're going to need all the bacteria you can get. I would also up your water changes to 50% because on your nitrite reading which is off the scale.

The salt should be replaced after every according to the ammount you took out. If you do a 50% water change, then you'll want to put 3 tablespoons of salt back in. Also, you don't need to buy any special "aquarium salt" as all it is, is NaCl which is the same thing as tablesalt (I only added this in case you didn't know :) )

The temperature still needs to be raised to 86F to combat ich effectively. Temperatures at 86F and above speed up the ich's life cycle and eventually kill it.

HTH

[Hoosier]

See, the only way to get the carbon out of my filter is to rip it apart. Should I go ahead and do that? Let me know -k-
Thanks!

[falcon]

On the salt treatment, I wouldn't use table salt. Something about it being ionized or something similar. Sea salt would be a better choice.

[Hoosier]

Alright, Well I now have some updates for some more help. I lost my last Tiger Barb. So now here is all the fish that I have... 2 red Wag Platties, 2 Fancy Guppies, 2 Dalmation Mollies, 2 Kissing Gouramies, and 2 Blue Gouramies. I tested my tank this morning after I got off of work and here are my results...Nitrate 20ppm, Nitrite 3.0, Hardness 150, Alkalinity 120, pH 7.8 and Ammonia is between 0-.25. Those are my updates. Then I did a water change of 50-60%. It's a 29 gallon and I took out about 12-14 gallons. I also got a make-shift filter that I cut to fit, and it doesn't have any carbon, and it is now running with the filter that is hanging on the back. I'm not currently using my UGF with the powerhead unless you guys recommend me to. I also added freshwater aquarium salt (5 Tablespoons: Directions said 1Tbsp per 5gal. of water) and I turned the heat up. I currently don't have the tempature, hence I'm waiting a couple hours for the water to circulate. Any more suggestions are helpful! I haven't got the problem solved yet, but am I on the way?? Thanks!

[beviking]

Leave the UGF running. You want ammonia and nitrite to read ZERO. You probably need to change 50% water a day. Table salt is o.k.. A couple hours for the water to circulate? If you have circulation in the tank, it will equalize within 10 minutes. The water (50% you changed) is the same (or close) temp as the tank water right?

Pumaward, how can you treat for ich and tail rot at the same time if you're removing the ich med? I rarely have treated for columnaris (tail rot) unless it was an advanced stage. If the fish is healthy and not severely infected, it can fight of the infection (which usually came on as a result of an injury) but with all the added stress Hoosier, I fear you won't be so lucky.:(

[Hoosier]

I know! I'm scared I'm gonna lose all of the fish that I have! I'm trying the best I can to save them though. I'll turn my UGF back on right now, and while I'm at it I'll check the temp...ok, it's 76. I turned it up a little bit more. What's a good temp. to take it to? About 78-80? A couple more? By the way, thanks for the reply on the other thread. I probably would've messed that up. I'll get a filter replacement ASAP! Keep me posted on what to do! Thanks.

[Hoosier]

I'm slowly working my way up on the temp. I don't want to increase it that much all at one right? If I do won't that stress the fish even more?

[falcon]

Raise the temperature slowly. probably one degree twice a day should be ok. If you fish can take it, take it up to 86F.

[PumaWard]

Pumaward, how can you treat for ich and tail rot at the same time if you're removing the ich med?

The heat and salt will take care of the ich. You want the ich medication out of the tank so it doesn't cause problems with any anti-bacterial medications. You would then remove the carbon and add the anti-bacterial meds to the tank.

[beviking]

If the heat and salt will take care of the ich, why add ich meds? Just seems like xtra work.

[Hoosier]

I did another water change of 50%. I also added more salt and turned the heat up a little bit more. Tomorrow, I'm going to test the water and see what my perimeters are. My fish seem to be a little bit happier as far as today goes. I'll keep you guys posted on any updates that I have.

[PumaWard]

Ich is parasitic, the heat and salt are the only "meds" I said to use for ich.

Finrot is bacterial, therefore you would treat it with anti-bacterial medications.

By doing this, you can kill 2 birds with one stone.. kinda ;)

[beviking]

Originally posted by PumaWard
Okay, do this.

...Just make sure that you remove all the ich medication with a 50% water change and having activated carbon in your filter for a few hours.

...The heat and salt will take care of the ich. You want the ich medication out of the tank so it doesn't cause problems with any anti-bacterial medications.


O.k., just sounded like you were also recommending ich meds other than salt and heat. My bad, I just don't recall 50% water changes removing all of the salt or carbon removing salt either. Call me silly!;)

[Hoosier]

Sorry, I haven't been home to have computer access. I've been out of town for a few days. When I was gone I had a friend looking over the tank, and I left him with some detailed instructions. Well, now that I'm back I checked up on my tank. I still have all of the same survivors and haven't lost any new fish. They are tons better than what they were when I left. The stuff over there eyes is pretty much gone. I'm keeping a good eye on it until it's all gone though. Thanks everyone for all the help with this subject!!