water issues... I think...Any info would be appreciated

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Lazersniper

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Mar 9, 2004
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I recently bought a Ctenolucius hujeta. (slant nosed gar/freshwater barracuda) It died on me about three days afterwards. The lfs I bought it from is very trustworthy. It is privately owned, and the owners are very knowlegdeable. Every fish I've bought from there has survived up til now and all info I have recieved have been accurate upon research on the net.

The tank I put it in is very well established, has been running for almost a year now. The other fish that reside in the tank are all very healthy. The hujeta died on the third day, a day after I fed it a feeder guppy also purchased from the same store. I personally think it was bad feeders because 5 of the 8 I bought also dropped. However the 2 left seem to be doing fine. The owner has a seven day garruntee on his fish so I brought it back. He thought it maybe the water because this was 'one of the best feeder shipments he's seen'. I've tried to more research this fish, and I haven't found too much but the sites I have found do say that they may be more sensitive to water parameters. This is where my problem resides.

Secs: (in tank)
ph= 8 or higher
kh=180-300
gh=150-300
nitrite=0
nitrate=20-40

The test results have been consistent. I have well water. I am using jungle brand tests. Idealy the Gar needs a lower ph and softer water. All my other fish would idealy do better in lower ph and softer water as well but they seem to be just fine. I'm afraid that the gar however is infact more sensitive.

As I understand from internet sources the kh is what keeps the ph stable. With such a high kh is there any hope for me in lowering the ph? If so how? I've read on so many internet sites that most solutions don't work or have very little effect. As well the gh is very high. How can I bring this down effectivly? Money is an issue so I can't just go out right now and spend hundreds on ro gadgets or anything like that but conditioners or cheep home made solutions would be ok.

Lastly has any kept Ctenolucius hujeta before? Any helpful hints or info on this fish would be helpful.

Thanks for your time I know it's long but please help.
 
How did you acclimate the fish to your tank? What water chemistry was it in when you bought it?

There are not any reliable methods of lowering the pH when you have sky-high KH--I think vinegar additions--with careful monitoring--would help. I would use the vinegar on the water change water, and this should gradually lower the KH in the tank as well. However--changing water chemistry is usually NOT needed, as long as you acclimate carefully.
 
Please define acclimate for me. I think your asking me what steps I've taken to help normalize the fish to my tanks conditions.

If thats what you're asking then I floated the fish for about 15 mins. Afterthat I added some tank water into the bag, I believe twice with five min. intervals. I then put the fish in.

Most web sites I've read do tell me that water chemistry changes are not needed, however I would rather be safe then sorry and lose another. I would feel better knowing that it was a bad feeder, then not doing anything and having another die. Also my readings seem much higher then what I'ved seen for most others.

I don't know what the water chemistry is at the store, but I assume that he keeps it at around 7ph and has much softer water. When I showed him my specs. he made the comment of how he had never/rarely seen water that high before.

I've also read that they are very nervouse fish and in the wild they usually hunt in groups. I bought him solo, do you think this may have effected anything? I hopefully will be picking up the 'replacement' fish tomorrow and I'm thinking maybe I should get another to help with this.

As for the vinegar how much and how often. Will the vinegar effect anything else in my tank? (i.e. amonia levels, nitrite, nitrate, anything that will effect my fish)
 
Yep--that's what acclimation means. Those steps sound fine, I doubt it would have been a difference in water chemistry that killed the fish. I do not know much about the larger predators, but I think most of them are wild caught? If so, there are numerous possibilities. One, the fish didn't aclimate to being in a tank. Two, the fish had an internal parasite that killed eat. Three, it was severaly shocked sometime prior to going into your tank (ie, capture, transport) and suffered some injury that killed it.
Four, the feeder was bad. I don't use feeder fish, but I would be suspicious of a group where more than half of them died--doesn't sound healthy to me.

I would say that you should be fine getting another one.

For the vinegar--my understanding is entirely from reading--I've never used it. But, the acid will reduce the buffer (KH) and there may be a slight decline in the GH as well. The pH will go down. Sudden shifts would be the big concern, which is why I would work on the water in a bucket, rather than in your main tank. You'll probably notice a precipitate form on the bottom of the tank, and you don't want to dump this into your tank. Otherwise, it shouldn't affect the nitrogen in your system--a sudden change in chemistry might, but a gradual one won't.
 
Thanks much for the help. I'm really hoping that it was either the feeder or the fish and not that it was healthy to begin with but my water killed it. It did seem kinda of odd tho. He sat in a corner and didn't move for the first couple days. When I dropped in the feeder it didn't even swim after it, it just sat there. After a while the feeder swam by the gars mouth. The gar then snached it up. Other then that it just sat in the corner of the tank.

I don't really like having to trust store bought feeders either. I'm working on having a bach of feeders of my own. It's just that the guppies are too small right now and not mature enough to breed.

Well I guess I'll just have to see how it goes with the new one. I think I will get a pair or maybe three just to see if there is any difference. Hopefully they won't die as well.

If anyone else has any exp. on raising this fish please give me some info. / feedback.
 
Well, the behavior really isn't that odd. Gars are lurk and snatch predators--they don't hunt, they just hang out in weedy areas, and wait for a fish to swim within range, then lunge out and chomp it. They really aren't that active a fish.
 
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