Anyone think Algae-eradicating chemicals are a good idea?

[Leopardess]

After a conversation with another member at a different forum...I'm curious.

I suggest that when someone has an algae problem, that they try to figure out WHY they are having it to begin with. I said its all about balance. Told him it may be too many phosphates, iron levels are too high, nitrates too high, too much light, direct sun light, etc. I said that it is best to avoid chemicals whenever possible. Partly because they don't belong in a fish tank, and partly because they are more like a bandaid for the problem. If something is out of balance, the algae will probably just return. And who wants to always be spending money on products they don't need? Sure, if you've tried everything else, use them. But don't you guys think that you should try to isolate the source of the problem instead??

I was told that I wasn't offering any help and that I wasn't being realistic - and that water changes won't help anything at all ( like lowering levels of nitrates, silicates, phosphates, etc).

I'm looking for responses so that I can possibly share this thread with the person.

Do you automatically jump to chemical "cures" or attempt to use other means first?

[valerie]

I would never recommend adding algae killing chemicals to your tank, even if you think the problem is out of control.

I agree with you that if you dont' find the reason you are getting algae that it will jsut come back. I would suggest finding the reason(be it high nitrates,iron,phosphates,lighting ect.) correct it then manually remove the algae.Either by scrubbing decorations,bleaching, scrapping the glass.

I have gone through many algae outbreaks(especially BBA) and have always been able to get it under control by cleaning it off and keeping up with water changes.

[daveedka]

I am in full agreement with comments made so far. Under no circumstances would I add chemicals to clear up Algea. This is absolutely a band aid and not a cure. Some algea is always present in a healthy tank, but excessive algea is the sign of a problem. As was said already the problem needs to be found and corrected, not hidden temporarily. A full blown green water bloom can usually be eradicated by blocking out the light for a few days or filtering with a very fine cartridge, or a diatom filter. but if the source of the problem isn't found it will just come right back when the lights are turned on. Water changes will not help an algea bloom, but will help decrease the water situation that led up to it. chemicals will kill the algea temporarily but will also require a lot of water changes because the dead/decomposing algea will lead to repeats. If this person is dealing with a full blown green water situation, I would reccomend daily water changes and keeping the tank in total darkness untill the water clears up water changes without blocking the light will not help as the algea will continue to bloom and grow. Then I would do significant testing and bring the nutrient levels back into control. I'm not an expert, but fought my share of algea wars when I first started out. The only way to win is to control your water parrameters, and remove the situation that allowed the algea to take control in the first place.

[Leopardess]

Thank you both. That's exactly what I was thinking:)

Anyone else got something to share?

[Bustedthumb]

I agree with all the answers so far. Finding the source of the problem(s) is really the only logical thing to do. Anything else is a 'bandaid'. Personally, I try to keep enough algea eating fish and bottom feeders in all tanks...just to help keep things clean. Like someone already said...it's a balance. I have found my bamboo shrimp to be worth his weight in gold. Not so much for algea, but for the filter feeding aspect. In some tanks it's hard to keep algea eaters from becoming prey. But some issues with algea is from too much light. So cut that down first. Once the lights go out, the 'cleaning crew' gets busy while the predators are catching some Z's. As long as there is sufficient hiding places for the wee ones (oto's and the like) I don't have problems.

[OrionGirl]

Yep, I agree, and that's the philoshophy shared by most people here. There are a lot of people who want instant 'fixes', even if they are only temporary, and way too many LFS happy to provide people with a long and expensive list of curatives. I like the KISS strategy--Keep It Simple, Stupid!. Unfortunately, simple isn't often the easy route, and many people don't want to solution that increases their work. I won't fight with someone who advocates lots of chemicals, and IMO, your best response to their attacks is a simple "YMMV".

[Locust]

I think people have a fairly schizophrenic view of chemical usage. After all, CO2 and plant fertilizers are both added chemicals and they're right after WPG on the list of recommendations for a planted aquarium. Add to that meds, water conditioners, stress coats, cycling products, specialty substrates, and everything else that goes in your aquarium that isn't entirely inert and any prohibitions on the grounds of something being a 'chemical' sounds rather arbitrary.

That said, I agree with you on algae fixes. IMHO, algae fixes aren't a poor choice because they're chemicals but rather because they are generally less effective then the other alternatives.

[JesseJ]

I don't really have much to add to this other then the fact that I've tried a lot of different ways to clear algae and I found that the chemical solutions don't usually work. The only permanent solution I've found is to add live plants and outcompete the algae for nutrients.

[Leopardess]

Thanks guys. Looking for some more replies too:)

[DEmigh]

I share the general abhorence of "chemical" solutions, but make a distinction between chemicals that are outright toxic (i.e. algicides) and chemicals that create a clumping effect. There are some water clearing additives on the market that are more mechanical than chemical in their effect. These chemicals promote aggregation of small particles into larger groups that can be more effectively removed by a filter. I always follow treatment with these agents by a large water change and a filter media scrubbing/replacement.

My personal experience with green water blooms is that, while they are unsightly, the fish don't seem stressed at all. I counsel patience.

Hope this helps...:confused:

[Karlsbad]

When I was a brand new fish keeper, actually when my girlfriend was doing the fish keeping, we had a pleco and she dropped 2 wardley algae tabs in the 10g and left them there and the pleco didn't touch them, the next morning the water was opaque brown. We didn't know d--k, and the fish experts we were talking to worked at petco. Yeah if we had known what an accpeptable product was it would have been great, we ended up with some fizzing thing that worked well then the algae came back in 2 hours as badly as before, even after cleaning the glass and changing all the water and vaccuming it kept coming back within 12 hours(we were also giving it indirect sunlight, that algae crisis is when we learned that one :) ), but having starved it for light we still only got rid of it by completely breaking down the tank(at least thats what we did, being total noobs who knows exactly how well we did what ;)

I don't know what the moral is exactly except that there's too much crap out there, it was an emergency at least we thought(I mean this water was like mud, it had to be bad for the fish). I think they have a place but yeah its generally going to be newbies who end up needing them and its a shame that they run the risk of picking or being sold some crap. Its like so many of those chemicals out there, I really feel for the panicking people who they're being sold to. Of course removing the cause of the problem is the only real solution, it would be nice if there were some organization that endorsed products so people could know they were buying something real, and if there was informative easy literature required to be included with endorsed products, so you could get a break from the problem and make it not come back.

Of course I think putting chemicals in your tank should be avoided almost completely. I would never add anything without asking here first. That chemical adding newbie phase makes me shudder to remember.

This actually makes me think about a post I want to ask a question about.

[750t]

I tried ap's algea fix. It was not something that I would recommend. While it did kill off the algea it took some plants too. But I found my problem phosphates in my tap water. I would tell anyone who has an algea issue that there is something in the tank causing it.

[Karlsbad]

Originally posted by OrionGirl
, and IMO, your best response to their attacks is a simple "YMMV".

What the hell is YMMV?

[Leopardess]

You know, I was wondering the same thing but figured it was a dumb question and didnt' ask it ....hehe

[OrionGirl]

;) Your Mileage May Vary.

[Karlsbad]

I was thinking it meant You Might Make Vodka

[Bustedthumb]

I happen to have a bottle of AP's algea fix also. I've used it in my community tank before with mixed results. While it does get rid of the algea for a short (very short) time, it also doesn't go well with fishes. Moments after adding it to the tank, one of my neons started floating on his side. After a few minutes he was able to 'right' himself again, but it scared me. I haven't used it since. I don't have much algea problems, but when I do, I simply leave the light off. I have an abundance of various algea eaters nowadays, and they take pretty good care of it while the lights are off. Also, they can get ahead of the bloom while the light is off (the algea stops growing, but they keep eating). I have to agree with locust though, we do add all sorts of things to the water already. So i think it all comes down to what you want to do with your tank. I personally like the little bottom feeders and algea suckers and whatnot, so I tend to go heavy on those. Some people have all plastic plants, so a chemical (providing it doesn't harm the fish) might be a good way to go so long as your aware that most of them don't work, or only work for a brief time. Hence, you're always buying more. Some peope leave the hood light on 24/7...sure, they're gunna have algea. In part I think it might be personal preference. The other part being how well people want to troubleshoot and problem solve. And the amount of effort/time/money they're willing to put into solving the problem.

[RTR]

Okay, the arch conservative will chime in...BLTN, right?

(Better Late Than Never)

If for some reason I had to use copper at algicide levels in one of my tanks, or if someone else added such, I would follow up with tossing the plants, the substrate, the filter media, possibly the filter, and the tank. Copper is forever. it plates out in the substrate and on the plants and even the tank glass. I keep inverts. Copper is deadly poison for them. I have no use for any copper-contaminated material in my life.

Yes, copper is a required nutrient at trace levels, and as such is in Flourish and similar products which are added routinely to my tanks. But the levels are tiny, true trace amounts. Algicides, even most non-copper based ones, skate the thin line between killing molluscs and crustaceans and killing fish and plants - there is no real dividing dosage, they overlap widely.

As for adding chemicals, that is a hollow argument - everything you feed your fish (or yourself) is a chemical, or more accurately a complex mixture of chemicals both organic and inorganic. Your tap water is a dilute (hopefully) chemical solution. I do not add anything to my tanks that I do not understand to at least some degree. I have some advantage over most folks there as I was a lab scientist for many years, but lack of background information is to me not an excuse for falling for marketing hype to the detriment of you tanks. Karlsbad's comments were valuable on that - mistakes were made, but lessons were learned.

Quick fixes without understanding do a great deal more harm than good. And they rarely are lasting.

[Karlsbad]

btw my 'girlfriend' let indirect light shine on my tank for about 5 hours the other day. 2 water changes and gravel vaccuumings, 1 hose cleaning, 2 glass cleanings, 1 full maintenance of all my filters, 3 media cleanings, and 1 diatom runs ago, and the filters are still backing up albeit less and not as quickly. I think tomorrow will be the last time I have to do all that until its gone. Today was the first time I saw that slime crap on the gravel.

On the day she did it I was like OH F--K but the water was clear all day, the next morning it was like someone had mixed it with 25% milk and there was hair on the glass.