Pullin my hair out by the roots ! ouch

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JerkyBob

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Mar 14, 2004
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Ok now that I have your attention I need some help or advice or both... Here is my story, the name has been changed to protect the stupid, namely me... One month ago I purchased from my lfs a supposedly complete 75 gallon swt. Here is what the guy told me I needed and this is what I got : Obviously an aquarium, the filtration consists of emperor 400 and an emperor 280, protein skimmer, diy plenum and around 4 inches of cc. I was also told to get 4 bags of aragalive which is an inch or so when spread out. All the numbers look good in my aquarium and the couple of fish I have seem to be doing great. I also have put 10 lbs of live rock in the aquarium. I know I need more. Ok everything seems to be going good but then I find this site and after reading about setups and stuff it seems the filters I have purchased are all but completely needless... The cc is wrong and I shoulda used playsand. And havent read anything of a plenum yet. Well now here is my dilemma. Do I need to redo my aquarium removing all the cc and putting in sand. replace the filters with powerheads,
and I already know I need more live rock. Also I do have another question, why is all my live rock turning brown? also the live sand in the aquarium is turning brown. I have done my partial water changes twice already and keep all my tests updated. Please give me some advice cuz I really do want a beautiful successful longterm tank, so how do I get there from here. Thanks In Advance for everything ,,, especially this site.........
 
I lack in experience with CC becuase I have never used it and I have never had the need to find out what is wrong with it. As for the filters, I would definantly keep those. Added water circulation! You could also use them for carbon if you ever need it or if you want to put in some phosphate remover or anything that you would like to add.
 
The main "problem" with CC is that it's too big for the detrivores to do their jobs properly, and too coarse to prevent detritus from sifting down and becoming a nitrate nightmare.

Another difficulty with CC is that, to create a desirable hypoxic environment for nitrate metabolizing bacteria, it has to be in the neighborhood of 18 inches deep!

Your setup has aragonite sand over CC (if I read your post correctly) That could possible take care of the main problem listed above, but you'll want to watch carefully to see that your sand doesn't sift down into the CC. If that happens, there's just not enough sand to keep your overall substrate "stirrable" by the little creatures that call it home.

Please give more info about your plenum. My understanding of pleni (just had to try that plural :) ) is that their purpose is to take care of the other difficulty listed above, namely that of providing a hypoxic environment.

I agree with Andy16 about not tossing your Emperors. Keep 'em, but pull all the media except for when you have specific needs as he outlined.

Since your tank is only a month old, I would suggest removing the biowheels only gradually, perhaps one per two weeks, because a significant part of your bio-filter could well reside on those wheels at this time.

I don't think you have a disaster on your hands. There are lots of ways to skin a cat, and lots of ways to measure success in this hobby.

Welcome to Aquaria Central!
 
about plenum

First off thanks to the people that replied :D My plenum consists of 1/2 inch pvc put together in a rectangular frame about 1/2 off of the glass on each side of the aquarium. on top of the pvc is "egg crate" plastic cut to fit the frame and attached with plastic ties. on top is fiberglass screening also attached with the ties. then put cc about two inches then another screen then two more inches of cc then an inch of live sand. the plenum was recommended by a biology professor in town. thanks again :)

Jerky Bob


Favorite saying " Dont talk about the fit until you try on the shoe "
 
Hey Jerky Bob,

Welcome to AC! Plena (I think that's the plural?) are the subject of endless debate. It is also called the "Jaubert" or "Monaco" method, because Professor Jaubert at the Monaco Aquarium came up with the idea of having a semi-anaerobic pocket under the sandbed. It seems to work fine. Some lazy Americans tried the same thing, but with just sand and no plenum, and it seemed to work just fine too. I can recommend a few books if you care to learn more.

Because you are in the starting stages, and because I am not the one who has to do the work, I would get rid of the CC. Also, take everything you hear from your LFS in the future with a grain of salt. It's not that I feel really strongly that it will be a disaster, but now is the best time to get on the right track. We know that beds of playsand work, but I don't know of anyone who has tried a DSB of CC.

I don't have an opinion about the plenum. I think they are out of favor because they are just a little more work to set up, and may cause trouble if you have anybody who digs.
 
Plenums are an acceptable substitute for a deep sand bed. You'll want to make sure there isn't a lot of solid wastes that get trapped in the substrate, but that's not a big deal.

I would remove the media from the filters (which should also reduce the evaporation you've been having, I'm sure!) in sections, and add some live rock with each bit you pull out. That will get you the benefit of live rock without losing the bacterial benefits from the media colonies.

There really are lots of ways to do this hobby. Some work, other's depend on the individual. CC isn't awful, it just isn't ideal--unless compensations are made in terms of providing a place for the anaerobic bacteria.
 
A note to Andy16, DEmigh, Mogurnda, and Oriongirl

Thanks Andy16, DEmigh, Mogurnda, and Oriongirl for all the helpful information. I am going to change the cc to a dsb tomorrow. will I still need the plenum:confused: The only playsand there is around here is made by quikrete and is kinda a dull orange. I am guessing this is what you are talking about but please let me know. What do I mix in with this sand and how much? Im going to use a 20 gal xtra tank I have to put my liverock and fish in until my tank cycles... again.... Also one more question if you dont mind. I have been told by several people that I still need a wet/dry filter. Is this true? Thanks again and I really am glad I found a place that has the answers. Jerky Bob
 
I use a plenum in my 90 gallon and have had no issues with it but, others have had the same luck without one. I was just too lazy to remove it. I'm not sure about that brand of play sand but, I'd try to find out if it was pure silica,"hopefully". I would be afraid since it's red that it might have iron oxides in it and that would be bad for your tank. The playsand should be good though because it has such a good variety of grain sizes and you want that for gentrification. Not trying to complicate the whole playsand issue but, I live inland as well and lots of times sand is mined and it has other mineral inclusions in it.
anyway hth
Chris
 
I think your rock is turning brown because of diatoms. Perfectly natuaral in a new tank. You will go through all kinds of stages in a new tank. A tank takes at least 6 months to mature.
What you should look for as far as sand is southdown. It also goes be the name Old Kastle. You can find it at a Home Depot or similar store. I ended up finding mine at a reefshop. 40lb bag for 10.00. A home depot or whatever maybe 5 bucks a bag. It is definately worth looking for. Just remember a little goes along way. I have 3 bags in my 55 and although its not considered a deep sand bed there is plenty for all the pods, etc.
 
Wal-Mart carries the sand also but I can't remember what the name is they use. It is aragonite sand that you are looking for. the consistancy of sugar is what you want. Once you get the "southdown" you can seed it with a couple of pounds of live sand from an established aquarium and there are even some places on the internet that sell live sand. Dr. Mac and Sons Corals is where I got about 5 lbs for my 75g.

Yes the diatoms are what is turning the rocks and such brown in your tank, and that is a natural process;)


http://www.drmaccorals.com/sys-tmpl/door/


course ordering from mac and sons for me was a pretty cheap thing as they are here in maryland with me:p


ps--I also ordered live rock from them, I liked the idea that I could call him on the phone and tell him the size and shape of the pieces I was looking for and he did his best to find it for me :)
 
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