Hello, and advice on my new tank please?!

jcf1

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May 24, 2004
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First of all, hello to all!

I've been keeping freshwater aquaria on and off for years, and have decided to try my hand at marine.
Now I've set my tank and am letting it mature, and would like some advice on suitable stock. I'll explain what I have in mind and if anyone thinks its a stupid idea, let me know!

My setup:
32*12*16 glass tank (capacity 21 UK gallons = 96 litres = 26 US gallons I think)
1 18Watt marine tube
2 powerheads
1 15watt(?) heater
3" depth coral sand
10 kilos of fijian live rock (lovely and purple!)

I set up the tank with coral sand, and got the salt sorted, then added liverock after a day, when it was up to temperature and the salinity settled.
I was worried about bunging the rock in straight away, but figured I had enough to get away with it.

Should I add anything to the tank in the next couple of weeks to speed up cycling?
After a couple of weeks I wanted to add some shrimp/crabs. I was thinking maybe a couple of fire shrimp or boxing shrimp, and a couple of suitable crabs (any ideas?).

After a further 2 weeks, I wanted to gradually add some fish. Now ideally I wanted a pair of clownfish, a pair of yellow tang, a cardinal, a couple of royal gramma and a fuzzy dwarf lionfish.

I would also like a couple of anenome, maybe a couple of polyps, a starfish and some mushroom coral.

Now as I see it there are 2 concerns of mine 1) too much fish, too little tank?
2)The lionfish will eat my shrimp and gramma when he's big enough.

Now I dont mind substituting or losing some of these, but really would like the lionfish, clownfish, coral and anenomes, so the tank would be built around those, really.

Any opinions, or suggestions would be gratefully recieved.
 
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Hi

Let me first ask this ... are you planning on putting all those fish in that tank? If so you're not going to like the results. The pair of clowns would be ok but definitely NOT the Tangs. The tangs need at least a 75 gallon on their own. Also, the dwarf lion ... that fish would need a 30 gallon minimum and they are messy fish which creat a lot of waste in the tank. Not to mention that the lion would more than likely make a meal of the 2 clowns if kept together as the lion gets to be about 6-7 inches and the clown only about 3. Lions can eat anything they can fit into their mouths which is roughly halt it's body size. It will also probably take out any inverts as that's what they like to eat. If you kept that fish in a small tank it should be the ONLY fish. You might be able to put a royal gramma in with the clowns but I think you're only suppose to keep 1 gramma per tank (correct me if I'm wrong somebody).

As for the anemones, DON"T. They don't do well in captivity. Even experienced hobbiests have trouble keeping them. They need very good lighting and excellent tank conditions, not something you're going to have for a while. Most people here probably wouldn't recommend even trying one until you've been in the hobby a little while and you tank is AT LEAST 6 months old and holding parameters consistantly.

That's about all I can add I think. I have had my tank (a 40 gal long) for just about a year now and have had my ups and downs with fish and water parameters and inverts. You do get adicted. One thing I've learned ... it's better to do it right the first time! If you can get a bigger tank, I would ... If you can afford better lighting right away, I would ... etc. Considering all the fish, inverts, corals, mushrooms, rock and the tank set up I'd have to say that I've got around $2500 invested in my hobby tank so far. I would make sure to research anything you decide to put in the tank to make sure it's not something that will devistate any future plans, I think you're on the right track.

Hope this helps you some.

Good luck
 
That's great, thanks!

In reflection then, strike the anenome, tangs and lionfish.

Perhaps soemthing like this:

2 Hermit Crab
3 Domino Damsel
1 Gramma
2 clownfish
1 cardinal

1 starfish
Mushroom coral
a polyp or two

I can get the domino damsel at 1 inch long and reove them from the tank when they get bigger, as a friend has a larger tank already stocked with just damsels. My plan being to introduce them first to get the tank cycling and stable. Could I keep one in or would it get too aggressive/large? I've heard lots of conflicting things abou these fish. My friend has 4 together with no problems in a 45 gallon tank.

Incidentally I picked up an extra 4kg of live rock today, so that's 14kg in total in the tank, just to speed up and maintain some decent cycling.

Does this sound more sensible to you?
I'd rather get any planning done early before it comes to adding anything at all.
 
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jcf1,

That's a similar number of fish as I'm considering for my 45 gallon tank that is cycling now, and I'm slightly worried about being overstocked.

General concensus is that damsels are highly aggressive as a group, including both 3-spot dominoes and golden dominoes. They will particularly try to kill related species, like clownfish, chromis, and other damsels. However, if you want to have damsels for a while and then pull them out before putting in the other fish, you could try it. I'd wait for somebody experienced in nano tanks to give real input before taking my word for it, though.

Unless you are using a mechanical filtration system, you will want a lot more cleaner invertebrates. If you want a small number of hermit crabs, you'll want 15-30 snails to clean your tank. Hermits clean sand and rock. Snails clean everything, depending on species.

The starfish really depends on what type you are talking about. There are manytypes and they eat different stuff.
 
So maybe a few more hermit crabs, and take away the damsels before stocking with the other fish?

So start with:

3 Damsels
5 hermit crabs
7 snails

for a couple of months
then take away the damsels and add:


1 dwarf flame angel
2 royal gramma or pseudochromis

wait a month or so and add:

1 cardinal
2 clownfish
1 small coral
2 polyps or 1 polyp and an orange sea-star

How's that?
If not maybe someone could suggest a better community/timescale for me?
 
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2 royal gramma in the same tank will usually attempt to kill each other.

7 fish in a 26 gallon tank is probably too many to be healthy, from what I've read. Clownfish and psuedochromis are semi-aggressive. Royal gramma and cardinals are peaceful. The semi-aggressives are much more likely to attack the peaceful fish and each other the smaller the tank is, and 26 gallons is small enough that more than two or three fish will bump into each other quite a bit. You might end up with a fair bit of carnage.

EDIT:
This might help. Interpret 'C' as "if you have a big tank and are experienced with these species.".
Live Aquaria compatibility chart
 
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Ah, thats excellent! Thanks!

Right, having seen that - here's what I'd like to work towards :

1 Dwarf Flame angel
2 Royal Gramma
1 Cardinal
1 Clownfish

1 mushroom coral
1 polyp
1 orange sea-star

5 scarlet hermits
7 turbo snails or similar


I'll see how the clownfish fares, if it gets too aggressive I'll remove it, if not great!
 
hmmmm

Sounds like you're getting better at picking suitable tankmates but you're still overstocking.

In that small a tank I would suggest this ...

FISH:
2 clownfish
1 royal gramma
MAYBE 1 cardinal

Scrap the dwarf flame Angel, it's a beautiful and ACTIVE fish and will outgrow that tank. I have a 40 gallon long and that's the smallest tank I'd even consider putting a flame angel in.

Your mushroom coral and polyp could be ok but you might have to upgrade your lighting. Try them and see how they do, they might just have to reside toward the top of the tank.

Snails and hermits sound good. If you try that many and your tank doesn't seem clean enough you can always add to those.

Your tank is just sand, rock and saltwater right now, right? Do not add any living thing (fish, corals/shrooms/polyps, inverts) until your cycle is done or you'll just be killing everything and spending $$$. Monitor you water parameters every day or 2 for the ammonia and nitrate spikes. Once everything settles after those you should be good to SLOWLY add you inhabitants. I'd start with the clowns first. Maybe a couple hermits with them. Then a week or 2 later add the rest of your cleaning crew. After another week or 2, if your water parameters aren't fluctuating/spiking then you could add the gramma. As long as things are good you can probably add the shrooms/polyps whatever after teh gramma. See how things go and if you're still doing ok in another week or 2 you could try adding the cardinal but that's asking a lot from your tank.

Do you have a filter or a skimmer? If you plan to overstock the tank with that amny fish I would greatly suggest getting a good skimmer. You have enough live rock that you shouldn't need a filter, that's what the rock is for. I think a skimmer is a must for just about any tank, especially if you're going to put in the shrooms/polyps.

Ok, just more of my opinions. Hope this gives you an idea of what might work. With such a small tank it greatly limits what you can do. You'll also find that you're going to need to really watch the water and keep up of topoffs and changes regularly to keep the tank healthy.

Best of luck.
 
Really think about adding a small quarantine tank to that list.

It is the simplest and easiest way to avoid problems- and avoid having to catch all those fish by tearing your tank apart when you get ich.
Not *if* you get ich.... when.
 
I have another small tank - which will easily be used for quarantine.

I intend to get a skimmer in the next week, I used to have one for my piranha, but its seen better days.

I have a cannister filter in there at the moment, and intend to remove the media after a few days (opinions?) - this consists of foam and activated carbon foam. Then it'll just be a powerhead.

I also have an external cannister filter, which I could use, from my freshwater setup, this also would make use of the inline UV steriliser, which I'm considering.

I'll probably take your advice re. the flame angel, as I've been kind of suspecting this since actually seeing one.

I'll probably start with some damsels once its fully cycling, to be removed when I add the first permanent fish, since they're hardier and I know I can rehome them.
That'll probably be in a months time.

I've added live rock already, after a days settling in. I used a larger amount, because according to my friend (whos had some 10yrs experience) its the quickest way to get cycling fast, and with a large amount will prevent it just dying if its fully cured (which it is). I'm a bit nervous about this, but he assures me it works well. If anyone has any ideas/opinions on this, I'd be interested.
 
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