need suggestions for new 29g tank

[lethalp]

I am currently cycling a fishless 29g tank. My water has a high ph of about 8.6. Any suggestions on what kind a cichlids I can put in? I like the looks of the parrot fish. Also are there any other types of fish that can be put with them(cichlids I means)? I would like to have some bottom feediers if possible. I need to find a new home for my common pleco, can he hang out with them?

[friend of oscar]

With that high ph you would probabley want to go with africans but I have no experiance with any africans so maybe someone else could help better.

[Tightdog1]

some sort of african you have excellent pH for them

[lethalp]

Ok, I have read that most Lake Malawi Ciclids fit my water prof, but as I said I only have a 29g tank. This is my very first tank ever, I might add, I am doing a fishless cycle now :D I am guessing that with my tank being smallish I am gonna run into some that fit the water, but not the tank. Can anyone head me off at the pass? Thanks

[Nyasa]

There are very few fish from Lake Malawi that you can keep happily in a 29 gallon tank. Iodotropheus sprengerae ( rusty cichlid) and Labidochromis caeruleus ( electric yellow ) are possibilities. A better alternative would be fish from Lake Tanganyika. Your pH is perfect for these fish. Consider altolamprologous calvus or altolamprologous compressiceps, julidochromis transcriptus or julidochromis ornatus, or any of the shelldweller species Neolamprologous brevis, multifasciatus etc. Add a few Syndontis catfish and you'll have a beautiful Lake Tanganyikan biotope. :)

[kzarsky]

If you have african cichlids in there they won't display their 'normal' behavior in a 29.

If you do want to start with cichlids there are a couple that are smaller. however, you need to be careful not to introduce two males of either Mawali or Tanganyikan into a 29 gallon tank as they will fight to the death.

I agree with other reply that there are very limited choices but even that limit will provide you with wonderful color and interesting behaviors...in addition to size you want to avoid those that are too aggressive. thoughts from my malawi tank.

MALAWI
pseudotropheus saulosi (OK - not too aggressive)
Pseudotropheus lombardoi (OK - but shy and will need hiding places)
Pseudotropheus socolfi (OK - not too aggressive)
Melanochromis johanni (OK - not too aggressive)
Pseudotropheus zebra gold (OK)
Melanochromis auratus (too aggressive)
Melanochromis chipokae (too aggressive)
Pseudotropheus crabro aka bumblebee cichlid (TOO large)
Metriaclima (too aggressive)

TANGANYIKAN (research)
Lamprologus are generally ok - however;
ALTOLAMPROLOGUS COMPRESSICEPS - these are aggressive
Altolamprologus calvus - can get large for a 29 ga
Julidochromis marlieri (too large and aggressive)
Julidochromis transcriptus or Julidochromis marlieri "Gombi". (OK)
Tropheus duboisi - may be too large as it grows to 12 cm
Cyprichromis leptosoma and microlepidotus (OK)

Hope this helps!

[lethalp]

Thanks for the suggestions guys, but I need more info. On the Tanganyika side, what do they need in the tank and what do they eat? What about dwarf ciclids? can they go in a 29g? All the suggestions are great, but could I have some common names?:p how bout other species, can anything but cichlids be in the tank (bottom feeders?) I am really getting discouraged, my 29g tank isn't even through its fishless cycle yet and now I think I may need an even bigger tank :( Geez maybe I should stick with dogs huh? Anyway please keep up the suggestions and I will look at what has already Thanks!

[Nyasa]

hey lethalp,
Don't be discouraged. A 29 gallon is a great tank to start with. That's what I started with now I have a 29, a 20 and a 90 gallon that will soon be ready to go. You just go with what you have. Sounds like your going about it the right way doing some research and a fishless cycle are great starts!
Tanganyikans don't need too much. Warm water T of 23-29 degrees Celsius with pH>8 and lots of rocks. If you'd like to try it some plants will grow in water of this pH, Vallisneria and Anubia are good examples. However you may find that your cichlids are uprooting them on a regular basis.
If by dwarf cichlids, you are referring to Apistogrammas, these fish are not well suited to your water. They prefer acidic pH. However Tanganyikan shelldwellers are among the smallest cichlids known to man and they would be well suited to your water parameters. They prefer a sandy substate and a collection of shells.
Unfortunately, the confusion in the hobby brought on by common names ie. 'electric blue' has necessitated the use of Latin names so people know what they're talking about. Once you get used to it, it's rather impressive to reel off a list of Latin names.
There are many bottomfeeders that are suitable for the cichlid aqarium. The Synodontis catfish native to Lake Tanganyika are great additions that would keep you true to a Tanganyikan theme. I would recommend 3-4 Synodontis petricola for your 29 gallon. If you like plecos, the Ancistrus sp. (bristlenose pleco) has proven to be a durable and adaptable species that can live under Rift Lake conditions. These plecos stay under 6" and are proven algae eaters.
I would recommend a trio of Altolamprologous calvus and a pair of either Julidochromis ornatus or Julidochromis transcriptus, but not both. The calvus males may eventually outgrow your 29 gallon, but it will take 3-4 years for them to reach their adult size. By then I am sure you will have another larger aquarium. Best of luck.

[lethalp]

Thanks so much for all your suggestions! I have been doing so much research, my head is spinning! I am really enjoying this, even though i don't have fish yet :p SO my last questions will be, what are rainbow fish? And how big of a tank would I need to properly house these Tanganyika Cichlids?

[lethalp]

oh, I forgot to ask about blunt headed cichlids (tropheus moorii) or yellow sand cichlids (Xenotilapia flavipinnis) how bout those?

[Faramir]

With that pH, don't even think about dwarf cichlids, with the exception of kribs - these would adapt. Apistos would probably not make it.

[Oh Clueless 1]

Personally... I guess it would be up to what you really want to keep...

If you were a more expierenced fish keeper I would suggest going with a peat moss filter media which will bring your PH down and IMHO give the water a really cool black water look from leaching tannins. Then you could keep pretty much anything you wanted.
The problem with this is that you might not like the black water look and you would have to an eye on your PH levels regularly. Besides that a stable PH is more healthy than the actual level.. But 8.6 is very high. Blood Parrots do best in a more neutral PH.

Here is a very informative web site that I use a lot. Look around.. Read for yourself...

PH Article (http://www.wetwebmedia.com/PlantedTksSubWebIndex/acidalkags.htm)

[Shay]

Welcome to the hobby. I'm not an expert on Africans, so my advice to you is more general.

It is great to see a person new to the hobby post his water perameters and then ask about appropriate fish. This is so much better that another first post asking how many oscars can live in a ten gallon tank.

Your 29 gallon is plenty big. Just keep in mind that you can keep every kind of fish in which you are interested, you just don't have to keep them all right now or all at one time. Pick out two or three species from the suggestions given and then focus your energy on making as beautiful, healthy a tank as possible for those species. I always prefer to look at a habitat display rather than just a fish collection.

When you get an itch to try something else, then consider purchasing another tank or returning your tank's current inhabitants. This can be a good habit to get into and will help you to ignore the impulse to overstuff your tank.

I recommend returning the pleco asap. It isn't appropriate for your tank and will only be miserable in the long run.

OK. One fish suggestion: Altolamprologus Sumbu. A dwarf Altolamprologus which you could keep in the tank forever. Armkes has them available right now for shipping + $10.
http://www.ohiexchange.com/armke/

-Shay

[kzarsky]

sorry about the latin names.

some of my favorite sites

http://www.malawicichlidhomepage.com/aquarium/fish_list.html

http://www.tanganyikan-cichlids.co.uk/Pictures.htm

[Nyasa]

Rainbowfish are beautiful looking. I've heard of some people keeping these fish with their Tangs. They prefer neutral to alkali waters and are carnivourous making them unsuitable tankmates for mbuna. I've heard of people keeping them as middle water or upper dwellers with their shelldwellers. They are schooling fish and prefer groups of at least five. They look outstanding in planted tanks. I think the glossolepis incisus ( red rainbowfish ) stays reasonably small and may be suitable for your 29 gallon tank.
Don't know too much about xenos. I think they are a schooling fish and would appreciate a longer tank. Tropheus are out of the question for your tank. They need to be kept in large groups ie. 10 or more and they need a tank that is 6 feet in length.