29 Gallon Filtration

[wannabefishguru]

Hello need some help, i can't choose what to use

what is the best filtration for a 29 gallon planted tank HOB or Canister?

which one is the best brand and less complications for a job like this?

[joephys]

I think HOB's. They are cheaper to buy and run. Aquaclear is my favorite and a lot of people on here seem to agree. (That is why I tried them, I have a top fin and a penguine, I prefer the AC). I don't use the carbon and use two sponges. Just squeeze them out in aquarium water once a month and replace the sponges when they need to be replaced. Filters with cartridges are much harder to clean, and really need to be replaced once a month.

[wannabefishguru]

maybe i should state that i would be running a pressurized CO2 system also

[reiverix]

With CO2 it's easier to control surface agitation with a canister. I've only used Fluval canisters and they do the job. Other people use other brands with mucho success also.

[joephys]

CO2 shouldn't make a difference on filter choice for the most part.

[TKOS]

Added CO2 make a huge difference in filter choice. HOB's are great filters but they create surface agitation that drives off the added CO2. Canisters can be set up to minimize surface agitation, thus keeping CO2 levels higher.

In my 29 gallon I use a Fluval 304 whihc has been great for me. You could probably get away with a Fluval 204 or something with equal output in another brand like a Filstar or Eheim. Depending on tank load a like to aim for a min of 6 times water turnover an hour. The rates are listed on the box.

[echoofformless]

I might get flamed for this, but I think the jury should still be out on whether the surface agitation of a HOB significantly robs the plants of available CO2 to such a degree that they shouldn't be used in a CO2 injected aquarium. I'm no hydrologist, but I question the usual canon that believes surface agitation causes CO2 to run screaming from a fishtank.

I only started using a DIY injection on my 20g long last week. I have a jungle in there to begin with. All of this using both a HOB (Penguin 125...yes, a biowheel...a dreaded biowheel that will obliterate the CO2!!!! muahahahahah) and a Fluval 104.

I guess what I'm saying is that if my plants grew so well without CO2, then how can some CO2 loss (if that is even what happens from surface agitation) be that bad for a planted tank that is recieving pressurized CO2? It should still have a net gain in CO2 large enough to make the necessary impact. Plus I strongly believe just by intuition that it's always good for water to circulate and make exchange with fresh air.

Okay, I'm ready to be flamed now. But one day I plan to test this.

[TKOS]

It isn't that they are bad it is that surface agitation of water leads the water to try and reach an equilibrium with the air overhead. This means if the outside air is rich in CO2 then the water would be as well. But generally there is a max level of atmopheric CO2 so the water will do its best to reach that. Gas excahge happens through agitation.

Now I have tanks that use no CO2 and have massive jungles of plants. But since I have no CO2 being added I don't worry about the agitation that happens as I know the water will reach an equilibrium anyway. Adding DIY or pressurized CO2 would be pointless, in that you will drive much of the added CO2 off. Will some excess still get used? Probably but not nearly as much as you are adding, so I see that as waste and an un-needed additive. Flourish Excell would be a better choice.

And just because the surface isn't bubbling away doesn''t mean gas exchange isn't happening anyway, it is just slowed down. Large weekly water changes will take care of stagnation lomg before it should happen. And skimmer attachments to canisters can help as well.

[happychem]

Any surface distruption will increase the rate of gas exchange - that much is a given. That doesn't, however, mean that surface distruption is a bad thing, on the contrary.

With a DIY system - from personal experience - surface distruption from an HOB can make maintaining contant, decent CO2 levels problematic. With a pressurized system this isn't such a problem, just increase the gas flow rate to compensate for the loss. Just keep the water level above the bottom of the filter return. Besides, you can always toss a filter sponge over the outflow to attenuate the return flow.

[TKOS]

I didn't mean to say it was a bad idea to have agitation, just that I thought it was counter productive to holding the added CO2 in, which means you need to add more CO2 to make up for the loss, which means more money.

I still believe that canisters are a better choice in controling surface agitation but as long as everyone is aware of what is needed to keep CO2 levels high then that is fine.

[happychem]

TKOS, my post wasn't in reply to yours, we were both composing at the same time, you just happened to have the drop on me by about 4 minutes.

Cannisters are an all around better choice, period. I was simply adding my arguments to the "HOBs aren't evil" lobby. :D

[Lauren]

degassing aside, get a canister. They are simply better. They aren't as noisy, you lose less water to evaporation, there is more filtering media. the only downside is that they are a pain to clean. But that is all but made up by the fact that you don't have to listen to it splashing ever three days.

[joephys]

What a debate. I haven't nothing against canisters, but when my CO2 is working, I get about 15-20 ppm of CO2 with my HOB (AC-50 on a 29 gallon). I do water changes once a week, and my water level has no visible drop after one week.

[TKOS]

I agree with the canisters make less noise, though that may be caused by my keeping it under the tank, inside a cabinet. Since I keep an open top tank it tends to get a fair amount of evaporation regardless. I am also able to keep the tank closer to a wall than I was using my HOB's.

I do have an HOB on my 10 gallon tank and an internal bubble box filter on my 5.5 gallon tank. And I do like them all. My HOB tends to get cleaned more frequently as I can just pull the media out without shutting things down, whereas the canister does need to be shut down. All in all it is still easy to clean.

I don't think you can go wrong with either choice, so get whichever will suit your setup and budget.

[John N.]

I recommend the Eheim Classic 2213 Canister Filter. Provides great filtration, flow, and is quiet. I've purchased several 2213s for my tanks (http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/aquascaping/13512-my-29-gallon-colossus-shrimp-farm.html), and love them.

If not, Rena Filstar XP1 or XP2 are good alternatives.

-John N.

[wannabefishguru]

no filstar please, have an xp3 never really liked it so either an ehiem or fluvel hmmm which one should i choose. well anyway thanks for the info.

[wannabefishguru]

okay here is my choices i narrowed it down to three canisters for my 29 gallon

eheim classic 2213
Tank Size 66 gallons
Pump Output 116 gph
Filter Circulation 102 gph

or Eheim Ecco at
2231 up to 35 gallons 127
2233 up to 60 gallons 145
2235 up to 80 gallons 185

or Fluvel at
Fluval 205 180 gph up to 40 gallons
Fluval 305 260 gph up to 70 gallons

Which on is the proper filtration/circulation for a 29 gallon?

[justintoxicated]

See if you can find a deal on a fluval 204, they are like 1/2 price since the 205's came out and I love mine it was $55 at foster and smith online). 205 looks the same only black? not sure what other differences are in it but it looks the same to me. I think it is a bit much for my 20 gallon, and would probably be perfect in 30-40 gallon.

after dealing with my aquasuck filter I think I'm a fluval fan all the way!

id love to own an eheim im sure they are very good but I feel they are overprice (no experience with them though)

[Lauren]

I have heard that the eheim are more reliable, but i've only had my fluvel for a year, so I don't know what an unreliable filter is yet. But I do like my fluvel.

[John N.]

A definate no on the Eheim Ecco, people who have them have regretted the purchase and wanted the Classic since it's better, easy to prime, good flow.

The Fluvals are a good alternative, quiet higher flow rate...negative are the ugly gray attachments, jet flow, and no spray bar..

The Eheim 2213 or the 2215 will be best for you. I personally would just go with the 2213. I have it on a 29, works great. But if you want the flexibility of extra flow go with the 2215.

-John N.

[wannabefishguru]

well how many times does a planted tank need to be circulated in an hour?

[John N.]

I would say 4-5 times, and hour. With planted tanks and filters, it's not really about providing Bio filtration with the filter so that's shouldn't be an issue. Filters are used for flow and mechanical filtration.

We worry most about flow, since a heavily planted tank can reduce the circulation of water quite a bit. So it's always better to go above and beyond the 4 tank cycles per hour. The Eheim has flow toggles so you can reduce flow if it ends up being too much. The fluval does not, or at least the 04' series doesn't.

-John N.