Ammonia levels won't go down! :-(

[mrbranden]

Hi.

I have a 30 gallon fresh water aquarium that I set-up back in early January. After a couple weeks I put a few Zebra Danios in to help my my tank cycle. Ammonia went up then down, nitrates up, water got cloudy, etc.. I thought everything was fine.
But now I seem to have an eternal problem with ammonia. The levels consistently stay at 6-7 ppm! The fish look miserable and am trying everything to fix it. I did regular 20-25% water changes, vacuumed the gravel, aerated it well, a bit stingy with feeding, and use Ammo Lock very sparingly.
Finally I tried a 50% water change. The ammonia level went down to 4-5 ppm. Yay. Still sucks though. I've used, and still use, THREE different ammonia test kits just to double and triple check.
Nitrates have now been consistently low. Did my tank somehow "uncycle"?

NO2 = <0.3 mg/l
NO3 = 2.5 pm

Temperature and pH are normal. I'm using a Penguin 170 filter w/bio wheel.

Anyone have any ideas??

Thanks!

---Branden

[OrionGirl]

Ammolock prevents your tank from cycling--it takes the ammonia out before the bacteria colony can develop to consume it. However, another piece of the puzzle--do you have chloramines in your water? If so, what are you using to address them?

From what you're stated, it sounds as though you need to brush up on what cycling means. Please don't take this wrong, but it sounds like you've been told some misinformation, or I am missing some pieces. Adding danios to a tank will generate a fish cycle. A tank of water, with no fish or source of ammonia is not cycling. At most, it is aging. But without a food source, no bacteria colonies will develop. I highly recommend checking out some facts on: http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/

[fishlips]

Could you get some seeded substrate from someone? Just to give it a boost? Where in MA are you? I would not change anymore water. If your fish die just buy more or try fishless cylcing. It will cycle, just give it time and don't mess with it.

[OrionGirl]

If you intend to continue cycling with fish, you must continue to do water changes. While I understand that danios are cheap, the ammonia levels will rise enough that they inhibit the development of bacteria colonies.

[superstein61]

Originally posted by OrionGirl
[B]Ammolock prevents your tank from cycling--it takes the ammonia out before the bacteria colony can develop to consume it.

Actually, the producer of Ammolock claims the Ammonia is still available to the bacteria colony, just in a form not toxic to the fish . This is the same thing Amquel does. So using AmmoLock should not inhibit development of your biofilter

[OrionGirl]

Really? I was not aware of that claim. I have heard from a few people who indicated that their tank spiked following the removal of ammolock, so guess I would still advise caution on it's use in a cycling tank.

[mrbranden]

Just to clarify- I've rarely used AmmoLock. I have used it maybe twice in as many months, just to see if it would do any good.

I do not know what level of chloramines I have in my water.

Fishlips: I'm in N. Billerica, near Lowell.

I've never had this much trouble getting a tank going. I am probably within one week of giving up on it all together. Waiting three months for the thing to cycle is just ridiculous.

[Slappy*McFish]

just leave it alone for awhile, continue to do your weekly 50% water changes(nothing else), and don't worry about it. The tank will cycle.

[mrbranden]

Yeah but how long is "a while"? I'm going on three months here...

[Slappy*McFish]

Indefinetly...it will be better on your constitution and peace of mind. Just let it do it's thing. just do a weekly 50% water change along with a weekly water test just before you do the water change(not after)..clean your filter as needed(usually once a month is fine) or when your water appears to have some particulates and detritus floating around..that is a pretty good indicator that the filter is overly dirty. Also, if possible, try to store some of your "new" water in jugs a week before you use it to change your water...this will give it some time to age a bit.

[superstein61]

Originally posted by OrionGirl
Really? I was not aware of that claim. I have heard from a few people who indicated that their tank spiked following the removal of ammolock, so guess I would still advise caution on it's use in a cycling tank.

Yes, that is what they claim - I even emailed them about it. I recall reading about some folks who used it without a problem - but I don't have first hand experience using it during a fishless cycle. - So I would agree, caution when using any of these type of products is a good idea

[wetmanNY]

www.town.billerica.ma.us/cities/billericama/ docs/UploadedPages/Water_Home.htm
This is the web page of Billerica MA Dept of Public Works.

They say that Billerica switched to chloramines in 1999. You should test your tapwater for total ammonia. You'll find it's positive.

HTH!

[mrbranden]

Thanks again everyone for your help. The levels are *finally* down!

[izopnd]

I guess I'm having the same issue with ammonia. I bought a 55 gallon aquarium, tested it for a week and when levels cool, I went to the fish store......... They told me that I still needed to "cycle" the tank with 12 goldfish for three weeks. I was supposed to feed them every other day for the first week, then everyday for two weeks. During this time, I was not supposed to do anything with the water. All went well the first week. The second week, a hazy cloud developed that would not go away. I took a sample to the fish store and they told me to take the goldfish out and start all over again. The goldfish were removed, I did a 50 percent water change along with some good vacuuming and the water is clear as glass......all seemed fine until the water test 4 days later. All of the tests we great except for the ammonia. It was so far off the chart, it looks black. I'm truly perplexed by this. I see that someone has a link which may help....I'll check that out in just a few minutes......but in the mean time, I'm pulling hair out. I'll post back if/when things improve. One other thing.....I read that you're not supposed to use chemicals to lower ammonia, that it should subside naturally......if everything is working right...color me confuzzled....

[Roan Art]

izopond,

Your LFS has given you a whole wack full of misinformation.

When you get back, please start your own thread about your problem. This thread is 3 years old and many won't bother reading it.

Roan

[carpguy]

Izopnd, welcome to AQC…

Two little details up front. Try paragraph spacing to break up individual ideas (it makes posts easier to read). If you have a new question start a new thread (tagging onto the end of someone elses isn't going to get you as much of a response, especially when the original is three years old).

Your LFS sounds a little old school. They aren't giving you the best advice.

Where are the goldfish now and where are they going once the cycle is established? You're doing a very old school 'fishy' cycle: fishless is a better, faster, easier option. If your going to continue with the fishy, we can help you through that. Personally, I'd take the goldfish back and do a fishless.

Levels are information. They're never 'fine', they all mean something. It'd be good to know pH, temp, Ammonia, Nitrites, and Nitrates for instance.

The white cloudiness is a bacterial bloom that isn't unusual in cycling tanks: it typically goes away on its own in a week or two. Amquel and Prime are two good water conditioners that'll help detoxify your ammonia while leaving it bioavailable to the good bacteria. Don't pull your hair out.

Change out enough water that you can make a decent reading on the Ammonia and let us know the pH and temperature (they make a difference).

[Pufferpoison]

Could you get some seeded substrate from someone? Just to give it a boost? Where in MA are you? I would not change anymore water. If your fish die just buy more or try fishless cylcing. It will cycle, just give it time and don't mess with it.

if your fish die, just buy more? where did you get that tidbit? not on here i'm sure of.

Change water and do it daily / twice a day to get those levels down.

I'm really suprised no one else on here had anything to say about this :duh:

[Roan Art]

if your fish die, just buy more? where did you get that tidbit? not on here i'm sure of.

Change water and do it daily / twice a day to get those levels down.

I'm really suprised no one else on here had anything to say about this :duh:
The thread is three years old. The person you quoted hasn't been on here since Dec of 2005. Most likely they posted and since it was a very old thread, ignored them.

That's why I asked him to start his own thread.

Roan