Wrasse Selection and compatibility.

[blackwolfXKAV]

In reference to the proposed 90 gallon in the future, i am currently trying to establish a stocking list that i can work around. For those of you who remember the previously proposed 33 gallon, this will be a carry-over except, of course, with more fish. As this will most likely become a lightly stocked reef tank, i am looking for reef-safe wrasse only. I have been doing some research on this subject and have selected a few wrasse to start choosing from. (also, if more than one species can be safely accommodated, please inform me) So far what i have settled on is the following:
Six line
Yellow
Five bar
Lunare (threat to shrimp?)
Banded possum (school perhaps)
Any advice on which one could be the best? Also it would be included with this list:
2 common clownfish
1 tomato clown (recent addition to setup, any poss. probs?)
1 lemon goby
1 shrimp goby
1 royal gramma
3 blue green chromis
1 yellow tang Personal experience is valued.
There was some mention of these wrasse eating feeder shrimp. Does this apply to pepps and cleaners etc; or only to the mysis types?

I can add or take away any species that is approved here so shoot away.

[Max]

I've had a 6line for quite a while in my 90 . It's never bothered anyone else and it's a really pretty little guy. Fwiw I also have a mandrin in there ," older well established reef tank," and there have never been any issues with it eating all the pods ," tones in my sump and rubble piles".
The possum should also play well with others and a small school is a good idea. I'm not sure about the rest of them never had one.
As to the tang well it might do ok it will need to have a lot of open room to swim. It will also help out with algae control etc. I'd keep in mind though that you don't want to get anything else that looks too much like it and that they produce quite a bit of waste.
Clowns I'm really surprised you tomato hasn't offed your other clowns alread they are one of the more aggresive clown fish and will ime never ever get used to other species of clowns in the tank. I'd guess that they are sexually imature and once they hit purberty the problems will really start to show them selves. I know of people who haven't been able to keep 2 species of clowns in very large tanks 250-500 gallons . There are the occasional exceptions but, I really wouldn't risk it. You might also have issues with the chromis ," much less likely " as they are related to the clowns and well frankly very few s.w. fish get along well with relatives in a small space
Everything else should work out ok or have IME anyway.
hth
chris

[MonoSebaelover]

Totally agree with all maxilaria has said (Hi by the way maxilaria :) ). I once had a tomato Clown pair in a 209g with a Clarkii but that didn't last too long (I moved the Clarkii when the tomato's really started maturing) and they even had opposite corners of a 7 foot long tank. So I would either keep the Tomato in the 33 when the move occurs or give him to someone.
The Lunare is no good for reefs, they produce a lot of waste and will pick on mobile inverts and sometimes sessile, so not a good choice. By Five Bar what wrasse are you referring to? The other two should do fine in a reef set up. As long as the Shrimp is in first most Wrasses will recognize the cleaner as a cleaner and will leave it alone but most other shrimps are fair game (the yellow and six line doe fine with shrimps). Anyway hope this helps and good luck!

[blackwolfXKAV]

keyword=proposed tanks
None of the fish sare in contact with each other as the tank simply put, does not exist yet. although, on that note, i will off the tomato clown and perhaps the tang. Dont want to limit myself, as i am going for diversity rather than large fish.

banded possum wrasse
neon blue goby
neon gold goby
catalina goby
red head goby
ocellaris clowns (basically, i'm not putting two pairs in; i just decided which
species as opposed to just calling it 'common')
Firefish (Nemateleotris magnifica)
Firefish, Purple (Nemateleotris decora)

sound good for a 90 gal? plus if that works within reason, i'd like to readjust for schools if possible.

[Max]

Didn't think that it was running yet but, you asked what we thought. Are you going to have any inverts etc in there ? The only other fish on your list that I would comment on would be the catalina they like pretty cold water so they wouldn't last long in the tank your dreaming about.

[blackwolfXKAV]

alright, so scratch the catalina....
as for inverts, i'm waiting for a list from zanzimog...
it has a good variety of snails, shrimp, hermits, and other small crabs. i might consider a non carniverous starfish (if one exists). I'd like to have some larger colonies of shrimp for hygenic and dietary puposes, and i intend to artificially increase my general 'pod' population prior to the introduction of the fish.

Currently, i'm looking at all of these from an lfs and/or dr.fosters&smith and still trying to make sure they are not cyanide caught, (btw thanks so much Maxilaria for the articles!) and i'm looking at the following live rock:

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=875 =30lbs

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=1669 =40lbs

http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/prod_Display.cfm?pCatId=397 =22lbs

[fish addict]

I have a Yellow Wrasse and a Cryptic Sixline Wrasse (hard to find an image online). Both are very peaceful and a little timid. They have shared a tank with a Camel Shrimp for over a year now with no problems. I am interested in the Possum Wrasse myself, and might add one to my current tank. Yellow and Sixline (doesn't have to be the Cryptic) are both good choices IMO.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e365/valentinitoby/cryptic.jpg

[dorkfish]

BTW, I recently read on reef central that two or more firefish (even of different species) is likely to result in all but one ending up dead.

Tonga Deepwater (Show) Live Rock - 30 lb. Box $ 129.99

Caribbean Live Rock - 40 lb Box $ 99.99*

SW - DFS Select Fiji Premium Rock - 22 lb. Box $ 79.99

Your planning on spending $310 on rock? I for one, would avoid that at all costs, cut the amount of live rock in half atleast (ok, I'm cheap, don't spend any money you don't have to while avoiding spending that much money on rock) - make your own rock! http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=807988

(watch, I'll be spending a few hundred on live rock in a year or two - money still means just slightly more than the hobby at the moment, enough to make me say the above)

However, if your spending that much money to get the diversity of the different types of rock, and your not planning on ordering from anywhere but liveaquaria, you've obcviously got no choice but to spend that much money.

[Max]

I'd get all three types and more if possible BUT, I'd use fill for most of the interior spaces of the pile . Use coral rubble or limestone with no pesticides etc. ," use coral rubble if you can find it more water spaces,"hollows in the rock," make for a much better quality live rock,"I'll explain why if you want me to." The coral rubble will become live rock over a period of time. Also don't buy live sand any sand you put in the tank will become live sand! If you're worried about the little critters living in the live sand just get a cup from a buddy or order specific cultures off line,"that's probably safest ime."
In short just a few chunks of rock from different areas can add an incredible amount of diversity to your tank and you won't have to spend a bunch of money on rocks. That way you'll be able to spend more on fish corals etc you'd be amazed how easy it is to drop a couple hundred on like 2 or 3 fish.

[blackwolfXKAV]

well, i'll drop both the fire fish. The thing is, i would really like to encorporate rubble as a major part in the design, but i cant seem to find any. The thing with liveaquaria is that i honestly could not think of any other SW consistant stocked (ie, not auction sites) that would carry it. Any ideas on good sites and or what fish to add if possible? Also, the thought struckme that all these small species might be difficult to feed in a multispecies tank. is this a rational concern? Also, what is (iyo) the best sump-to-tank ratio?
Thanks.

[blackwolfXKAV]

Astraea snails (18)
Cerith Snails (36)
Nassarius snails, sm (36)
Scarlet hermits (12)
Blue-leg hermits (12)
Peppermint shrimp (5)
Cleaner shrimp (3)

These numbers have not been adjusted, so any advice would be appreciated
Porcelain crabs (2-4)
Emerald crabs (1)
Serpent stars (1)

Anyone who has had experience with these last three species, your input is appreciated.

Also any thoughts on an urchin?

[blackwolfXKAV]

come on, surely some of you have favorites... :look:

[blackwolfXKAV]

anyone out there? :look:

[FreddytheFish]

For the rubble: www.premiumaquatics.com

You don't have to buy "boxes", you can specify any amount of Live Rock you want. And they have rubble. Dirt cheap too.

[blackwolfXKAV]

that would be this, correct? http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=L-ROCKRUBBLE&Category_Code=Liverock

Also, any other suggestions for the inverts list?

[FreddytheFish]

that would be this, correct? http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=L-ROCKRUBBLE&Category_Code=Liverock



Yep.

[blackwolfXKAV]

so this seems correct?

2 ocellaris clownfish
1 lemon goby
1 shrimp goby
1 royal gramma
3 blue green chromis
1 yellow tang
3 banded possum wrasse
1 neon blue goby
1 neon gold goby
1 red head goby

Inverts:
Astraea snails (18)
Cerith Snails (36)
Nassarius snails, sm (36)
Scarlet hermits (12)
Blue-leg hermits (12)
Peppermint shrimp (5)
Cleaner shrimp (3)

[FreddytheFish]

Sounds good. The only thing I'm not sure about is the wrasses, I've never really researched them.

[Max]

To add to the invert list . I'd get some brittle stars, and maybe a tiger tail sea cucumber they are great sand sifters and don't produce a lot of metabolic waste. You can also go to a lfs and buy rubble from them and save the shipping costs. Not to mention the fact that you'll probably get vermatids and other little sand dwelling critters that'll help keep your tank sparklin clean.