Hi pH and 0 KH

[rdelbalso]

I just moved my tank to my new house yesterday and after setting it up I tested the water. The pH was 8.0 and the KH and GH both were 0. How do I lower my pH and increase my KH and GH? Can I put my plants in this water as is? Can I put my angelfish and pictus cat and rainbow shark in it? Everything is coming from water at pH=7.3 and gH and KH=3.5. I need to move my fish tomorrow.

[Richer]

Your readings are quite strange, are you sure your testers are accurate?

-Richer

[OrionGirl]

I agree---I'd take a sample down to be tested at the LFS.

[cpr4cpu]

what about a pH of 7, a gh of 0 and a kh of 17?
My new water softener was installed yesterday and the RO system was dead beyond repair.
Am I okay without the use of a bunch of buffers to control pH? and if so, will my pH be subject to swings with the use of CO2 for the plants?

I have a heavily planted tank with lots of CO2 and I am confused about what my next water change will do to the chemistry of the tank. I would be plenty upset if my barbs and loaches had problems with this new water...

[ChilDawg]

Those pHs will crash without adequate buffering. Also, I'd wait for 24 hours after running the tap to see what the real pH of the water is...but taking the water to the LFS is a good idea!

[djlen]

Seems strange that his tests were pretty normal at the old house and off the wall at the new one. Test kits don't go bad that fast. I'd still get it checked at your LFS however.
You must be quite a distance from the old house to have such different water parameters. If you're not, I suggest you import some water from the old house as a stop-gap measure until you can make some adjustments in the new water. If you can get enough of the "old" water to fill the tank, you can atleast acclimate the fish to the new water gradually. Those big Coleman camping coolers make great water carriers.
Len

[wetmanNY]

The water utilities are softening the water with the lime/soda method., using calcium oxide. The high pH is an artifact of depleted carbon dioxide. Run an airhose in your water-curing barrel for 24 hours and things should right themselves. There's more about this at www.skepticalaquarist.com in the Water folder.

Now you have very soft water that needs just enough buffer to stabilize the pH-- but not more, unless you're keeping special fish, like Rift Lake mbuna, or Central American cichlids or livebearers.

You could even run very low-tech planted tanks with this water.

[wetmanNY]

Originally posted by cpr4cpu
what about a pH of 7, a gh of 0 and a kh of 17?

The test results are saying you have extremely soft water, with virtually no carbonates (0KH), but enough phosphate to register as, what? can't be 17 degrees, must be 17 parts per million.

Have you been adding a phosphate-based pH buffer?

My new water softener was installed yesterday and the RO system was dead beyond repair.

I hope you're using potassium chloride brine, for your fish, for your plants, for your garden, for your aquifer. You can change from sodium chloride at any time, I understand. But check with your Culligan Person (I'm that politically correct eh).

Am I okay without the use of a bunch of buffers to control pH? and if so, will my pH be subject to swings with the use of CO2 for the plants?

You could consider getting off the CO2 now that your water is so soft that all the carbon is CO2 and carbonic acid, rather than carbonates. Or you could add carbonates to enable your CO2 habit heh heh heh The CO2 Anonymous meetings are every Thursday, upstairs from the Methadone Clinic...

I have a heavily planted tank with lots of CO2 and I am confused about what my next water change will do to the chemistry of the tank. I would be plenty upset if my barbs and loaches had problems with this new water...

You do need to add some carbonate buffer if you stay with the CO2.

[cpr4cpu]

thank you wetman, but we might not be on the same page.

I think I have plenty of carbonates in the water. According to the drops of reagent, 1 drop is 1 degree, thus 17 drops to get the bright yellow reading for KH. That's 304.3 PPM.

The GH, which I understand to be the permanent hardness, CA and Mg, is a big zero.

The Ph is 7.0

I use potassium and not salt in the softener. Am I correct in understanding that my water will be resistive to pH changes since the KH is so high? And if so, then I still need to add baking soda solution to bring the GH up to 3?

[wetmanNY]

Drops? A KH of 17 drops. Alkalinity is ordinarily measured either in degrees of carbonate hardness (dKH) or in parts per million (ppm or mg/l.).

Your point is well made. We are defibitely not on the same page.

If you are measuring your alkalinity in drops ,and if your general hardness test result is zero, perhaps your testing technique is flawed.

[cpr4cpu]

okay, let me slow down.
I use an aquarium pharmaceuticals general freshwater test kit.
My test results compare exactly with the LFS so I am sure my reagents are fine.

The GH and KH tests require that you put a drop of reagent into the test tube and make sure it is mixed up. From that point on, each drop added equals 1 degree or 17.9 ppm. The target on the KH scale is to go from Blue to Yellow in the test tube.

My issue is that it takes 17 drops; which is 17 degrees, or 304.3 ppm of carbonate hardness. Is alkalinity really a measure of carbonate hardness or is alkalinity is a measure of pH?.

My GH is 0. My pH is 7.0.

My question is this: Is all the carbonate hardness of the water merely a buffer that will prevent change to pH through CO2 usage, or will the CO2 lower the pH below 7.0? What does the CO2 bond to, the Calcium or the Carbonate? Do I lose permanent hardness in the form of calcium and magnesium, or do I lose temporary hardness in the form of carbonate through the use of CO2?

Thanks for the help Wetman, I'm trying to step up to your level so we can see eye to eye :-)
Now maybe we

[rdelbalso]

I retested my water at the new place this morning. The tank shows a dropped pH=7.0 and a GH=1.5 degrees and a KH=1 degree. My test kits aren't bad. I then retested and got the same thing. I thought I must have been going crazy last night so I tested the tap water. I wasn't crazy, it comes from the tap around pH=8.0. So what do I do to prevent problems? Do I have to let my water sit for a day before adding to the tank? This makes water changes a real problem since I don't have anywhere to store extra water overnight. Also if I am storing water in the buckets I have, then I won't have a bucket to drain the tank water in before I add the new water! What do I need to do?

[avoxo]

Hi rdelbalso, I went through (for over 10 years) the same thing. Not sure how big you tank or tanks are but I have a 55, 20 and a 10 gallon up right now. All I did was buy a 22 gallon tote (paid less than $5 for it), fill it with water add a air stone from one of my tanks and overnight the ph is in the safe range to add to the tanks.

Not sure what the temperature is from the water coming out of your tap but mine is in the mid 50's and I need to let it sit out anyways.

[OrionGirl]

pH is often high straight from the tap, since there are a lot of dissolved gasses in there. Allowing it to sit overnight or agitating it will usually result in a much lower reading---the true pH of your water.

Alk is not pH, though the two are linked.

This is confusing--we have two similar threads going on here, from two different members.

[cpr4cpu]

well, just to humor myself, I bought some quick dip strips for Kh and gH.
I am no longer concerned. My buffering capacity is great, 304.3ppm of alkaline hardness, and the gH of the water is 10ppm.

After sitting for three days, my pH has not moved at all. I borrowed one of the office's pH meters for the a week and now I can measure to the mark much easier. I am staying at 7.2 exactly, with agitation, aeration, and even CO2 injection.

I retested all my parameters this morning and I am confident that with a minor adjustment to the water controls, I can have tetra safe water after a few recharge cycles.

Thanks everyone for the information, my fish appreciate it.