dwarf frog outrage + help please

[rinmouse]

Hello all,

I haven't posted in sometime. I was recently at the mall here in Thunder Bay Ontario, and I saw a sickening display in the Green Earth store. They had up to three african dwarf frogs in tiny containers with maybe two cups of water in them. I asked to speak to a manager and she was decidedly unhelpful - saying that they were an entire ecosystem, you only have to clean the water every three months, and that that was all the space they needed. I asked her if she knew anything about nitrogen cycling - she didn't. She insisted that the gravel was 'living gravel' I explained to her what she meant when she said that, as she was clearly clueless. I explained that they do indeed need more space and better can than can be provided in the living conditions that they are currently getting. She told me she read about them and it was fine. I told her she had clearly not read anything about them, as any source will tell you they need a minimum of 1 gallon per frog. She was rather rude even though I tried very hard to be polite.

I'm wondering if I could have some help here. I'm emailing the company and complaining about the rudeness of the manager (she wouldn't even give me her name) and about the problems with what they are selling. They do not sell this product in their online shop. I was just hoping there might be some support from this community.

grnearth@greenearthstores.com

Thanks,
Corinne

 

[rinmouse]

I sent this in response.

Hello,

My name is Corinne MacLeod and I am writing you as a concerned citizen. I visited your Thunder Bay location in the Intercity mall on Wednesday, July 6. I was surprised to see African Dwarf frogs for sale in containers that hold about 500ml or 2 cups of water, along with a sign that suggested they were enclosed in a self sustaining ecosystem. I asked to speak to a manager. I was hoping that she would be more informed than the sign and simply asked if she could tell me about the frogs. She told me that they are social and that is why there are up to 3 of them per container and that they come with enough food for one month. She added that the water only has to be changed "every three months, because of the live rock". I asked her what she meant by live rock. She responded with "it's alive". I asked her again what she meant, and she said the same thing. I asked her if she knew anything about nitrogen cycling in aquatic systems. She said "no".

I then explained why the amount of space the frogs had and the frequency of cleaning advice is inadequate and inhumane. I maintained a polite tone throughout as I was seeking to inform rather then simply be critical. I asked her if she had read anything about the care for these frogs other than what the company they were bought from provided. She insisted she had. I told her that I found this difficult to believe, as a simple google search for African Dwarf frogs will bring up pages of information, many from very reputable sources and none of them recommend anything less than *one gallon per frog* and many recommend significantly more than that, not 2 cups for 3 frogs. She told me that I was wrong and was not interested in any other information because I am wrong and did not give me her name.

This *manager* is clearly uninterested in the welfare of these living creatures. I find it hypocritical and despicable that a company that makes 'eco-friendliness' their mandate is selling these animals in an inadequate environment, and then dispensing incorrect information that will lead to their early death. I am hoping that this is the only location that Green Earth is selling this extremely unethical product, and I am hoping that they will soon not be sold here either. In addition to being uniformed, the manager was rude and unprofessional. As I was leaving the store, the young man who was also working yelled at me sarcastically "thanks for shopping with us" and they both laughed.

Sincerely,
Corinne MacLeod
(phone number)

 

[Khemul]

Sounds like the Wild Creations kits (or maybe the Frog-O-Sphere, not sure if they are the same thing or just same idea). Unfortunately that manager was actually reciting the marketing information that comes with those kits. There have been multiple protests and campaigns to stop it, but doesn't seem to have stopped the sale of the kits.

 

[shaynablizard]

I applaud you for doing what you could in giving additional information, but unfortunately you probably will not change anything. It never hurts to try though, especially if they get enough letters and these "products" do not sell. In the end, they won't be accomplishing much. Customers who do buy them for their kids or whatever, not realizing how inappropriate it is to sustain the frogs, won't be very happy customers when their children are crying about dead frogs. Selling something that's destined to fail just to make a quick buck doesn't build a trustworthy, ethical, or profitable business. All we can do is hope this will be realized eventually.

 

[toasty]

I imagine those kits smell something awful if they tell their customers to change the water every 3 months... unless they come with magical poopless frogs :headshake2:

 

[mel_20_20]

I did the same thing in a Brookstone store at the shopping mall near where I live in the Dallas/Fort Worth area. It went in one ear and out the other; I was very disheartened by the whole thing. The next time I went in that store, a few months later, they were no longer selling them, though I know they are still being sold in other places. Sad.

 

[Fractalis]

I applaud you for doing what you could in giving additional information, but unfortunately you probably will not change anything. It never hurts to try though, especially if they get enough letters and these "products" do not sell. In the end, they won't be accomplishing much. Customers who do buy them for their kids or whatever, not realizing how inappropriate it is to sustain the frogs, won't be very happy customers when their children are crying about dead frogs. Selling something that's destined to fail just to make a quick buck doesn't build a trustworthy, ethical, or profitable business. All we can do is hope this will be realized eventually.

AGREED!

this is the example of how free enterprize works the good and the bad

 

[rinmouse]

Perhaps it will make no difference, but one has to try. If you just don't say anything then nothing changes for sure.

 

[saram521]

Curious if you received a response from the company after contacting them.

 

[Somervell]

You certainly wrote a thoughtfully-written and eloquent letter. I do think it is highly ironic that a store with the name it has is selling frog-o-spheres. Hopefully your letter will be noticed by someone higher up. As for naysayers-- try not to listen. If everyone thinks that his or her voice means nothing, no wrongs in the world will be addressed by anyone-- as you suggested in your follow up post. In short-- good work!!