Fertilizer Recommendations & Info - the Informal FAQ

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Mindcrime121

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Nov 2, 2008
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Willows, California
Awesome post Tom. That simplified a LOT of this thread right there. Being that 'm running a non CO2 20 gallon tank, my biggest thing is watching the nitrates and making sure they stay low enough to avoid an algae bloom and high enough to feed the plants as I understand things so far. My PH is a simple matter of knowing what plants I have and looking up the conditions they thrive best in and not having plants that require high PH along with those requiring low PH in the same tank. From what I've seen most have a fairly wide range to play in though. Now that I'm using filtered water I no longer have the issue of adding unknown amounts of trace elements and jacking up my phosphorus levels with the liquid rock that comes out of my tap here, again which to my understanding would simply cause an algae bloom in my tank. As long as things remain good and the plants show visible growth and no issues, I'm simply going to dose a little Flourish once or twice a week to feel like I'm doing something, lol! If I get too much in there that way, my water changes will resolve it anyhow. Sound about right? Or am I completely missing something here?
 

Mindcrime121

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Nov 2, 2008
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I've read a few posts from people who used their stuff and liked it. Thought about getting their substrate and pellets myself a while back but decided to avoid ordering online and just bought a bag of Seachem Flourite at the LFS and a bottle of flourish. If you get it you should make a post to detail how things go from the time you set up and update it so we can have a running testimony, good or bad. :)
 

barbarossa4122

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Nov 21, 2009
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40-60 Gallons
1/2 tsp KNO3 3x a week
1/8 tsp KH2PO4 3x a week
1/8 tsp K2SO4 3x a week
1/8 tsp (10 ml) traces 3x a week
Hi,

Can you please tell me if these instructions are for dosing the powder directly into the tank. Thank you.
 

barbarossa4122

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Nov 21, 2009
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If you thought about making your own fertilizers at a cheaper cost, here is what you need to replace the Flourish products.

aquariumfertilizer.com is a place to buy dry fertilizers at a low cost.
Total cost for me was $42.00 shipped for everything I needed to replace all products of Flourish. Not sure how much it makes, but I know it's cheaper then buying bottles already made by Seachem.

I sent them a email asking about what I needed and this is what they sent me.

Flourish = our PMDD PMDD = 1 part each of KNO3, KSO4, MgSO4, and CSM+B
Flourish Iron = our Iron Chelate
Flourish Potassium = our Potassium Sulfate (KSO4)
Flourish Nitrate = our Potassium Nitrate (KNO3)
Flourish Phosphorus = our Mono Potassium Phosphate (MKP)
Flourish Tabs = They are not yet on our website, but we our now selling our own AquariumFertilizer.com substrate fertilizer Tabs.
Flourish Trace = our Plantex CSM+B
--Plantex CSM Guaranteed Analysis:
--1.50%Total Magnesium (Mg)
--0.10% Copper (cu)(chelated)
--7.00% Iron (Fe)(chelated)
--2.00% Manganese (Mn)(chelated)
--0.06% Molybdenum (Mo)
--0.40% Zinc (Zn)(chelated)
--~1.18% Boron added to mix
--All chelated nutrients are
--chelated using EDTA.
--EDTA content (minimum) 55%

Cheapest I found Flourish fertilizer products are $5.00 per bottle plus shipping cost of $10.00
Local pet stores sell them at $10.00 to $14.00 per bottle plus tax.
Buying the Seachem Flourish line is $ 64.00 and will last around 3 to 4 months by my calculations.
 

plantbrain

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Apr 27, 2001
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www.BarrReport.com
Awesome post Tom. That simplified a LOT of this thread right there. Being that 'm running a non CO2 20 gallon tank, my biggest thing is watching the nitrates and making sure they stay low enough to avoid an algae bloom and high enough to feed the plants as I understand things so far. My PH is a simple matter of knowing what plants I have and looking up the conditions they thrive best in and not having plants that require high PH along with those requiring low PH in the same tank. From what I've seen most have a fairly wide range to play in though. Now that I'm using filtered water I no longer have the issue of adding unknown amounts of trace elements and jacking up my phosphorus levels with the liquid rock that comes out of my tap here, again which to my understanding would simply cause an algae bloom in my tank. As long as things remain good and the plants show visible growth and no issues, I'm simply going to dose a little Flourish once or twice a week to feel like I'm doing something, lol! If I get too much in there that way, my water changes will resolve it anyhow. Sound about right? Or am I completely missing something here?
This tank runs NO3 limited pretty fast, I need to dose about 20ppm a week in addition to feeding it heavily.


Non cO2, but the plants have access to the air above.
If you run the non CO2 method correctly, it should have higher PO4 and Fe etc, and low/limiting NO3.
Most soil based tanks end up there after a few months, year or so.
Non CO2 is a much more modified dosing (reduced) goal for most.

I feed such tanks very well and then top off with ferts as needed, mostly by eyeballing the plant growth/health etc.
Every once in a awhile, I'll measure the NO3. Rare I get over 2ppm even if I dose 10ppm 2-3x a week. Plants suck it up.
Other CO2 enriched tanks I dose more, and keep the NO3 at 20+ppm.
Fat cardinals, fat breed like roaches RCS etc.
 

AqEnthusiast

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Dec 19, 2011
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I've suggested many methods and dosings over a long time to folks.
Most new folks really end up more confused at the end of large threads.
So what is it that they, like most of us when we where "new", want?
Something simple, easy, no chemistry lessons or test kits involved.
What else do they want? A nice looking planted tank. Most have some idea about keeping fish tanks.
You do this and avoid most of the dosing stuff by doing a non CO2 planted aquarium. There's soem trade offs there and caveats. But that's another thread.

1. They can do things like water changes pretty easy, no hard concepts there.
2. They can use things like teaspoons/mls volume measures
3. They can buy the cheap ferts rather than buy the vendor brands at 1000X more $
4. They can "garden" some(prune, preen leaves, trim etc).

Most can do this pretty easily. No background in chemistry is needed. No testing NO3/PO4/Fe, calibrating test kits, and spending lots of $ on name brand stuff.
Folks did not get into this hobby to do this. I do not care what anyone wants to say about advice, not one person I've met in well over 30 years has ever gotten in to this hobby to test water and learn chemistry. They get into it because they like the look of plants, like them when they see them grow, want a more natural look than plastic plants etc, mop up nutrients etc.

Taking a big step back and looking at the social issues why and what folks want, what their goals are is critical. From there, now you can see what is likely the best method to advise to a new person vs someone who might be obsessed about every detail vs someone who is less likely to care for things/lacks the time etc.

Dosing is actually a relative small part of the planted tank but still important, light and CO2 are the big issues.

For management, less light, moderate light is best. Generally 2 w/gal, not more. Less light= less CO2 demand. This makes adding CO2 much easier and less light also = slower, easier to manage growth rates.

Slower growth(Slower algae growth as well)= less nutrient dosing require, more wiggle room. Poor CO2 causes most of the issues folks tend to have.
So less light helps that crowd as well as those who mess up their dosing or are just not that attentive.

Dosing itself is really easy. Most new folks tend to be scared about it and particularly with dry fertilizers. They are taking a leaf of faith here. Just keep that in mind when helping them.

They are not sure what KNO3 is, or KH2PO4 and all this weird Chem lingo looking stuff. That's okay, they generally are okay with things like baking soda, they rarely call it "sodium bicarbonate" NaHCO3 :evil_lol:
They can add 1/4 teaspoon of baking soda no problem to a cookie recipe without getting too unsure. They should be able to do the same saltpeter or KNO3 by adding 1/4 teaspoon in the same manner.

If they make a mistake, they can do a large water change and re set the tank. That's simple.

So the dosing part only involves perhaps 3-4 things at most, folks might add every 2-3 days or they can do it daily if their habits are best suited, much like feeding the fish daily, they can feed the plant daily.

After doing this for a week or two, it becomes very simple and "old hat".
I add 2 teaspoons of KNO3, 1 teaspoon of KH2PO4, 50 mls of Tropica master grow every 2-3 days. I add 1 table spoon of GH booster after each water change(60% weekly etc).

I do not need to do anything else other than watch CO2, clean filters, prune etc.

Here's yet another view of EI dosing from another perspective which you might understand a bit better:
http://www.ukaps.org/EI.htm

Many of these folks are relatively new to all this as well.
But they have come a long way in a very short time frame.

For those not wanting to do much dosing, few water changes, then a non CO2 planted tank method/s are much better suited to your goals.
This does not mean you will grow a nice looking ADA style scape by simply not adding CO2 and no nutrients, far from it. It still takes patience, a lot more than many think, but the end result might be something you are happy with. As the light is also low, no CO2, the plant growth is slow.

This means the plants demand for nutrients is also slow.
So fish waste alone often, but not always, can meet the nutrient demands.

So for the CO2 enriched tanks, you will generally need to add ferts regularly(2-3x a week, to daily), maybe 1-3x a month for the non CO2 methods and then only a small amount if at all.
There are trade offs for both methods, but trying both of them is the best way to learn about each.




Regards,
Tom Barr

what a wonderful writeup Tom.. nicely written for what hobbists actually look for and what ppl in general are capable of doing and not..
 
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