Help with sick goldfish!

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Flaringshutter

Befriend a feeder!
Oct 17, 2006
1,870
0
0
Southern California
welcome to ac, munkeycraz! :welcome:
first of all, i'm sorry that you have to deal with all this. you have possibly the worst stock list i have ever heard of. although it would have been great if you had done some research on your fish before buying them, most beginning fishkeepers just trust the pet store employees as you did, so i can't blame you for that. the best thing is that you're asking for advice here, where we have a huge community of advanced aquarists that can help you out. :)

to start out, rule number one is never, ever, ever trust the pet store employees unless they are specialists with lots of experience. a good LFS (local fish store) should have employees who have long lists of previous aquarium experience, specialize in one or two types of fish and have excellent general knowledge of aquariums. it sounds like your LFS has none of those!

secondly, your tank is not cycled, and won't be for up to six weeks. "cycling" a tank is establishing a colony of two types of good bacteria in your filter that will turn the ammonia from rotting fish waste and leftover food into nitrite, then nitrite into nitrate. nitrate is a much less harmful chemical for fish. unfortunately, it can take up to six weeks for this cycle to finish, and during the cycle your levels of ammonia and nitrite can spike unexpectedly, killing fish and wreaking havoc on your aquarium. you will need to monitor the levels of these chemicals with a good test kit, and do frequent large water changes.
Prime is simply a chemical that removes chlorine and chloramine from your water. it does nothing to help establish bacteria.

here is a great thread on cycling that you should at least skim over - though it is long, it would be best if you read it thoroughly for a good understanding of cycling.
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=84598

let's move on to your stocking.
2 goldfish (one a black moor, one you didn't say) - these two goldfish, assuming they are fancy types, will require at least a 30 gallon all to themselves. goldfish do best only with other goldfish. they require a mostly vegetarian/fish protein diet, which tropical fish do not like. fancy goldfish love the cooler end of the tropical temperatures, another reason not to keep them with other species. on top of that, goldfish are very messy and require extra filtration to filter out all their waste.
2 gouramis, 2 angels - these are tropical fish with a tendency to be aggressive and should not ever, ever be housed with goldfish. they will harrass and nip the fins of other fish. like goldfish, they do best in single-species tanks.
1 cave fish, 1 puffer - both of these are oddball fish that have unique requirements and do not do well in community tanks.
1 otto - ottos are small schooling catfish. they have a nervous disposition and must be kept in schools of six or more for best health and activity. they are tropical fish as well.
1 channel cat - as previously stated, these grow to enormous sizes and will eat anything and everything they can fit in their mouths. this is the first fish you should find a new home for.

i know that you may have grown attached to the fish you have right now. it may seem that the problem with the black moor goldfish is something small and once you fix that, your fish will get along just fine.
i want to firmly tell you that everything will not be fine, even if you are able to solve the problem. your fish are incompatible and you will end up with one problem after another. in the future, unless you find new homes for most of those fish, you may have to deal with one or more of these issues:
-the angels will become aggressive and rip to shreds the fins of the other fish in the tank, causing infection and possibly fatalities.
-the channel cat will eat the ottos, the snail, the frogs, the cave fish, the puffer, the gouramis, and the goldfish (probably in that order) if they are small enough.
-the gouramis or the angel will eat the tentacles off the snail, causing it to sicken and hide, preventing it from finding enough food.
-the puffer will eat a hole in the foot of your snail, killing it, or start attacking the frogs.

i don't mean to scare you, but simply to impress on you that it is very important for you to find new homes for most of those fish. your 47 gallon tank would be an excellent home for three or four goldfish, for a group of angels and a school of ottos, for a few puffers.... you would do best to choose the fish you like the best, and find new homes for the rest.

best of luck. if you have any more questions, feel free to ask. we're friendly and we will help you the best we can.
 

munkeycraz

AC Members
Oct 23, 2008
21
0
0
Thanks ALot

welcome to ac, munkeycraz! :welcome:
first of all, i'm sorry that you have to deal with all this. you have possibly the worst stock list i have ever heard of. although it would have been great if you had done some research on your fish before buying them, most beginning fishkeepers just trust the pet store employees as you did, so i can't blame you for that. the best thing is that you're asking for advice here, where we have a huge community of advanced aquarists that can help you out. :)

to start out, rule number one is never, ever, ever trust the pet store employees unless they are specialists with lots of experience. a good LFS (local fish store) should have employees who have long lists of previous aquarium experience, specialize in one or two types of fish and have excellent general knowledge of aquariums. it sounds like your LFS has none of those!

secondly, your tank is not cycled, and won't be for up to six weeks. "cycling" a tank is establishing a colony of two types of good bacteria in your filter that will turn the ammonia from rotting fish waste and leftover food into nitrite, then nitrite into nitrate. nitrate is a much less harmful chemical for fish. unfortunately, it can take up to six weeks for this cycle to finish, and during the cycle your levels of ammonia and nitrite can spike unexpectedly, killing fish and wreaking havoc on your aquarium. you will need to monitor the levels of these chemicals with a good test kit, and do frequent large water changes.
Prime is simply a chemical that removes chlorine and chloramine from your water. it does nothing to help establish bacteria.

here is a great thread on cycling that you should at least skim over - though it is long, it would be best if you read it thoroughly for a good understanding of cycling.
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=84598

let's move on to your stocking.
2 goldfish (one a black moor, one you didn't say) - these two goldfish, assuming they are fancy types, will require at least a 30 gallon all to themselves. goldfish do best only with other goldfish. they require a mostly vegetarian/fish protein diet, which tropical fish do not like. fancy goldfish love the cooler end of the tropical temperatures, another reason not to keep them with other species. on top of that, goldfish are very messy and require extra filtration to filter out all their waste.
2 gouramis, 2 angels - these are tropical fish with a tendency to be aggressive and should not ever, ever be housed with goldfish. they will harrass and nip the fins of other fish. like goldfish, they do best in single-species tanks.
1 cave fish, 1 puffer - both of these are oddball fish that have unique requirements and do not do well in community tanks.
1 otto - ottos are small schooling catfish. they have a nervous disposition and must be kept in schools of six or more for best health and activity. they are tropical fish as well.
1 channel cat - as previously stated, these grow to enormous sizes and will eat anything and everything they can fit in their mouths. this is the first fish you should find a new home for.

i know that you may have grown attached to the fish you have right now. it may seem that the problem with the black moor goldfish is something small and once you fix that, your fish will get along just fine.
i want to firmly tell you that everything will not be fine, even if you are able to solve the problem. your fish are incompatible and you will end up with one problem after another. in the future, unless you find new homes for most of those fish, you may have to deal with one or more of these issues:
-the angels will become aggressive and rip to shreds the fins of the other fish in the tank, causing infection and possibly fatalities.
-the channel cat will eat the ottos, the snail, the frogs, the cave fish, the puffer, the gouramis, and the goldfish (probably in that order) if they are small enough.
-the gouramis or the angel will eat the tentacles off the snail, causing it to sicken and hide, preventing it from finding enough food.
-the puffer will eat a hole in the foot of your snail, killing it, or start attacking the frogs.

i don't mean to scare you, but simply to impress on you that it is very important for you to find new homes for most of those fish. your 47 gallon tank would be an excellent home for three or four goldfish, for a group of angels and a school of ottos, for a few puffers.... you would do best to choose the fish you like the best, and find new homes for the rest.

best of luck. if you have any more questions, feel free to ask. we're friendly and we will help you the best we can.


Ill read up on that link you gave me. I did trust people who i had a gut feeling wasnt sure about anything other than the price of the fish. I reallt make a big mess of things, but i dont want my fish to bear the brunt. I am currently lookin for homes for them, i have a few co-workers who have several tanks. I think I may keep my angles, the snail ,"he is as big as a baseball" my frogs, cave fish. Would that be ok, and find homes for both fancy goldfish,gourmis, and channel cat. So you think even tho my puffer dont mess with my snail yet....he will. I really like him but if he gotta go he gotta go i guess. Maybe i can get a seperate tank for him and gourmis? The people on planetcatfish.com are disputing right now what my catfish is..there are bee boppin back n forth on what it is. Thank You for taking the time to help me out...i really appreciate it..:headbang2:im learning alot on here....:read:
 

Flaringshutter

Befriend a feeder!
Oct 17, 2006
1,870
0
0
Southern California
You would be fine with either angels & cave fish & possibly snails or snails, frogs & gouramis, or snails & goldfish. The angels won't do well with the snails (they nip tentacles) and might be aggressive toward the frogs.
The puffer definitely can't live with the snail - but you might house him in another tank if you want to keep him. Puffers do really well in species-only tanks. :)

It's wonderful to hear that you're trying to find proper homes for all your fish. A real fish lover will always want the best for their fish - rather than trying to keep them all even though they can't provide a good home. You're doing the right thing. Once you have a tank with good stocking, I think you'll enjoy your fish more. You should start seeing some interesting behavior that only shows up when the fish are relaxed and happy.

:thumbsup: Well done! And good luck.
 
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