Marine Discussion: 90g FOWLR (first SW tank) journal

[lbear]

Yes, I plan to add 30 - 50 lbs. of live rock.

--Mike

First of all, this is a great thread! Please keep doing the great jobs. I am happily learning from it.

For those 30 - 50 lbs of LR, what's the percentage of TBS rock? Do you plan to add other live rock such as Fiji LR or something else?

Since your aquarium is FOWLR, is it a little bit overkill to use those premium stuffs?

Those white base rocks look nice. What's the volume of all those rocks? Any plan of aquascaping at this moment?

Albert

 

[macphoto]

Here's an opinion about TBS that may or may not help the decision.

I actually love the stuff, and have been thrilled about the numbers and variety of organisms that come along. Many of the sponges, corals and other inverts that rode along with my first batch almost 3 years ago are still growing and spreading.

The downside is that several types of nasties, such as hairy crabs, mantis shrimp, whelks and eunicid worms, (and I suspect sea spiders, based on some shrinking zoanthids) have also done well in my tanks. The mantises are pretty easy to extract, you just need to find the hidey hole, but the others can be trickier. Stony corals, most soft corals, and the fish don't seem to be affected, but I have finally given up on keeping tridacnid clams (look great one day, half eaten the next), and some species of zoanthid are doing poorly.

I don't mean to diss the product, because I happen to like the weird inverts, and others may have had different experiences.

Thanks... this is very helpful. I keep going back and forth, one day thinking TBS, Fiji the next day. I guess one of the things that has thrown me off a bit was the "Fiji" rock I've seen at some of the LFSs around here ("local" meaning within an hour or two driving range). Maybe I've just caught them on bad days, but much of this stuff simply looks like regular rock that someone placed in a big vat of water. Maybe it's more "live" than it appears, but it sure doesn't look that way.

Would Fiji rock ordered from liveaquaria.com be better than this? With the "damp newspaper" shipping method, how much of the beneficial stuff dies off? TBS's method of almost always keeping the rock underwater seems like a big plus.

You're a brave man. I always assume my wife could be reading my threads at some point.

No worries here (famous last words).

--Mike

 

[macphoto]

For those 30 - 50 lbs of LR, what's the percentage of TBS rock? Do you plan to add other live rock such as Fiji LR or something else?

It'll probably be all-TBS or all-Fiji (though, if I do go TBS, I still might pick up a piece or two of Fiji locally if needed).

Since your aquarium is FOWLR, is it a little bit overkill to use those premium stuffs?

I'm really not sure about this. I actually asked Richard of TBS a similar question, whether or not the growth that arrives on his rock would survive in my tank (with just normal lighting). He said that it would be fine. I want the rock primarily for filtration (and to seed the dry rock), and secondarily for decoration. I'm not sure whether or not the cheapest, non-pretty stuff will suffice, especially considering the relatively low live rock to dry rock ratio.

Those white base rocks look nice. What's the volume of all those rocks? Any plan of aquascaping at this moment?

No real plans yet... I haven't yet had a chance to closely examine both boxes. I think I'll need to just put them in the tank and start stacking them various ways to see what works best (though I'll probably have to wait for the LR to arrive to make firm decisions).

Honestly, I'm having a little anxiety over the aquascaping. In particular, I'm worried about stacking the rocks in a manner that seems solid, but that ends up falling over and cracking the tank. I know a lot of people don't attach the rocks to each other in any way, but I went ahead and bought a stick of that epoxy putty to have on hand if needed, and I also might use the method of drilling holes in the rock and using PVC rods to give some stability to the structure (without being as permanent as epoxying the whole thing together).

I'm also unsure of whether to stack the rocks against the back glass (maximizing the space in front), or placing them more in the middle.

Anyway, with the sheetrock repairs now finished (just need to paint the patched area tomorrow) I'm on track to start filling the tank this weekend. If I go with TBS, I want the whole thing shipped at once (not divided into 2 shipments), so I'll put the dry rock and dry sand in, and cycle with cocktail shrimp before placing the order (so that the included hermits, snails, stars, and shrimp don't have to endure the cycle). If I go with Fiji rock, I'll order it next week and use it to cycle (and add the cleanup crew afterwards).

--Mike

 

[mogurnda]

I like the "island" approach. I do wonder whether all the fish will hover close to the rocks, though.

I was thinking more about the TBS question. Since it will be a FOWLR, the issues with the "nasties" will probably not cause you problems. The species of mantis one normally gets (Neogonodactylus wennerae) will not attack fish, nor will the crabs or whelks. Based on what I have seen, the kids will love all the unidentified ceatures that ride along.

 

[macphoto]

I was thinking more about the TBS question. Since it will be a FOWLR, the issues with the "nasties" will probably not cause you problems. The species of mantis one normally gets (Neogonodactylus wennerae) will not attack fish, nor will the crabs or whelks. Based on what I have seen, the kids will love all the unidentified ceatures that ride along.

Will that particular mantis go after hermits and snails? I do worry a little bit about getting some of those with my order... I've read stories about the difficulties some have endured in trying to eradicate those little guys. But I've also read some that indicated successful and relatively easy ways to capture them (and send them on to happy homes with people who want them). Heck, I might even put one in the refugium (unless that's bad idea). It could be like a dungeon, into which misbehaving hermits can be tossed for punishment (just kidding... well, kind of).

There's one more shop I'd like to look at locally before making a decision, but it's not really near my house (it's actually pretty close to the place where I bought the tank), so I keep hoping for some work-related reason to go into that area (maybe Tuesday).

But still, even if that rock looks good, the allure of all the neat creatures on TBS rock/sand is hard to resist.

--Mike

 

[mogurnda]

N. wennerae will definitely go for hermits and snails. They really are not that hard to get rid of, though.

I'm mixed about having one in a fuge. In my mantis tank, there was a profusion of isopods, small worms, and stars, but larger bugs like amphipods were pretty much eradicated. Mantis are great for getting rid of unwanted whelks and hairy crabs, and it's pretty easy to set up a little tank for one if you decide to have a pet.

There may be some seasonality to getting mantis with TBS. I didn't get any in a 40 lb shipment in April, but got 7 in a 90 lb batch in August. There was also 3 years between the orders.

 

[macphoto]

There may be some seasonality to getting mantis with TBS. I didn't get any in a 40 lb shipment in April, but got 7 in a 90 lb batch in August. There was also 3 years between the orders.

Actually, there may be no TBS rock to be had AT ALL right now, due to the hurricanes and some other weather factors recently. I came across a TBS forum at one of the other sites (reefcentral.com, I think), and it sounded like they have not been able to get out there to harvest rocks in quite some time, and that people have been waiting for their shipments.

One other factor that's been nagging me a bit about TBS... how does the sand look? I've been seeing some photos here and there, and it almost looks like crushed coral, very coarse and rough looking. I'm trying to imagine how it would look mixed with my pretty white sugar-sized sand.

I have to go in to Baton Rouge tomorrow, and might take the long way home and head into the New Orleans area to check out what kind of rock can be found at this one particular LFS that I've never been to. I think I'll bring a rubbermaid container with me just in case.

--Mike

 

[van]

I think your tank is really great but I don't have the patience you have.I took a couple of shortcuts and let the lfs build my filter etc and I am buying salwater mix from them.I think your tank looks great and your wife like all of ours is impatient and will be very impressed in the end.What fish are you going to put in once all is sorted out and tank is cycled?

 

[mogurnda]

SO far so good. You may need to keep tweaking to get rid of the bubbles. I had to use the sponge on the skimmer outlet and make a few modifications on my baffles to finally get the problem under control.

You're right, TBS sand is course. It's full of goodies, but maybe only a little finer than crushed coral. The live sand from www.floridapets.com is fine and white, but not as full of worms and stars.

 

[macphoto]

What fish are you going to put in once all is sorted out and tank is cycled?

At the moment, I plan on the following:

• 1 Yellow Tang
• 2 Ocellaris Clowns
• 1 Royal Gramma
• 1 Dwarf Angel (probably a Coral Beauty)
• 1 Kaudern's Cardinal

I'd also like to possibly add a school of small fish (maybe Black Bar Chromis or Blue/Green Chromis), but I'll probably wait and see how the water parameters do after gradually adding the above fish.

--Mike