What substrate?

[jderuiter]

I'm going to set up a new 50 gal tank with sand for the main substrate. I will be making terraces and plan to cover them in gravel so I can put my giant hygro's and tantra vals in.
Will gravel be enough of a substrate for them or should I use laterite, florite or something else?

 

[plantbrain]

If you are specific in the the type of sand you want, adding laterite+ some groud peat, some mulm/dirt from anothe rtestablished tank to the bottom 1/3 on the layer is a good idea.
If the sand is not something you are attached to, adding 100% flourite is the best option for new folks and you can add the peat and mulm to this as well.
Flourite cost more, but I think it's worht the long term use of the product. Once done, you never need to think about it again.

Regards,
Tom Barr

 

[superjohnny]

what about onyx sand? I saw some in Petco the other day (from seachem) and it looked pretty cool. Maybe a 1 1/2" layer of some kind of dirt with an inch of onyx sand on top? How would that work?

 

[plantbrain]

I use onyx sand myself.

The best way I've found:
Rinse it 3 times, 1/2 a bag at a time in a 5 gallon bucket.
Add about 1/2 inch and add a handful of ground peat(eg Scott's brand etc) per sq ft, and about the same volume of vacuumed mulm from an established tank. Decant off the clear water and save the dirt(mulm/detritus) at the bottom. It's full of bacteria to instantly start up the tank. The peat will also help a good deal.

Then top this with 2-3 inches of sand.

I don't recommend using or mixing it with other gravels. Once that's done, you have a mish mash that cannot be undone and looks kind of tacky. After some time and replanting etc, all layered substrates get mixed together.

The peat and bacteria are for the initial start phase and there's not much added to begin with so that's not ann issue there.

So yes, oxyx is good stuff. It will move the KH around on you for awhile but if you do regular water change, are not trying to bred Apisto's etc, this is not an issue.

Regards,
Tom Barr

 

[jderuiter]

Had to delete this one

 

[jderuiter]

Thanks for the info Tom. I may just forget the gravel and go with your suggestion. I'll be using #25 sandblasting sand which is brown and black.
I'm getting my new tank tommorrow so I'll be ready to plant in a few weeks. I'm going to "dry run" a bunch of ideas to ensure I get it just right.
Thanks again.

 

[Heady]

Plantbrain, are you still here?

I am purchasing 5 bags Onyx sand for my 100 gallon tank. Is this enough for about 2 or 2-1/2" deep substrate? If not, what do you suggest I do? I will add peat as you described previously; should I add some other gravel or sand to make up the difference?

Onyx is just too expensive to use alone in such a large tank.

 

[plantbrain]

I've seen onyx on sale for 9.99 a bag etc such as Big Al's etc.
15lbs a bag makes that a good price even with shipping etc. 12.5 etc more only means 20$ more etc.
I have about 175lbs in a 75 but I like a lot of gravel. 1.5x tank gal for the amount is relatively good. 20 gal would use 30lbs etc. 75gal-120 lbs or so.
The cost is up to you. Take your time, the tank/gravel etc will be there.

Regards,
Tom Barr

 

[Heady]

Tom, thank you very much for your response. I am going to use peat and mulm with my onyx as you suggested above.

Just an update. I got a special deal thru BigAl's and they were going to give me 10 bags of Onyx for $100 something. However they are on the East coast and I'm on the West coast, so they were going to charge more than the cost of Onyx just for shipping charges, bringing the total cost well over $200-250 for 10 bags.

So, I called around and found a lfs who said they would sell me 20 pounds at $0.50 a pound (WOW!), come to find out they quoted an incorrect price over the phone but gave me 2 bags onyx at that price to make the customer happy.
$16 total for 2 bags onyx

Then I went to all my lfs's to ask what kind of price they could give me for volume buying onyx, and found one that would give me $18 a bag. 7 bags at $18 a bag gave me
$137 for 7 bags onyx

For a total of:
$154 for 9 bags onyx

Much better than I was able to find anywhere online. I might have had better luck if I was able to find more online/mail order places based on the West coast.

I had contacted Seachem directly and they said they would NOT sell direct to the public, nor would they ship to a lfs and ask them to give me a certain price, which is what someone on one of these forums said they did. I also contacted Seachem's distributor who would also not do anything for me.

 

[plantbrain]

The LFS is the one that should give you deal.

Not SeaChem. SeaChem sell the product to ALL the LFS at the same price, shipping cost vary.

LFS's can give favors but Companies that supply all the LFS cannot because they'd all want the same deal. Customers can ask, but the LFS can so no also if that's their choice.

If the LFS wants the $$$, then they might want to make a deal with you.
A transaction worth 175$ where they make 25% is still better than nothing.
Plus it doesn't sit around their shop/shelf for a month either. They get the $ and they don't have to dig into their pockets to get it.

Folks complain about cost but heating cables+sand laterite are far more costly and don't work as well. Also it does not ever wear out or break etc.
You can mix it if you want but test a little first with the sand you plan on mixing it with to make certain that the color is something you'll like.

Regards,
Tom Barr