pH not important. TDS is. My QT tank is a full pH point higher than the display because of CO2 injection and peat filtration in the main tank. Since TDS is approximately the same, fish can be moved from QT to display without incident. I really have to conclude that fish barely if at all notice pH, and it's all in the osmotic differences, which pH is only indirectly related to.
Advice - Bad or Good?
- Thread starter colinsk
- Start date
PH is an indicator of TDS, same as nitrate. Since there isnt a test kit for TDS there is no other way to really measure this for the average aquariest. No, fish to not read ph, you have stated a prime example of being able to move fish between tanks in your house with a varying ph with no trouble. For the average aquariest, those that are not experienced, its not advisable to tell them they dont have to acclimate there fish. There are so many variables when adding a fish from a different water source than switching them around in your own home where you know exactly what has been done.
Example, if you purchase a fish from a pet store that keeps salt (NaCl) in there water as routine practice, they you get them home and do not acclimate them, you will end up with osmotic shock and possible death. Another example, if you purchase a fish from a pet store that has a ph of 7.5 and you bring it home and dump it in your tank with a ph of 6, you will again have osmotic shock and most likely eventual death.
There are so many things that make up PH, without being the one to alter it while knowing that its altered without raising the TDS (such as injecting cod), then its not safe to advise everyone "dont acclimate your fish, I dont and they are fine". All circumstances have to be accounted for when giving advice out.
Yes.. and since we dont know what causes it unless it is our own controlled tanks..its best to acclimate.
But pH is not an indicator of TDS. GH is, KH is, salinity is, but pH isn't. There is a tendancy towards a correlation between pH and TDS because KH tends to move with GH and pH moves with KH, but it's very much secondary. The salt example is a case in point; pH 7 water with NaCl salt in it is still pH 7; comparing the pH of the water would lull the aquarist into a false sense of security. By making pH the issue, you could mislead someone in this situation. I agree that high TDS water TENDS to have a higher pH, but it doesn't necessarily follow. GH/KH are much better indicators and should be used in preference to pH, which can readily create both false positives and negatives. Also, it helps to reinforce the underlying theory in the aquarist's mind that it's the level of dissolved solids that matters, not the pH itself. There's too much pH mythology around and I think it is best to avoid any semblance of feeding it.
Nor did I say "don't acclimate your fish". I said that I don't think mixing water for a few minutes achieves that aim. The only thing you can acclimate for in that time frame is temperature, which does not require mixing water to achieve. If the TDS of the tank and LFS water is different enough to cause stress when fish are moved from one to the other mixing for even a couple of hours is not going to make any difference. If you read what I said. you'll see that I said that acclimation is necessary when TDS is significantly different - and that it takes a couple of weeks.
Nor did I say "don't acclimate your fish". I said that I don't think mixing water for a few minutes achieves that aim. The only thing you can acclimate for in that time frame is temperature, which does not require mixing water to achieve. If the TDS of the tank and LFS water is different enough to cause stress when fish are moved from one to the other mixing for even a couple of hours is not going to make any difference. If you read what I said. you'll see that I said that acclimation is necessary when TDS is significantly different - and that it takes a couple of weeks.
I am going to have to disagree with you there. There is no logic in that. If say the pH is caused by something other then what you think it is and you acclimatize them to the pH in your tank which has a different cause I would imagine it would stress the fish the same as not acclimatizing them.
So, what you are saying is, dont try and get the fish used to the new water, dump them in and let them fend for themselves?
The reason I disagree with this is.. to use a comparison think of taking a hot bath or shower. You start out with the water at the temp that is comfortable for you to immediately get in, then you gradually decrease the amt of cold water til you have a hot steamy shower. Wouldnt it be a bit hmm..painful to get in with no cold water on to begin with? Same as getting in the swimming pool when the water is a bit cold, you ease yourself in so your body gets used to it. (at least most ppl do.)
Ill let others chime in here, osmotic shock is real, not acclimating fish can and will cause this, its happened many times over. Its the same as old tank syndrome, when you have that, you dont do a 100 percent water change, you have to do it gradually..
No I am not saying that, infact I do acclimatize my fish... lol I just want to understand this better. For example say we have pH of 8 in both lfs and your own but there are 2 different reasons causeing this. Letting the fish go without acclimitizing them (other then temp) would that not stress the fish cause they would have to adapt to the different Factor causing a pH of 8 in your tank?
You should still acclimitise them because the water is a different source than your own.. Now if it was your regular LFS and you were familiar with there practices and what they did, then the judgement call would be yours..
I was simply making the discussion around PH being the reason to acclimatize fish based on the previous posters using PH as why not to acclimitize fish. There are several reasons why you should acclimitze fish , not only the ph. I posted earlier that what if the lfs had salt in there tank..another example is what if they are treating the tank with meds.. Overall its best to acclimitize fish that are brought in from a different source because you dont know what they have been kept in or the water quality-parameters there in.
I was simply making the discussion around PH being the reason to acclimatize fish based on the previous posters using PH as why not to acclimitize fish. There are several reasons why you should acclimitze fish , not only the ph. I posted earlier that what if the lfs had salt in there tank..another example is what if they are treating the tank with meds.. Overall its best to acclimitize fish that are brought in from a different source because you dont know what they have been kept in or the water quality-parameters there in.
True I think you should slowly acclimatize the fish although I think the pH isn't a very accurate reason or indicator for doing this. Also when I do acclimatize my fish I am always scared that ammonia will build up in the small amount of water in the back causing unwanted deaths to the fish later on.
lol don't you wish we could get masspectrometers!!! Then we would know exactly what was in the water, but alas we are stuck guessing.
lol don't you wish we could get masspectrometers!!! Then we would know exactly what was in the water, but alas we are stuck guessing.
