the infamous 5 gallon diy canister filter. can it be done????

But I must digress, even I was thinking more of a bottom drain design (like that of a water tower) and forgetting that the input would be over the top of the tank, that means only the wieght of the water in the tube (column) would add to the water pressure exerted on the lid.

However, while it does seem like 4 psi is insigificant, its not. And the seals found on most (I can't say all) 5 gallon buckets isn't designed to hold any pressure. Add that to the fact the manner in which you open a five gallon friction seal bucket (you pry up one end, not lift it straight up), and while you might achieve a seal initially, how long will you be able to keep the seal after opening and closing it several times?
 
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Makes no difference whether the plumbing is coming from the top or bottom of the tank, It is the canister height relative to the body of water. If you had two hoses one from the bottom and one siphoning over the top and their ending position under the tank were the same spot, the rate of flow and pressure would be the same.

This is why a diver experiences the same atmospheric pressure whether he is breathing from a tank or umbilical tube air supply. The only exception is atmospheric submarines and suits that are armored using negative pressure and keep the occupants at 1 atmosphere of 14 PSI.

While a running pump in a canister does counter the tanks positive pressure with negative pressure almost all "over-the-counter" canister filters only provide a faction of the negative pressure to counter the tanks positive pressure.

The FX5 is the only over the counter canister filter that generates negative pressure that exceeds the positive pressure of all 31 inch tall tanks and it can be proven by simple removing the inlet hose to the canister while it is running and no water will exit the open intake port of the canister, in fact the canister will pump out into the tanks until it looses prime and then ungulate as it looses and regained prime from the bottom of the empty canister. No other over the counter canister can do this not even the Magnum 350 as water will simply pour out of the canister with the the far weaker pumps unable to out pace the tanks pressure.

This is why the FX5 has to shut down every 24 hours to purge air that has been literally sucked out of the water due to negative pressure in excess of the tanks positive pressure. The reason is the combination of the powerful pump motor and its rotary style impeller providing almost positive displacement, unlike a paddle blade impellers that all the competition uses allowing cavitation and non-positive displacement against water.
 
As for closing the lid and keeping it rigid...
I would use woodworking clamps (the very small ones)....Instead of clamping them directly on the bucket, I would make a wood or steel ring that seats around the bucket. Then have a solid round top (1cm wood)with openings for the hose and other stuff on the top.
Put clamps around, which are easy to remove, the wood top will spread the pressure much better than your current setup and at the same time, the clamps are easy to remove for maintenance/cleaning.

http://imghost.indiamart.com/data/K/H/MY-447979/CLAMP_250x250.jpg

The clamp in the top of this picture is what I mean.

Just for the sake of it...I do not mean to replace the plastic top...just add the wood on top of that for equal spread of force closing it.
Checked back on the first page, and it seems not difficult to add...
 
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Luc said:
As for closing the lid and keeping it rigid...
I would use woodworking clamps (the very small ones)....Instead of clamping them directly on the bucket, I would make a wood or steel ring that seats around the bucket. Then have a solid round top (1cm wood)with openings for the hose and other stuff on the top.
Put clamps around, which are easy to remove, the wood top will spread the pressure much better than your current setup and at the same time, the clamps are easy to remove for maintenance/cleaning.

http://imghost.indiamart.com/data/K/H/MY-447979/CLAMP_250x250.jpg

The clamp in the top of this picture is what I mean.

Just for the sake of it...I do not mean to replace the plastic top...just add the wood on top of that for equal spread of force closing it.
Checked back on the first page, and it seems not difficult to add...
Click to expand...

i have mentioned this in past posts. when ever i have money and time i will redesign the 5 gallon bucket but my point is to prove that it can be done with a regular 5 gallon bucket a regular lid and stuff you can get at lfs and hardware stores.
 
This is kind of cool! Keep going I'm interested to see if it actually works;). I've heard that it can't be done but looks like you might prove them wrong
 
i bought my pump today hooked it up with no substrate and ran it. so far so good. been testing in the bath tub so i cant say its going to work 100% just yet but no leaks no problems pumps and runs like a champ at 7 ft up and 3/4 in tube. all negetive pressure in the bucket but i suspect that will change when i put the substrate(resistance) in the bucket. wont be for about 2-3 days till i have it ready to do a thorough test for at least 24 hrs. i am working on my egg crate for substrate levels and waiting for silicone to dry tonight. im so excited that its working and all i have to do is the detail work now. any questions i will be glad to answer.
 
nc0gnet0 said:
This is correct, that is what I refered to as "column"



Thats not entirely correct. Your assuming that all of the side walls are "exactly" the same. Differences in material thickness will occur and thus you will have your compromise. Plus, you still have two forces that are in some way opposing each other, albeit at right angles. If you don't beleive it distorts the bucket try this, measure the diameter of a empty bucket at the top rim. Then fill it with water and measure it again, you will find that the bucket does indeed flex. Even a millimeter is significant when your dealing with a water tight seal.
Click to expand...

A circle/cylinder will equalize. There is no difference in pressure at any opposing point. That's fluid dynamics.
 
CWO4GUNNER said:
Makes no difference whether the plumbing is coming from the top or bottom of the tank, It is the canister height relative to the body of water. If you had two hoses one from the bottom and one siphoning over the top and their ending position under the tank were the same spot, the rate of flow and pressure would be the same.

This is why a diver experiences the same atmospheric pressure whether he is breathing from a tank or umbilical tube air supply. The only exception is atmospheric submarines and suits that are armored using negative pressure and keep the occupants at 1 atmosphere of 14 PSI.

While a running pump in a canister does counter the tanks positive pressure with negative pressure almost all "over-the-counter" canister filters only provide a faction of the negative pressure to counter the tanks positive pressure.

The FX5 is the only over the counter canister filter that generates negative pressure that exceeds the positive pressure of all 31 inch tall tanks and it can be proven by simple removing the inlet hose to the canister while it is running and no water will exit the open intake port of the canister, in fact the canister will pump out into the tanks until it looses prime and then ungulate as it looses and regained prime from the bottom of the empty canister. No other over the counter canister can do this not even the Magnum 350 as water will simply pour out of the canister with the the far weaker pumps unable to out pace the tanks pressure.

This is why the FX5 has to shut down every 24 hours to purge air that has been literally sucked out of the water due to negative pressure in excess of the tanks positive pressure. The reason is the combination of the powerful pump motor and its rotary style impeller providing almost positive displacement, unlike a paddle blade impellers that all the competition uses allowing cavitation and non-positive displacement against water.
Click to expand...
One thing I diden't make clear here is that I meant that the siphoning HOB hose would also be at the same depth or close depth as the drain hose and also end at the same position under the tank. Technically just like a diver in the ocean the siphon in the aquarium if placed at only 1 inch of depth would experiences less pressure then the bottom drain drain hose. However in an aquarium the difference between a normal canister siphon depth of 1/2 to 3/4 of the depth inside the tank compared to a bottom drilled drain would almost be indistinguishable. The canister if not strong enough would still bulge if placed under the tank.

Again almost any attempt at a DIY canister will work if equalize sitting next to the tank, underneath is a whole different ball of wax and integrity is crucial if you don't want to find an empty tank and flooded floor unexpectedly.
 
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