Mafia 78- The Gunslinger Returns...The Play

I have to run to go to work but to answer your questions.

Dag, I always have a hard time reading him and with his limited posting this game it has made it harder. I have him as a suspect because it works out with my thoughts on others. I'd have to go back and pull his posts for more concrete evidence if there is any.

As for lists I think they pretty much got forced into having to list 2 players if FF or Rich are scum. They needed to stay blended and to differ in opinion would out them. If you had chose say Rich instead of Kash and he was scum and they didn't list him they'd be looked at harder. Not saying Rich is scum but he still could be though the point that FF hasnt posted his normal amount stands out. I've also seen him at the bottom of the board but no posts from him last night and this morning.
 
Chill... the rest of the town has either started to smoke crack again, or they bumped their heads, so I'm just going to adress this to you. I'm tired after a long day that wasn't planned to be long, so rather than going back to pull posts, I'm going to try and explain what I see. If you think I'm full of it, please shoot me. But I'm trusting that you'll take it in and process it in your usual fashion, despite how much the town seems to suspect me.


Ice has suspected me from the beginning. I still lean him as innocent, he's just wrong. It happens, and he's not able to see it (or admit it) himself when it does. The mafia saw this. They didn't jump on me right away. In fact, I thought it was odd in the beginning how few people mentioned me on their lists since I usually show up early as a suspect... especially when I'm vocal. They were waiting.

Before nightfall, Tay asked me what I thought about Kash's mistake. Afterward, my answer would be called non-committal. I don't think so at all. I was simply committed to the fact that I wasn't sure at the time. After nightfall, Pappy comes in talking about how Kash could have been distancing from Rich with her case, blah blah blah. Then a few minutes later, he accuses me, with the non-committal thing. Again, I wasn't being non-committal. I was being honest that I wasn't sure what to think of it. It was however a great way to make me look bad.

This whole thing was set up by Tay before nightfall. I believe I had posted earlier in the thread that I wasn't sure what to think about Kash. I never am. So I would have held off on the shot, being that a mistake would have lost the game.

It's only after Pappy makes his accusation of me that Tay comes in with something like: boy, I'm glad I asked JB that question about Kash... yeah, real convenient, right? To me, this seems like a classic "Pap-trap" executed not by Pappy, but by a combination of Pappy and Tay. My guess is he came up with it in the scum-den, and Tay carried it out. Brilliantly I might add.

Then we have Rich, who has played Mr. Grumpy Guy for a good part of the game. I've been suspecting him the whole time. All of the sudden after nightfall, he also jumps on the "lets shoot JB" bandwagon for no real reason that I can tell. Granted, I skimmed; and I'm not taking the time to go back and re-read it all right now.

So, with Kash being known-scum, we have Pappy throwing out that she could be distancing from Rich (which seems pretty darn Kash-esque to me, then totally letting go of that for the total :bs: case on me. Tay and Rich come in to back him up... all the while, and innocent Ice sitting in front of his computer with a cold compress on his shoulder which he sprained patting himself on the back.

So, at this point, I'm pretty darn sure of Rich, Pappy, and Tay. As much as I want to put Ice on the list, I just don't think a scummy Pappy would go far enough to name another scum as innocent, when he could lead Ice along by the nose by calling him innocent. Look how well it worked too, Ice has pretty much considered Pappy innocent from the time the invest came out. There was lip-service to "it could be a ploy", but he doesn't seem to have really considered it.

For the last, I'm still torn between FF and Jspigs. FF has been pretty quiet, and Spigs just seems to be playing a really interesting game for a newb. At one moment seeming to have a decent grasp on the game, then at others just seeming to follow the crowd.

Summary:

Pappy: barely mentioned suspecting me the whole game, then seems to be pretty sure based on a weak case.

Tay: asks me about Kash, never mentions a word about me being suspect due to my answer until after Pappy comes out with his accusation... then she seems pretty sure too.

Rich: I don't think I've been on one of his lists the whole game, then he comes out with me as his next shot... because I usually turn up high on people's lists... or some other such non-sense.

It doesn't add up... unless they are all evil or high.

That being said. I'm not going to spend my time defending myself against all the ways this post will be torn apart, and I'll be going out of town tomorrow, so it works out well anyway. I'll be checking in on my phone and if you have questions, Chill; I'll do my best to get on and answer them. Make what you will of this, and trust your gut. You've shown that it's reliable.

Like I said... if you feel I'm scummy, shoot me... so I can shoot Pappy. There would be a fair ammount of catharsis in that for me anyway. :rolleyes:

Have a good night, ACville. I don't envy the withdrawal symptoms you'll be feeling in the morning when what ever you took wears off...

This was JB's big post of the day...

This whole case against pappy and tay seems weak at first, but when you think about it and pappys response to it (below) it makes you think, or at least it made me think. Pappys reason for think JB is scummy is weak, based on JB not being commental. Sad. I wasn't ready to call either of them scum at this point, but then i read pappys defensive posts.

JB that's the biggest bunch of OMGUS :bs: I've ever seen...

1) I never trust you. Saying that you answered honestly means nothing when the fact of the matter is that you were flat out asked what you thought of Kash and you just did the "ehh, I can see both sides" AFTER Kash went ape poop all over Tay, LG, and Rich. You had nothing to say about any of that?

2) I cannot find where you mentioned being unsure about Kash until you were asked by Tay. You said she was one of the three off of the list Ice had us pick off of but other than that I don't see where...maybe you can find it...

3) Where's the trap? I commented on two posts you made before the shot that when I considered the fact that Kash flipped scum I thought were worth commenting on. I insinuated that maybe you and Kash were in cahoots but I fail to see me trying to trap anyone.

4) I NEVER let go of the idea that Kash and Rich were distancing. Please show me where...I have Rich saying I jumped on that idea with Ice and you saying that I let go of it to go after you. WTF? Are you two reading the same thread here?

5) You never put me on a suspect list, so does that make you scum too? How hypocritical to say that I must be mafia because I never suspected you when you're doing the same...trying to jump last minute on me.

Overall, a very nice appeal to emotion, especially the part about Ice being crippled and me leading him by the nose. You should be a writer JB. I'd buy your fantasy stories...:rolleyes:

That was pappys super defensive post. 5 different reasons it was wrong, wow, someones scared.

Rich, again, can you read? I'm not trying to be personal here but honestly I already pointed out that I NEVER MADE A DECISION.

Here is what I said...

"At this point if I'm wondering if Kash's long winded "case" on Rich really was a last ditch attempt to distance cause she knew she was going down or if she was trying to draw the shot to him or just bring down an innocent either way."

I list three possible scenarios. Where in that do you get the idea that I already picked #1.

Then more defense, against Rich this time.

Not sure what I want to ask today but let's start with this:

I know some of you had commented on this all ready but for those who didn't Do you think Kash was going all out for the win or was she trying to ensure the team win by building some cred for her team?

I also don't have a read on Dag. If memory serves I only played with him twice and both times I read him wrong, so if anyone has any thoughts on Dag so far this game can you post them? Sorry Dag not picking on you just trying to be thorough.

Well it looked to me like she was going for the win, but this is kashta, so she was probably trying to go for the win AND set up her team for victory. Lets see who she didn't accuse: I don't think pappy was in her lists of scum. Also, as far as i know, neither was JB. Could be that she didn't care, but i find that hard to believe, so i would have to say that both may be on her team. Then i have to say that if pappys on her team then Ice may be as well.

Now, my thoughts so far are that:

Rich is a grumpy guy this game, but also that the last bit with kashta where she tried to get him shot was last minute distancing.

Pappy is too defensive of late. When JB's big post came in, he came up with 5 reasons it was wrong, after saying it was BS. Since when does BS = superdefense?

JB: That big post, when i first saw it i though "Bs with some possible facts" but when Pappy got defesive i went back and re-read it. He makes a valid point about Tay and Pappys reason for calling him scum. Pretty weak on their part.

Tay, you need to get a better reason for calling JB scum then "Well, his opinion about kashta was non-commental". Thats a very weak argument. Funny how pappy agreed with you and you came back and said "Im glad i brought that up".

FF: just a tiny bit upsett that no one think he can control himself...

Ice: If Pappy is evil, he is much more likely to be evil., but pappy could have still told the truth to get someone to think he was inocnet. I bet Ice is thinking "What mafia guy would say im innocent?" Well, Pappy would if it ment getting you to think hes innocent too.

Hay: Pretty quiet, quietest one left... Thinks that LG is evil dispite being against Kashta. I sorta aggree, LG did sorta jump on the bandwagon when Tay brought up Kashta's mistake. Seems like she was distancing, and was told to keep with it.

Dag: Agrees with ive that kashta put at least one teammate on her list, either me of JS. Since i know my role, i would say JS. Also, he thinks thank Kashta was setting up her team. Nothing really scummy from him.

LG: Seems to me that she just rode along the Kash bandwagon when Tay noticed Kashta's slip. Not cool, probably distancing.

JS : Seems to me that JS was slipping early in the game, but now hes gotten much better. Been choached or learnt as he went?

Chill: Good Aim!

All in all, my list consists of

LG:Seems to have been a follower in the whole kash thing. Distancing.
Pappy: Superdefensive, came up with 5 reasons a "BS" post was wrong.
JS:Seems to be coached.
Tay:Granted, tay did bring up the Kashta thing, but tay also brought up how "non-commental" JB was on it. And then ran away with it.
Rich: Kashta may have been distancing with her last couple posts where she included him.
 
I have to run to go to work but to answer your questions.

Dag, I always have a hard time reading him and with his limited posting this game it has made it harder. I have him as a suspect because it works out with my thoughts on others. I'd have to go back and pull his posts for more concrete evidence if there is any.

As for lists I think they pretty much got forced into having to list 2 players if FF or Rich are scum. They needed to stay blended and to differ in opinion would out them. If you had chose say Rich instead of Kash and he was scum and they didn't list him they'd be looked at harder. Not saying Rich is scum but he still could be though the point that FF hasnt posted his normal amount stands out. I've also seen him at the bottom of the board but no posts from him last night and this morning.


I would like to clear this up. My stepbrother and stepsister go to school now. So my dad set the internet to, while not shut off, block us from doing anything after 9. I didn't close the tabs, but i couldn't post or read anything from 9PM till 5AM. I have posted now though.
 
Is that what you meant to say FF or is there some typo that's confusing me?
"Rich is a grumpy guy this game, but also that the last bit with kashta where she tried to get him shot was last minute distancing. "
 
Chill... the rest of the town has either started to smoke crack again, or they bumped their heads, so I'm just going to adress this to you. I'm tired after a long day that wasn't planned to be long, so rather than going back to pull posts, I'm going to try and explain what I see. If you think I'm full of it, please shoot me. But I'm trusting that you'll take it in and process it in your usual fashion, despite how much the town seems to suspect me.


Ice has suspected me from the beginning. I still lean him as innocent, he's just wrong. It happens, and he's not able to see it (or admit it) himself when it does. The mafia saw this. They didn't jump on me right away. In fact, I thought it was odd in the beginning how few people mentioned me on their lists since I usually show up early as a suspect... especially when I'm vocal. They were waiting.

Before nightfall, Tay asked me what I thought about Kash's mistake. Afterward, my answer would be called non-committal. I don't think so at all. I was simply committed to the fact that I wasn't sure at the time. After nightfall, Pappy comes in talking about how Kash could have been distancing from Rich with her case, blah blah blah. Then a few minutes later, he accuses me, with the non-committal thing. Again, I wasn't being non-committal. I was being honest that I wasn't sure what to think of it. It was however a great way to make me look bad.

This whole thing was set up by Tay before nightfall. I believe I had posted earlier in the thread that I wasn't sure what to think about Kash. I never am. So I would have held off on the shot, being that a mistake would have lost the game.

It's only after Pappy makes his accusation of me that Tay comes in with something like: boy, I'm glad I asked JB that question about Kash... yeah, real convenient, right? To me, this seems like a classic "Pap-trap" executed not by Pappy, but by a combination of Pappy and Tay. My guess is he came up with it in the scum-den, and Tay carried it out. Brilliantly I might add.

Then we have Rich, who has played Mr. Grumpy Guy for a good part of the game. I've been suspecting him the whole time. All of the sudden after nightfall, he also jumps on the "lets shoot JB" bandwagon for no real reason that I can tell. Granted, I skimmed; and I'm not taking the time to go back and re-read it all right now.

So, with Kash being known-scum, we have Pappy throwing out that she could be distancing from Rich (which seems pretty darn Kash-esque to me, then totally letting go of that for the total :bs: case on me. Tay and Rich come in to back him up... all the while, and innocent Ice sitting in front of his computer with a cold compress on his shoulder which he sprained patting himself on the back.

So, at this point, I'm pretty darn sure of Rich, Pappy, and Tay. As much as I want to put Ice on the list, I just don't think a scummy Pappy would go far enough to name another scum as innocent, when he could lead Ice along by the nose by calling him innocent. Look how well it worked too, Ice has pretty much considered Pappy innocent from the time the invest came out. There was lip-service to "it could be a ploy", but he doesn't seem to have really considered it.

For the last, I'm still torn between FF and Jspigs. FF has been pretty quiet, and Spigs just seems to be playing a really interesting game for a newb. At one moment seeming to have a decent grasp on the game, then at others just seeming to follow the crowd.

Summary:

Pappy: barely mentioned suspecting me the whole game, then seems to be pretty sure based on a weak case.

Tay: asks me about Kash, never mentions a word about me being suspect due to my answer until after Pappy comes out with his accusation... then she seems pretty sure too.

Rich: I don't think I've been on one of his lists the whole game, then he comes out with me as his next shot... because I usually turn up high on people's lists... or some other such non-sense.

It doesn't add up... unless they are all evil or high.

That being said. I'm not going to spend my time defending myself against all the ways this post will be torn apart, and I'll be going out of town tomorrow, so it works out well anyway. I'll be checking in on my phone and if you have questions, Chill; I'll do my best to get on and answer them. Make what you will of this, and trust your gut. You've shown that it's reliable.

Like I said... if you feel I'm scummy, shoot me... so I can shoot Pappy. There would be a fair ammount of catharsis in that for me anyway. :rolleyes:

Have a good night, ACville. I don't envy the withdrawal symptoms you'll be feeling in the morning when what ever you took wears off...

I actually didn't ask what you thought of her mistake. I asked what you thought of her latest posts. Her story had been changing and I think every vet would have jumped on that if they were around. You were the only one around at the time so I wanted to see what you had to say.

I'm glad you think I'm capable of it but, it was never meant as a set up. I did want to see what you had to say, which was not much. At that point in the game I didn't find you to be that scummy. I thought your reason for pegging me scummy was hella weak and based on ridiculous things. Did you really think a :P was scummy?

I guess it's convenient for you to say that I only came in after Pap mentioned our earlier discussion. That was my first post after I read the outcome and I can't change that it's when I found out. First you say this was all set up by me and in your very next paragraph you add that Pap set it up and I carried it out. Which is it?
 
Is that what you meant to say FF or is there some typo that's confusing me?
"Rich is a grumpy guy this game, but also that the last bit with kashta where she tried to get him shot was last minute distancing. "

"Rich is a grumpy guy this game, and that last bit with kashta where she tried to get him shot was probably last minute distancing." Thats what it was supposed to read. And thats how i see it, if you think its a scummy way to see things, then shoot me, i can handle the gun (i hope)

FF, was I supposed to just ignore Jb's crap of a post? Seriously...

Chill, I will hopefully get to your questions later when I have more time to reflect.

Well no, but 5 reasons it was wrong seems a little overkill to me.
 
Not sure what I want to ask today but let's start with this:

I know some of you had commented on this all ready but for those who didn't Do you think Kash was going all out for the win or was she trying to ensure the team win by building some cred for her team?

I also don't have a read on Dag. If memory serves I only played with him twice and both times I read him wrong, so if anyone has any thoughts on Dag so far this game can you post them? Sorry Dag not picking on you just trying to be thorough.

To answer your question... Kash was pretty subtle when she was getting 'jumped' on about her posts but then got worried when she was about to get shot. But yes, I do think she was giving team to build off from her death. But how? I'm still trying to figure that out.
 
"her" is ment to be in there ^
 
Wow should of proof read. Sorry. That sentence is ment to be "I do think she was giving her team something to build off from her death."
 
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