Help! Pet shop lied to us.

[allaboutfish]

Ok the "starter aquarium" I bought is an aa-aquarium one 15l). I think we are going to go for a betta as when I showed my son the picture he really reacted to it. If I do stop using the ammonia remover how do I keep the betta from being sick/dying? I've been doing 25% water changes every day to try and get levels down but ammonia is still high. With the betta should I still get a ghost shrimp or sucker fish to help keep the tank clean or will the betta just see them as a snack?

there's a couple of ways that you can make the tank safe for your fish.
1. fishless cycling- for this option you dont buy the fish yet and you either buy a raw shrimp from the grocery store or some pure ammonia. for the shrimp you put it in a pantyhose and hang it into the tank and as it decays it releases ammonia. you then test every few days until you get ammo-0, nitrite-0, and a showing of nitrate. for the pure ammonia you add enough to get 3ppm of ammonia and you test every few days and continue to dose more when it goes down until the ammonia drops to 0 in 24 hours and you dont see nitrite, but do have a showing of nitrate,
2. fish in cycling- this is where you get the fish and test atleast daily and do water changes to get rid of any ammonia or nitrite until you get ammo-0, nitrite-0, and a showing of nitrate.
3. fish in cycling with a bacteria additive- this is where you get the fish and add a bacteria additive to add the bacteria. the only one ive heard of that works it tetra safe start. all you have to do is follow the instructions, and find the additive that works.

 

[finsNfur]

I don't think 4 gallons is enough for a catfish plus other fish, etc. Four gallons is only big enough for a betta, or shrimp. I've never had luck mixing bettas with shrimp though, the betta ate them. Guppies can be a little difficult to keep if buying from a pet store, a lot of them are unhealthy. I certainly wouldn't use them to cycle a tank. Once you get a 10 gallon or larger tank, glofish would be nice.

 

[excuzzzeme]

I am saddened by the number of people replying to this and never read the original post and many of the replies.

Her tank is 15 liters NOT gallons, that means it is approximately a 4 gallon tank. She also does NOT live in the US so you will need to help her find an equivalent that might be available outside the US.

As someone suggested, the Betta is an acceptable fish for the conditions since you don't need a heater if the room stays within acctable ranges, and the fact that they are air breather saves you from needing an aerator or air operated filter. Regardless, a filter is needed unless you want to do daily water changes. My neighbor keeps her betta in a drinking glass in spite of trying to tell her that isn't appropriate. People will do all kinds of crazy things as evidenced by some of the replies here. Glofish are danios and are quite active. Regardless, I think some sort of filtration would be an asset. If you get an air operated "corner filter" the filter's air bubbles might also aid in developing concentration or be soothing during a time out. I have seizures and wathcing the air bubbles rise do seem to help calm me. I don't why it works, I just know it works for me as do slower moving fish.

Endlers, are small enough to work in that sized tank but you might have a problem with the frequent breeding. If you can get your pet store to take your fry then many other fish could also work. Endlers and guppies can actually be over-stocked (within reason). I have as many as 30-40 in a 10 gallon(38L) tank and then I net out a bunch and give them to local pet store. If you could upgrade to a 38 liter tank it would open up more options for you and still be a relatively inexpensive tank to maintain. I would suggest that a trip to your pet shop to look at one that size will help you to figure out if it is do-able for space. I know that 38L tanks are very available in the UK.

Good Luck!

 

[Nepherael]

Hmm it's interesting that there isn't prime where you are (I'm not very well travelled). I'm not gonna keep harping on it so maybe someone else here knows of a product just as good? I don't know of any product that neutralizes nitrite except prime unfortunately. Even better maybe someone on here would be courteous enough to order you a couple bottles and ship them to you nthe stuff is pretty concentrated and when you do a fish in cycle it can go fast with dosing 5x but after that it lasts for a long time

 

[nerdyrcdriver]

I am saddened by the number of people replying to this and never read the original post and many of the replies.

Her tank is 15 liters NOT gallons, that means it is approximately a 4 gallon tank. She also does NOT live in the US so you will need to help her find an equivalent that might be available outside the US.

As someone suggested, the Betta is an acceptable fish for the conditions since you don't need a heater if the room stays within acctable ranges, and the fact that they are air breather saves you from needing an aerator or air operated filter. Regardless, a filter is needed unless you want to do daily water changes. My neighbor keeps her betta in a drinking glass in spite of trying to tell her that isn't appropriate. People will do all kinds of crazy things as evidenced by some of the replies here. Glofish are danios and are quite active. Regardless, I think some sort of filtration would be an asset. If you get an air operated "corner filter" the filter's air bubbles might also aid in developing concentration or be soothing during a time out. I have seizures and wathcing the air bubbles rise do seem to help calm me. I don't why it works, I just know it works for me as do slower moving fish.

Endlers, are small enough to work in that sized tank but you might have a problem with the frequent breeding. If you can get your pet store to take your fry then many other fish could also work. Endlers and guppies can actually be over-stocked (within reason). I have as many as 30-40 in a 10 gallon(38L) tank and then I net out a bunch and give them to local pet store. If you could upgrade to a 38 liter tank it would open up more options for you and still be a relatively inexpensive tank to maintain. I would suggest that a trip to your pet shop to look at one that size will help you to figure out if it is do-able for space. I know that 38L tanks are very available in the UK.

Good Luck!

I mentioned about 4g in post 11. I am kind of questioning if you read the entire thread, most of the post about more active fish and stuff are because PrettyKitty was planning on upgrading to a larger tank after realizing that 4g was not suitable for much. But the room the tank would be in isnt ready yet, and moving a larger tank is quite a project even for say a 10g.

 

[excuzzzeme]

I mentioned about 4g in post 11. I am kind of questioning if you read the entire thread, most of the post about more active fish and stuff are because PrettyKitty was planning on upgrading to a larger tank after realizing that 4g was not suitable for much. But the room the tank would be in isn't ready yet, and moving a larger tank is quite a project even for say a 10g.

Actually I did and I did see where 4 gal was mentioned. I also saw where she mentions limitations and that's is why I suggest going down and looking at a 38l tank instead of just talking about one. I too have had special needs child and I fully identify with some of the things she is going through. We can all attest to pet stores not being the best source for information but when you have nothing else..............

I also saw mentioned some very good possibilities. The question comes in as what is available to her? I remember BlueRat (England) and Stella (also England) mentioning that many of our products here are not available due to strict laws as to what they deem dangerous chemicals. Too bad they aren't in here enough anymore to help Kitty with what is the best.

Not having a room ready yet is great as it let's her plan the decor of the room and what will fit where before it becomes more crowded than raindrop in a snowstorm.LOL Why is it that when you plan these rooms you never have enough room?

 

[JamieMonster]

Hello again- I looked for the aquarium kit that you bought, and unfortunately I can't find it on the net. I think there is some confusion going on as to if your set up has a filter, or does not. Is there a way that you could take a pic of your set-up and post it here so we can all see what you're working with? So far, from my opinion, it is looking like a male betta and maybe 1 mystery snail would be your best bet for that tank. If the set up already has a filter- awesome- if not, there are several people here who could help suggest one to get for it, that will reduce the amount of water changes you will need to do to keep a fish happy and healthy in your tank. A lot of them are VERY cheap options, like a very small air pump, and what is called a sponge filter. As already suggested, the bubbles from an air pump are probably something your son would thoroughly enjoy (good call, there!)- I know all of the ASD students from my classrooms have ALWAYS loved blowing bubbles as a sensory break... the bubbles in the tank would provide the same stimulation. Very soothing for individuals with ASD. Decorations that provide movement, run by a small air pump may also be beneficial in the starter tank, since there will be less movement provided by the fish. The only thing you have to look out for with keeping a betta, is if the tank does have a small filter, and it is the kind that hangs off the back, and makes like a waterfall going back into the tank, bettas don't like too much current, as they aren't super strong swimmers- the current from the water return on that type of filter plus an air pump may be too much for him. That being said- you don't HAVE to use the filter that came with the starter kit, if you would prefer to have bubbles as therapy. Here, a small air pump, sufficient for that tank, is like $5 and a sponge filter would run you maybe another $3. So, yeah- show us what you're working with, and let us know what your goal is, and I am sure you will get plenty of suggestions that will get your tank set up nicely, and to be something your son will truly enjoy.

 

[ska d]

I personally would not put anything in a 4 gallon.. unfortunately these enclosures are sold yet are not really practical for any type of fish.. a guppy or a betta may survive in it but I'm pretty dead set against putting any animal in something so small.

Have you considered ghost shrimp? They're very interesting to watch and their bio load is minuscule.

I have kept a betta and a julie Cory cat for 2 years in a 5 gal. Recently donated my Betta to the local school so I could put my dwarf pea puffer in there. He was getting out competed for food in another tank. Now he is super happy.

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[ska d]

Ok the "starter aquarium" I bought is an aa-aquarium one 15l). I think we are going to go for a betta as when I showed my son the picture he really reacted to it. If I do stop using the ammonia remover how do I keep the betta from being sick/dying? I've been doing 25% water changes every day to try and get levels down but ammonia is still high. With the betta should I still get a ghost shrimp or sucker fish to help keep the tank clean or will the betta just see them as a snack?

Seems like your getting lots of conflicting info. Yes leaving the ammonia remover in there will convert ammonia to ammonium (lot less toxic to fish) problem is when ph fluctuates which it probably will with water changes and tendency to drop at night the ammonium is converted back to ammonia and there's your dead fish. Prime(or similar product) should be used as a tap water conditioner. If you want to add a new fish such as a betta right away, look for a product that aids with new tank syndrome (which sounds like what you are going through). The same company that makes Prime also makes a product called Stability. Now having said that, the problem with these kinds of bacteria kick start products is shelf life. Here in Canada Nutrafin Cycle is manufactured here so I tend to use that, although I have used Stability with great success. Find a forum online for suggestions on products manufactured closest to you and try to purchase that. Obey the instructions to a T regardless of water tests. One more thing, a Betta and shrimp will get along like clams. In fact your betta will display its fins and gills and keep your son entertained immensely, and won't have the shrimp as a snack. Keep it simple and be patient, something fish keeping has taught me. Its a learning curve and your right at the top, so should be down hill (stream) from here. Good luck.

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[Slappy*McFish]

Once Prime binds with and converts the free ammonia to ammonium, it is permanent and cannot be undone by pH. During the 24 hrs that Prime is active in the water, this bound ammonium will be consumed by the bio-filter and/or plants.