Aeration in planted tank

D

Dave Cushing

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Jul 31, 2003
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Is it a good idea to use a bubbler in a planted tank? So far I will not be having a CO2 system, but that may change in the future though.

I posted in the Newbie section all the specs for the tank I am setting up, but for those who only read here:

50 gal
Central/South American plants
Soft Water
Neutral to slighty acidic pH

More details can be seen here http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14251

I am getting all this setup so I am looking for any reccomendations I can get. Already, I have increased the lighting in my tank thanks to the advice of the posters here.

Thanks

Dave
 
No I wouldnt add an airstone or bubbler into a planted tank. You want as little surface agitation as possible, as it will gas-out whatever Co2 you have in there. If your plants are doing well, they will provide oxygen to the water for your fish.
 
In a non-injected tank CO2 will be added to the tank through gas exchange by aerating the tank and good water movement. Keep in mind that the CO2 concentrations in a non-injected tank are quite low 'Gassing off' occurs in CO2 saturated water. Aerating it will actually draw gas into the tank from the atmosphere(minimal though it may be).
I'm sure someone will correct me on this, but I believe we're talking about somewhere between 2 - 4ppm CO2 in the atmosphere.
Len
 
A question for you Dave. I noticed you are using Flora Base by Red Sea in combination with Flourite, as a substrate.
Can you tell us about it? How do you like it? How does it affect CO2 concentrations in the water table(if at all)?
Len
 
Good questions, Len. I have asked about Flora Base in a different post!
 
Good questions, but no answers yet. I haven't set up the aquarium yet, I have been getting some good comments on my other port in the Newbie forum which has caused me to change a couple of things, like adding more light. My LFS owner swears by it though. It is all he uses and sells.

This now has caused a debate on whether I should use a CO2 injection system. I will pose this to the plant experts:

50 gal tank (36L x 15W x 21H)
2 x 96w PC Lights

Substrate 24 lbs Red Sea Flora Base
7 lbs Flourite

I am going to keep soft water fish (Angels, Swordfish, and Tetra's)

Plants are all Souh/Central American (Vals, Swords, Anacharis, Cabomba)

Will I need to increase the amount of CO2 in solution?

Red Sea advertises that no further injection is needed, but I am leary of believing advertising.

If everyone thinks CO2 is needed, is a DIY setup reliable, or should I set up a pressurized tank system? Since I am still in the setup phase, I would prefer to do things right the first time.


Dave
 
I don't know whether buffering(for lack of a better word) water down is a good mix with CO2 injection or not. I tend to think not.
The claim that, "no further injection is needed"......what does that mean? Needed to lower pH?
As a fellow aquarist said on another forum, "we do not add CO2 merely to lower pH, but to add carbon to the water table".
And I don't know what the substrate does to buffer the water.
In any event, with all that light, unless you are holding 22 - 28ppm CO2 you may be looking at some algae issues in the not too distant future.
IMO, in a 50 gal. tank a DIY system is not going to do it for you. I would never go back to using DIY in any tank above 30 - 35 gals. It wore me out, and was too inconsistent and unreliable.
Just my opinion. Others, I'm sure will differ.
What is you pH/kH ratio?
Len
 
Don't have any water in the tank yet to get a ratio. I am still planning and building the infrastructure. What ratio do you recommend shooting for?


I am convinced that a CO2 system is necessary. I was doing some internet reading and it seems to be the concensus. I agree that a DIY source is high maintenance. I was thinking though of building my own reactor, and using a gas bottle as the source. I was reading another post about a DIY reactor made from PVC. I know PVC has a tendency to leak chemicals over time. Does anybody have experience with this?


Dave
 
At your light intensity, there is no way this will add enough carbon to prevent the plants from going after the CO2 in the water. This will drive the pH up. CO2 is an acid and the plants will remove it most all it enough to effect the pH.

Now if you had say, 60-90w on the tank, then it might work okay/well etc.

Anyway, adding CO2 will help no matter what. Expecting the substrate and fish to do everything is not realistic unless you have slower growth and non CO2 methods/low light etc.

Whether you want to use CO2 is up to your goal with plants. They will grow better with CO2. Even at lower levels, but it's not "required" at low levels.

Slower plant growth is better achievced by lowering light, not trying to add CO2 to the substrate.

CO2 gas tanks are easy and require little maintenance once set up.
You prune the plants more but selling off the cuttings can make it very worth while.
A gas tank, reg, needle valve will run about 125$.
Cost 8-15$ to fill(about 2-3 years with your tank) and you can branch off this system for another 15$ for another valve for each new plant tank with CO2 you might want later.

Regards,
Tom Barr
 
Tom,

Either my brain is scrambled because I'm tired or you left some words out.

Are you saying that at the lighting levels I have, that the substrate (Flora Base) will not add enough carbon and that the plants would start removing it from the water? This would cause the carbonic acid in the water to disassociate back to CO2 and water, thereby raising the pH.

This kind of answers other questions I had. It probably means that the CO2 settings are different for each tank setup, and a rule of thumb based on concentration is probably the best.

I have seen a concentration of between 20 - 25 ppm is optimal. Is this you r experience?

Thanks

Dave
 
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