Angels, Silver Dollars & bichir in African cichlid tank?

There is never a guarantee that any combination will work, depending on the individuals. Even schooling tetras can have problems with each other.

So before I try to mix anything I should have success with them individually?

That combination should be fine. As with any combination, you need to be ready and able to deal with any problems. So if it doesn't work be willing to seperate or return some. A good eye at detecting signs of aggression before they are extremely bad is good too. This way there is minimum damage before measures can be taken.
 
Though Bichirs are from Africa they are a soft water low pH species. They wouldn't do well in the hard water high Ph needed for Rift Cichlids. Not to mention the aggression issue.

It might could be done but most of the cichlids on that list are SA/CA cichlids and not Africans.

I keep my Bichirs with 2 Ctenopoma acutirostre (http://www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/Fishindx/cteno-ac.htm) 2 clown loaches and 5 Western Australian Rainbows.

Larger Bichirs like the ornate might work with Africans as they prefer harder water and a higher pH.
 
Almost all species of fish common in the hobby are fine in almost any tap water as long as it is stable and the water quality is high. Bichirs are a hardy genus and most have pretty wide ranges for pH. Check with fishbase.org to see accurate natural parameters, distributions, and max sizes.
 
Species and sizes
maximum known sizes often smaller in captivity
Upper Jaw Species-Upper jaw protrudes past lower jaw
P. palmas palmas ('palmas' bichir)- 13"
(subspecies)P. palmas polli ('marbled bichir)- 14"
(subspecies) P. palmas buettikoferi ('buettikoferi' bichir)- 13"
P. ornatipinnis ('ornate' bichir)- 27"
P. delhezi ('armoured' or 'delhez's' bichir)- 14"
P. senegalus senegalus ('Senegal' or 'Cuiver's' bichir)- 12"
(possible subspecies)P. senegalus meridionalis- 12"+
There is, Also the possibility of a third member of the Polypterus senegalus
group that is found in the Nile River
P. retropinnis ('retropinnis' bichir)- 14"
P .mokelembembe
P. weeksi ('week's' bichir)- 20"
P.teugelsi (found only in the Cross river)-16.75''
E. calabaricus ('Ropefish')- 15"-30" (Closer to 15''-20'' in captivity)

Lower Jaw Species-Lower protrudes past upper jaw
P. endlicheri endlicheri ('saddled' or 'red' bichir)- 32", possibly more
(subspecies)P. endlicheri congicus ('giant' or 'congo' bichir)- 39"
P. Bichir lapradei ('Lapradei' bichir)- 24"
P. bichir bichir-30+ ''
P.ansorgii-28-30''+

There are a couple of as-yet-undescribed (scientifically) Polypterids

Variations
There are variations of the above including
short bodied:
longfinned:Polypterus senegalus and reports of long finned ornates and P.p.polli
albinoism:Albino Polypterids have a pink/ white body with red eyes if they are a species with pronounced markings
these are often yellowish in color
leustic:Leustic (platinum) are silver/whitish bodies with black eyes.

Water chemistry
In their natural occuring range West and Central African rivers,lakes and swamps
bichirs are found in water conditions varying in pH values between 6.5 to almost 9.0.
And water hardness varying between2dH to almost 20dH.
And tempuratures ranging from mid 70'sF to mid 80'sF
with a dissolved oxygen content between 3.3 parts per 1000 by volume
and 2.50 parts per 1000 by volume.
3.3 parts per 1000 by volume is common in aqauria kept at 75 F
These water parameters will flucuate thruought the year as dry season gives
way to the rainy season and rivers rise and swamps flood often lowering water temps
for short peroids of time.As you can see they are tolerant of a wide range of water
conditions.
Brackish bichirs?
Bichirs are freshwater fish and, though some are found in rivers near where they empty into the ocean, the water they inhabit is fully fresh.
Polypterus ornatipinnis and Polypterus e.congicus are sometimes found in Lake Tanganyika which has hard, alkaline water but are rarely, if ever, found in the lake itself. Instead, they inhabit the swampy areas where river water empties into the lake proper.
 
Wow - thanks so much for all of the info. You're describing combinations that I didn't think were possible because of water type.

Here's what I exactly have:

20 G set up 3 years ago - 2 silver dollars, 1 angel and 1 bichir - they all get along great, no nipping, no chasing - we feed flakes, blood worms, brine shrimp to all, and an occasional chunk of raw chicken to the bichir. My husband adopted the tank when I started traveling a lot for work, and for some reason he removed all decor except a couple of small plastic plants and a small little rock, so there's no place to hide. But again, they are a peaceful bunch.

55 G set up as rift lake tank 8 mos ago - 3 peacock females (1 may be a sub-dominant male), 1 peacock male, 1 blue hap male, 1 taiwan reef male, 1 blue dolphin, 1 small pleco, 3 6-week old peacock babies, and a breeder box with 30 peacock fry that were spat out Tuesday.

I don't NEED to move fish from the 20, but was intrigued when I saw the list on the bichir thread because I had no idea that you could put anything but African cichlids in the rift tank. The guy at the fish store didn't tell me, and I didn't ask! Would LOVE to see the silver dollars in there...

For now, since everyone seems happy and thriving where they are, I'm going to leave them alone. I'm going to try to raise the fry to trade-in size in a 10-gal.

It sounds like compatible water conditions are the most important, and that maybe fish like bichirs and angels can get along. Maybe age and order of introduction help? The silver dollars are the oldest, then the angel, and the bichir is the newest.

Anyway, thanks again for the info!
Diane in SC
 
"20 G set up 3 years ago - 2 silver dollars, 1 angel and 1 bichir - they all get along great, no nipping, no chasing - we feed flakes, blood worms, brine shrimp to all, and an occasional chunk of raw chicken to the bichir. My husband adopted the tank when I started traveling a lot for work, and for some reason he removed all decor except a couple of small plastic plants and a small little rock, so there's no place to hide. But again, they are a peaceful bunch."


actually, this tank is too small for adults of these species.

a single angel in a 20 might work possibly a breeding pair(tho IMO that might be pushing it)
but not all the inhabitants you have.. the silver dollars would get too big for a 20.
if you have seen an adult angel that is 8-10 yrs old you may discover a 20 might be too small for this single fish.
 
reptileguy2727 said:
So before I try to mix anything I should have success with them individually?
Click to expand...

there's no need to put words in my mouth, I didn't say that.

its not a good idea to mix fish you havn't kept before - how are you supposed to know what constitutes normal behaviour and what requires management. Before it is thrown out there as proof that this is incorrect, the standard community tank is excepted as are any other combination of known non-aggressive fish.

there's a big difference between a school of neon tetras sorting out their issues and a tank with Peacocks, a Bichir and a Silver Dollar involved.
 
I had a feeing that it would be hard for someone to resist commenting on the obvious problem with this tank - congrats on your swiftness! 17 minutes...

I was given the 55 & a 75 by a friend, and will be setting up the 75 on my new porch as soon as it's finished - walls are up, tile is set, just waiting for glass in the windows. Apparently, my house does not have enough support under the floors to support the 75 - I have the 55 set up against a corner, but my husband says the 75 is just too heavy. The porch is on a concrete slab, so it will be fine there. It'll be another month or so.

The first occupants will be the silver dollars and angel. They will be joined by others, species to be determined. Can't wait! this porch is going to alleviate the crowding in that tank, the crowding in my bathtub (I'm moving myself to a 5-person hottub!) and the crowding in my bathroom - my 6 orchids currently take up all surface space, but will have plenty of room on the porch. We'll all thrive in steamy splendor... ;)
 
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